10-12-2002 05:25									#1
	FAM Term 7 Candidate Debate Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

As some of you know I am stepping up and seeking your vote for the position FAM - Term 7.

I want to be clear regarding my platform, an educated democracy is a succesful democracy.

First - I will work with the SMC, President and the DM to insure that our campaign against the Germans will be sucessful. This will include obtaining all relevent and necessary MPPs and alliances that we as a nation deems in our best interest.

Second - in persuant to our great undertakings in building the ToE and Hoovers dam, I will work to RESTRICT other nations from benefiting from our hard research.

Idealy speaking,
I will support first obtaining Scientific Methods, Then immediatly Starting ToE while we research Replacable Parts. After that then Atomic Theory and Electronics. I will not allow Atomic theory to be traded until we are 5 turns away from compleation of Hoovers. I will not allow electricity to be traded untill at least 5 turns from ToE. One bonus regarding replacable parts is that we have one other non wonder tech worth trading. If all goes well, we can have mobile transportation and flight by the end of this administration while the rest of the world is researching mass production.

We are entering into a time of great trepidation. We must be careful. We want to build support for the demise of germany but do not want to give up our tenous tech lead.

I intend to WAIT until rival AIs can afford an exhorberant prices for the techs we have to sell. This requires allowing some deals to expire.

Together with the DM, we can use this time to pull away from the AI civs and insure a 2-3 tech lead.

I hope to put us so firmly ahead of the AI so that we can complete the UN as the other nations begin to enter the modern age.

Please feel free to ask any questions. This thread is for debate. Other candidates are MORE THAN welcome.

Thank you for your anticipated support

ManicStarSeed

	10-12-2002 06:36									#2
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I am currently running to keep this post.

I will be posting a campaign statement for myself, probably in the next day or so (I'm too busy with writing senate bills to forward to people at the moment).

For now, I will simply say that people can expect me to continue to meet the standards I have set for myself in the past as VP and FAM.

Thank You.

Last edited by Arnelos on 10-12-2002 at 11:54

	10-12-2002 20:49									#3
	Got spare money?

Wow, clear difference in trading positions this time, unlike the previous FAM election.

	10-12-2002 21:29									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Joncnunn said in another thread the AI is slightly ahead us in research. Can we beat the AI? How is our sci slider right now? I mean, much of your strategy depends of our tech lead. Can we achieve this? Or is this a question for the DM?

	10-12-2002 21:36									#5
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Ah, good, this will save me from having to make this thread on thursday........

	10-12-2002 21:47									#6
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Ok, so there WOULD be differences if we swapped horses today. However I figure there are 3 more turn chats and about 15 turns remaining in the current administration. We will most likely be deeply into a long drawnout WWI like scenario. But lets back up to 1240 or so. Imagine we just got Electricity, but to our ****rin Otto has snuck in with either the Corporation or Espionage and has shopped it a bit. How would you respond? (Both candidates please address)

	11-12-2002 00:55									#7
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quote: Originally posted by roadcage Ok, so there WOULD be differences if we swapped horses today. However I figure there are 3 more turn chats and about 15 turns remaining in the current administration. We will most likely be deeply into a long drawnout WWI like scenario. But lets back up to 1240 or so. Imagine we just got Electricity, but to our ****rin Otto has snuck in with either the Corporation or Espionage and has shopped it a bit. How would you respond? (Both candidates please address)

Good points... By the time I become FAM (assuming), it might be too late to effect this plan.

Going back to your scenario,
We just got Electricity, I would request (of the DM) that we study Sci. Meth. Upon tech compleation, start on Replacable parts and ToE. Do we have corporation? If we don't, I might look to trade Electricity for Corporation and Espionage (perhaps even some GPT) no sooner than 5 turns prior to the completion of ToE. By the time we finish ToE, I expect to have Atomic theory and Replacable parts, Corporation (15-20 turns or so), maybe even Electronics and espionage.
Of course this all requires close cooperation between the DM and Pres and the FAM.

However; I am at work and can not give this question due justice.

I want to look at this more closely and look at some past saves. Aro has some good points that I want to examine.

I do want to point out that war tends to hurt AI research a bit more than it will us. We have the ability to scrape and scrounge for any last drop of commerce or production as needed. The world will be at war when we are doing this. The AI will suffer greatly.

I reserve the right to revise this in whole or part once I have more and better information, later tonight when I review the last few saves.

