29-12-2002 16:54									#1
	Upcoming scenario: Axis & Allies Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Upcoming scenario: Axis & Allies
The last couple of weeks I've been working on a ww2-scenario, covering the whole world. I'm really exited now, and I might actually finish this one off!

I'm not sure about the title yet, but I thought of making it as an unofficial version of Axis & Allies (the boardgame) for civilization.

Civs:
USA
Third Reich
Italian Empire
British Commonwealth
The Empire of Japan
Soviet Union
China

(+ barbaric civ as the neutrals)

Here is a sneak peak at my units.gif:

Attachment: units.gif
This has been downloaded 250 time(s).

	29-12-2002 18:21									#2
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They look good, any reason you didn't use Nemo units?

Would have been less work for you I'd think.

Pap

	29-12-2002 18:48									#3
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Thanks Pap!
It certainly wood be less work, but I find many of Nemo's units too cartoonish...Hope I'm not insulting anyone here. I like the ones I've made better While your here, you wouldn't mind if I used your scenario for a source of inspiration, would you?

	29-12-2002 18:56									#4
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Please do, I'll take it as a compliment, good luck!

Pap

	30-12-2002 00:59									#5
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quote: It certainly wood be less work, but I find many of Nemo's units too cartoonish...Hope I'm not insulting anyone here

Hehe... we think alike
Itīs good to know that iīm not the only one who think that nemoīs units look childish

Just one question:
Italian Empire???? Apart from the ZWK scenario, íīve never seem them as a playable civ.
Why did you choose to make them playable?

	30-12-2002 01:01									#6
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If you need some to help you testing it, count me in!!!

	30-12-2002 01:24									#7
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quote: Originally posted by academia Hehe... we think alike Itīs good to know that iīm not the only one who think that nemoīs units look childish

Hehe

quote: Just one question: Italian Empire???? Apart from the ZWK scenario, íīve never seem them as a playable civ. Why did you choose to make them playable?

I have not decided to include them yet, just a thought. I will most likely end up with an all Axis civ (Germany and Italy). But then what should the Italian Empire be replaced by?

BTW, I love your Iron Curtain scenario

	30-12-2002 01:28									#8
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quote: BTW, I love your Iron Curtain scenario

Thanx!! Anyway, this is just a test version. Iīve already found some bugs...
Moreover, itīs specially designed for multiplayer game. You know, in singleplayer you have to deal with the crazy AI nuking everyone!!

	30-12-2002 10:24									#9
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* St Leo waves a little flag in support of Nemo units

	31-12-2002 04:52									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra I have not decided to include them yet, just a thought. I will most likely end up with an all Axis civ (Germany and Italy). But then what should the Italian Empire be replaced by?

Greece, of course.


But seriously, were are the French?

	31-12-2002 05:54									#11
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quote: Greece, of course.

Good idea! Hehe

quote: But seriously, were are the French?

They are not worthy Just kidding... this scenario begins when France is already occupied, thats why...

	31-12-2002 16:53									#12
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Ok then.

Finland?
Free french?
Dutch?(Pacific front)

or..

Greeks?

	31-12-2002 17:20									#13
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Dutch??????????

The only thing they did was surrender.

	31-12-2002 17:56									#14
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While Belgians......

	31-12-2002 19:08									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Palaiologos Ok then. Finland? Free french? Dutch?(Pacific front) or.. Greeks?

I thought of all those countries, espescially Finland and Vichy-France, but finally descided to go with Brazil...

So the civs are now:
Axis
British Commonwealth
Soviet Union
USA
China
Brazil
Imperial Japan

(+ neutrals)

	31-12-2002 19:54									#16
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BRAZIL??????????????



Why the hell for?


Although they claim 1500 dead in WWII, they took part in no battle of the War. Prpably one of their ships was sunk by U-boats or something.


Suggestion: Go for Spain or Turkey. Germany wanted both these countries to enter the war on her side, but failed to persuade them. They could be potential allies for the Reich, in your scenario.

	31-12-2002 19:56									#17
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Their place in the map should be taken by the neutrals or better yet, nobody.

	31-12-2002 20:38									#18
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You are using a Gigamap, right?

BRAZIL??????
Personally, i think that neither Spain nor Turkey deserve to have a place in this game.

I donīt get it. Why do you want to use a Barbarian Civ? Why donīt you just use the 7th slot for Neutral Nations?

	31-12-2002 21:59									#19
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Short Historical Note

Following the sinking of several Brazilian merchant ships by German and Italian submarines, close to her coast, Brazil entered the war early in 1942. An expeditionary force (the F.E.B.) was sent to Europe and also an Air Force group, which escorted merchant ship convoys, was brought into war service. Furthermore, the Brazilian Navy was active in the North and South Atlantic and in the Mediterranean, transporting the F.E.B. to Italy.

