08-12-2002 05:07									#1
	Oh my Heavenly God... Increase Your PM Length

I took the Future Era Start Scenario and modded it to allow up to 24 civs instead of it's default 12 or the Civ III max of 16 and played a game...

Full Random Tiny Map/24 civs/Regent/1.14 PtW

I draw Japan and immediately pumping Riflemen out. I pump three out, then go on Settler, Settler, 'Rax, Settler...just in case I can poach empty land after my Riflemen "gambit". India, Persia, Rome and the Aztecs are around me, and once the initial culture expansion hits, there is no land to be found..AT ALL. I meet 8 civs as I'm attacking India and Persia and before long the whole map, which turns out to be one big continent, is like a paint by numbers drawing. The array of color was mind boggling, so much so I had to put "Color Blind Help" on to determine who was who as the colors were mixing me up

I eliminate India and Persia mighty quick to get some expansion room and by now plop my settlers down and have three cities before any AI civ has two. Once my 'Rax is complete, I can now afford making Vet units which could make this a very easy game given its circumstances. I manage to get Saltpeter, Rubber and Coal but only one of each. Then I notice something as I'm scouting and making everyone annoyed..Germany has Oil and Rubber..that can only mean one thing...Panzers.

Germany declares war on one of its neighbors...Babylon and a few turns later, they're gone. Suddenly..I get about 5-6 prompt boxes about all these civs declaring war. This is lunacy.

I mass Riflemen and thankfully now I have MI and three thriving cities with 'Rax in each of them. Civs are getting destroyed left and right and eventually, I truly come to grips with what is going on and fight what I call "The Great Survival Instinct"..it's Kill or Be Killed.

I focus on the fledgling Aztecs and their slow moving neighbor the Chinese, and begin against them. Germany has taken out 5 civs already with it's Panzers and has a pretty good empire growing. I guess it took all the cities from its conquerings. I notice France is battling the Ottomans and Arabs, and the Greeks are fighting the Celts. The world is in an uproar. The Otto's and Arabs sign and MPP and drag in the Vikings, who band together to eliminate France.

I'm keeping an eye on Germany as I try to flood my borders with units. Then the inevitable...

Germany and England have a military alliance to destroy us!!!

Their panzers run over my Riflemen and Guerillas and sack my now 4 city empire down to my capital. Two turns later..I'm dead!!

But what a battle. It's like being caught in the worst place possible and fighting tooth and nail to get out. Imagine that on Deity?? so if anyone wants to try this, I recommend it

But make sure you don't change any rules. Open the Future Era Start Scenario with the editor and go to the scenario properties, allow 24 civs, and then go to player properties and make sure every civ starts in the Future Age And just click "Save"

	08-12-2002 05:11									#2
	Full PM-box? Change here!

WOW!!!

	08-12-2002 07:23									#3
	Got spare money?

Sounds like fun

	09-12-2002 04:32									#4
	Tired of ads?

Post a screenshot, it sounds very interesting.

	09-12-2002 10:55									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Cool. Consider trying it elimination once?

	09-12-2002 11:42									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Modern start with 24 civs (26 for me cause I added Inca and Austria-Hungary) on tiny map rules. I like it when Germany gets oil and rubber... it makes it fun. I think in Modern/Future starts that are overpopulated, best traits are, in order:

Militaristic (Vets are key. If you don't have any of a key resource, particularly rubber, you need to beat em quickly before they get good defense)

Scientific (Starting out ahead in Science is pretty important)

Religious (Get out of Despotism and build that culture. A fast cathedral lets you be lazy on culture for the rest of the game.)

Commercial (Simply because Industrious and Expansionist traits are mostly useless in this case)

Industrious (You won't have many cities anyway, so the worker bonus doesn't really help)

Expansionist (Its so crowded that you can't use your scout anyway.)


As you can see, Germany has a huge advantage. Best traits, best UU. Ottomans actually have second best, because it can be produced more easily than the F-15. America might not get aluminum and oil, but SP and Horses are easy. Hence the Ottomans will have an easier time with their GA. Cossacks may even be better than F-15. After that, it goes backward chronologically pretty much, with the most useless UUs being Hwacha and JW. (No GA for Hwacha, and it's obsolete)

I'm playing a game as the Aztecs right now on deity. I haven't lost a tank yet. I have 12 now, and I've conquered 6 cities/4 civs.

Elimination sucks for Modern Start, because the AIs build huge numbers of reg riflemen and you can't conquer them. You just sit and build up infrastructure, and then stockpile arms, surpass them in power, then kill one. Then you repeat.

	09-12-2002 23:06									#7
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I'm in a game now on Winter Terrain with 24 civs...I'll post an SS

	10-12-2002 00:39									#8
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Here's an SS of my current 24 civ game on the Winter Terrain starting in the Future Age

Last edited by Knightblade pDM on 10-12-2002 at 01:06

	10-12-2002 00:41									#9
	Tired of ads?

Jaguar, it's much different though starting in the Future Age. If you have MI/MA and the AIs have Riflemen, it's much easier..although if they have what you have, it's a great challenge

	10-12-2002 01:23									#10
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Knight-

how is that winter terrain for playing a full game? I've only looked at it briefly. Is it easy on the eyes (a cliche I'm ashamed to use)?

In my brief 2 minutes looking at it, I had a difficult time differentiating the plains from the grasslands. Is that a problemn, or do you just get used to it?

	10-12-2002 01:38									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Knightblade, that game looks crazy! I cant wait until mac PTW comes out so I can try that.

	10-12-2002 04:22									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Asleep:

You get used to it, as in some places though you do have to right click on the questioned terrain to find out what exactly it is. I thought I settled on Plains and it was desert LOL..it is easy on the eyes.

KOTA:

It is crazy. At that point though, no civs were at war with each other. There were A LOT of MPPs going around, so if you attacked one Civ, you'd get two or three more on your back. The good thing is, if you can out expand and mass military units faster than the AI, you can take some civs out Riflemen to Riflemen..the most common unit in the Future Age unless you don't have resources to build anything else.

Most civs don't grow to 8 or 9 cities unless they assimilate/overrun other cities or poach empty land. It is a fun scenario, combining future and terrain.

I've now done it to Warpstorm's terrain an the other two Sn00py terrains

	10-12-2002 08:31									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I just tried a game like this. Keep in mind, if you mod the Future start scenario, that only the first 12 players are set to start in the future age. When I played, half the civs started with all techs, the other half started at in the ancient age. It was definitely an interesting game.

	10-12-2002 09:48									#14
	Increase the size of your Attachments

ixnay, that is so true. The first 12 were future, the next 12 were ancient, so you actually have to go through "player properties" and set up each one yourself to Future. I had the Vikes in my first game(only went one turn before I realized it) demand Masonry from me. It was then that I went through and fixed everything