MSS

	11-12-2002 01:36									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Funny you should mention Corporation and being shopped around a bit. It already has been. What's not so clear is which AI discovered it.

quote: Originally posted by roadcage Ok, so there WOULD be differences if we swapped horses today. However I figure there are 3 more turn chats and about 15 turns remaining in the current administration. We will most likely be deeply into a long drawnout WWI like scenario. But lets back up to 1240 or so. Imagine we just got Electricity, but to our ****rin Otto has snuck in with either the Corporation or Espionage and has shopped it a bit. How would you respond? (Both candidates please address)

	11-12-2002 01:48									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Part of the reason the AI is ahead of us in reserach is poor choice in what to reserach. Tech rate was another aspect of it though.

As I recall, we reserached to Saniatation at slightly too slow a rate.

But the reason we were beat out to Industrailization is that given we had just researched Saniation there was no way we could have researched Industrailization first. We should have instead reserached Electrcy, which we would have easily been the first to.

But after Industrailization, most of the AIs want to reserach Electrecy, and we'll be lucky if we are the first to it and in any case even if we don't sell, a second AI will discoveres it quickly.

We'll have an easier time though geting to Electronics, if we beeline for it, since the AI we be distracted by cheap techs at the top of the tree.

The bigest AI reserach power is Germany. After the war starts against them, we'll be able to make a lot of money selling techs.

quote: Originally posted by Aro Joncnunn said in another thread the AI is slightly ahead us in research. Can we beat the AI? How is our sci slider right now? I mean, much of your strategy depends of our tech lead. Can we achieve this? Or is this a question for the DM?

	11-12-2002 03:09									#10
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joncnunn,

I need a way to privately contact you... you're the only person I routinely attempt to send PM's to that has your 'poly settings set so that you can't receive PM's

Please give me some way to send you private messages.

Thanks

	11-12-2002 11:45									#11
	Some what off-topic but relevent Increase the size of your Attachments

Well what an education.... I loaded up the latest save at home. I have been running 1.29f. Electricity in 4 turns. As I am running for FAM, I figured it was time to revert back to 1.21, so I reinstalled and applied the 1.21 patch. Loaded up the save and lo and behold, electricity in 1 turn.

This is good to know...

Mss

	11-12-2002 20:24									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Who else is running for this post? Is it just MSS?

	11-12-2002 22:13									#13
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I've now turned PM settings on.

quote: Originally posted by Arnelos joncnunn, I need a way to privately contact you... you're the only person I routinely attempt to send PM's to that has your 'poly settings set so that you can't receive PM's Please give me some way to send you private messages. Thanks

	11-12-2002 22:17									#14
	Re: Some what off-topic but relevent Inflate your Upload Space

This is because starting 1.29f, the way the AI tech advantage was handeled was reveresed.

Under our current 1.21f, human research is at a constant rate, with the AI getting a research advantage at Emperor level.

Under 1.29f, AI research is at a constant rate, with the Human getting a reserach penalty on the Emperor level.

In addition, under 1.29f, the AI - AI bonus is lower than 1.21f.

This has clear implications in game play.

quote: Originally posted by ManicStarSeed Well what an education.... I loaded up the latest save at home. I have been running 1.29f. Electricity in 4 turns. As I am running for FAM, I figured it was time to revert back to 1.21, so I reinstalled and applied the 1.21 patch. Loaded up the save and lo and behold, electricity in 1 turn. This is good to know... Mss

	12-12-2002 00:28									#15
	Re: Re: Some what off-topic but relevent Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by joncnunn .... Under our current 1.21f, human research is at a constant rate, with the AI getting a research advantage at Emperor level. ....

But they still have the 4 turn cap correct?

	12-12-2002 00:46									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Actually, the min 4 turns to reserach is a human only feature in both 1.21f and 1.29f. The 40 turns max might also be a human only feature.

The AI can research a cheap tech in 3 turns under both 1.21f and 1.29f with enough science. (More likely to hapen in 1.21f.) Even an AI researching a tech in 2 turns is possible in theory but this exteremly unlikely to happen in a real game.

	12-12-2002 16:16									#17
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

hi ,

panag shall be as always the only canditate for the ministery of internal security , ....



(an other canditate is being dragged away by the internal security troops )

any-one else ?

no

good

oh by the way , anyone playing ahead lately , .........
( col secret passage no 14 reads , death to all who do so )

about science , well sliding withe science bar after a turn can result sometimes in great saves on the number of turns , .....

have a nice day