	31-12-2002 22:00									#20
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...And if I want to make the scenario look like the board game Axis & Allies, China and Brazil are the two countries supported by the USA.

I am using the same map you are using for Iron Curtain

	31-12-2002 22:02									#21
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quote: Originally posted by academia I donīt get it. Why do you want to use a Barbarian Civ? Why donīt you just use the 7th slot for Neutral Nations?

Again, I want the scenario to look like the boardgame, therefor I am making a passive civ called the neutrals.

	03-01-2003 03:27									#22
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Galvatron support the Italian idea. In most of the scens the Germans and Japs are fighting against the whole board so it might be good to give them a third ally. So in the name of game-balance and because I'm half Italian plz include "bella Italia.

*Galvy starts to wave the Italian flag*
*Forza Italia*

	03-01-2003 14:52									#23
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I'd tend to leave Brazil out too - unless you were planning on adding Argentina (as the barbs perhaps?)?

	03-01-2003 15:15									#24
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Argentina will be neutral, along with Spain, Saudia-Arabia, Sweden, Turkey +++

Italy will probably not be playable. That will make it too complicated. It's best to make Germany and Italy as one civ, since they where so close allies throughout the war.

I might go with Independent neutrals, instead of Brazil. That way I can also include Mexico (wich also was US supported during the war). I'll see...Much is still to do

	03-01-2003 15:36									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra Italy will probably not be playable. That will make it too complicated. It's best to make Germany and Italy as one civ, since they where so close allies throughout the war.

It hurts me everytime when I see the Italians and Germans merged together. We have not very much in common with Germany and we deserve a slot on our own .

Well seriously speaking I don't get it why an Italian civ would be unplayable. What's the difference between them and let's say GB or US? To continue this idea you could also merge the whole world (USSR,GB,US,....) together in one civ and say: ha, they where allies throughout the war let's stick them all together. The Americans would be very thankful if their cities would wave the Russian flag and the same goes for the Italians: No Naziflag over the fine cities of Italy, we deserve the
"Tricolore Italiano"

Also I would suggest give Italy more units: The Allies combined have too many of them so how about reduce some and instead use them for Italy, how about the
L 3/35 or the M 13/40 or the famous assault gun Semovente 75/18 M42 and last but not least the M 15/42.

Give Italy a chance.

(We would deserve it more to be in a WWII scen than China. Because what was Chinas greatest achievement in the war besides crumbling before the Japs )

	03-01-2003 16:13									#26
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The biggest problem with Italy is they don't have enough cities to produce enough unit producing ability.

China has just as much of a right to be in as Italy does. They held off the Japanese despite having almost no technology to do it with.

There is also no one that China can be grouped with, they need to be a seperate civ, there just isn't enough civs allowed in Civ2.

Pap

	03-01-2003 17:44									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Galvatron We would deserve it more to be in a WWII scen than China. Because what was Chinas greatest achievement in the war besides crumbling before the Japs

The Chinese although ravaged by civil war and despite having a backward army, managed to inflict serious looses at the Japaneese. The Imperial army lost in the whole "China incident" about 400.000 men(dead only). And these were inflicted not only by guerilla warfare but pitched battles the Chinese won.

On the other hand the Italians were the laughing stock of WWII. They had a hard time defeating the spear-armed Ethiopians, they were defeated by the Greeks(who at least had gunpowder weapons), and crushed by the British(O'Connor-30.000 Brits attacked the Italian african "army" of 250.000 and annihilated it, capturing 150.000 prisoners.)

When the allies invaded Italy, the defense of their OWN country fell to the Wermacht instead of the unwilling macaroni-men.

Not mention their betrayal of their German allies in face of trouble(They did this on both World Wars).


Nothing personal.

	05-01-2003 09:25									#28
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First of all, I know it might be painfull for you to see swastikas in your beuitiful cities, Galvatron. But that's the awful truth, you should just accept it. This is a historical scenario, then it's just natural to include those civs to make space for others.

quote: Originally posted by Pap1723 ...there just isn't enough civs allowed in Civ2. Pap

Yes, that has always been a problem. Isn't there any way to hack that in any way?

	06-01-2003 20:07									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Kobra Yes, that has always been a problem. Isn't there any way to hack that in any way?

No, regretfully there isn't...

Some have tried (Julius, etc...) and nobody managed that! It has to do with the way the informations are stocked by the programm!

	06-01-2003 20:16									#30
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That stupid Sid guy!