18-12-2002 20:12									#1
	I really hate programming now Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Well, after 20 years of programming computers I've
really beginning to hate it, stress, artifical deadlines
no paper manuals (CDs), just another clerk these
days.

No doubt where I working is a major factor.

Just a thought for all you computer science wantabes.

	18-12-2002 20:19									#2
	Support Apolyton

Hmmm.... So is this what I'll say 16 years from now? Not very encouraging, especially since I've just finished the project I was working on and I am not in a very good mood.

	18-12-2002 20:19									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Programming can be a real drag depending on what you are doing.

	18-12-2002 20:47									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yep, been doing it for 25 years. Screw on-line/cd manuals. I try to have paper manuals for most of the software I use. On-line services are only good when you're running into error messsages that you aren't familiar with.

Yes, where you're working is the biggest determination.
Some places are so strict on coding methodology that it squeezes all the fun out of it. One place actually had a rule that you couldn't us goto statements. Granted, I usually don't use gotos but in rare circumstances it just makes things a lot easier.

Change Management control is another way to stiffle your fun. In one place I worked, a long time ago, I needed to make a DSN change in some JCL for a production job. It took 10 seconds, but then required 3 days and 15 processes to get it through Change Management and get it into production. The 3 day delay cost the company over 100,000 dollars (I didn't last very long at that job. It was either quit or kill myself)

But the most important thing is the people you work with. Most companies suck by definition. It's the people that you interact with every day that make it a good experience or a living hell. If you find a good group of people, it makes up for a lot of crap.

RAH

	18-12-2002 20:51									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Well like any other job than

	18-12-2002 20:57									#6
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by rah But the most important thing is the people you work with. Most companies suck by definition. It's the people that you interact with every day that make it a good experience or a living hell. If you find a good group of people, it makes up for a lot of crap. RAH

Yeah, your right, I should rephase that,

I really hate programming HERE.

Been a long time since i worked at a company
with good compenent people.

Time for a change

	18-12-2002 20:58									#7
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by rah Change Management control is another way to stiffle your fun. In one place I worked, a long time ago, I needed to make a DSN change in some JCL for a production job. It took 10 seconds, but then required 3 days and 15 processes to get it through Change Management and get it into production.

I have that plus the added bonus of then having to tell the poor grunt who finally gets to make the change how to do it.

	18-12-2002 21:11									#8
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I once gave an assigment to a programmer that was of equal simplicity. He told me it would take 4 hours. I was so pissed that I kicked him out of his chair, sat down, made the change in about 2 minutes, and then asked him what the F*** he planned to do with the other 3 hours and 58 minutes. His time estimates after that were considerably shorter.

	18-12-2002 21:19									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Test it?

	18-12-2002 21:23									#10
	Support Apolyton

Post on Apolyton?

	18-12-2002 21:43									#11
	Increase Your PM Length

A lot of people have programming jobs not because they are interested in programming or any good at it, but because it is "hot." You do need a particular kind of brain structure to be a competent programmer.

	18-12-2002 21:44									#12
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Back in the old days, knowing the syntax of your programming language was enough to be a good programmer.

Now, you have to know the API's of workflow, document management and other huge systems to incorporate into your code.
You must know how to use WSDL's, UDDI's, ASP, JSP, XML, UML, ...
The list just goes on and on.

It is getting too much.

	18-12-2002 21:50									#13
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

That's why I like assemblers.

	18-12-2002 22:15									#14
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger A lot of people have programming jobs not because they are interested in programming or any good at it, but because it is "hot." You do need a particular kind of brain structure to be a competent programmer.

I started as an assembler programmer before computers
were cool, writing programs on punch cards.The "culture" and "respect" have really taken a nose dive.

Mainly because most of the managers now are more akin to factory floor foremen in attitude. (Projerk Managers) Oh, being a manager sucks too. (Senior Management sees to that)

RAH, I had a manager do that to me once, After his
masterful change and cinical remarks, he ran it.

We had to do a full restore of yesterday's data.

When he asked me to work overtime to fix the
remaining data errors, The answer was "No".

	18-12-2002 22:17									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

He didn't get fired for that?

	18-12-2002 22:21									#16
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger He didn't get fired for that?

No, But i got a Bad attitude on my review for it
(Refusing overtime in a "crisis")

	18-12-2002 22:26									#17
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Ozz RAH, I had a manager do that to me once, After his masterful change and cinical remarks, he ran it. We had to do a full restore of yesterday's data. When he asked me to work overtime to fix the remaining data errors, The answer was "No".

Classic.

Mine was a real simple DSN change. And you bet the mortgage that before I sat down, I was 99.99999999999% sure of the name I was changing it to. And it took only 10 seconds to type it, the other minute and 50 seconds was verifying 10 times that I had typed in the right name. I have been burned before.

RAH
Working with computers, I assign 100% to nothing