02-01-2003 20:39									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Of course the Austrians benifeted from the timely arrival of the entire Polish Army.

Composed mostly of Lithuanian and Samogitian soldiers, 'cause Poles were good for nothin' slobs.

Bow to Lithuania, Western civilisation

	02-01-2003 23:28									#62
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Agincourt, because

- English were outnumbered at least 8:1 by the French.

- French forces were much better equipped and fighting on home terrains.

- French had 70 years to prepare for the English Longbowmen tactic.

	02-01-2003 23:48									#63
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I dunno how anyone could nominate the Gulf War. Yes, it was totally lopsided, but that was rather predictable. Coalition forces had total air supremacy, which was also used to pound the living crap out of the Iraqi command and communications networks, not to mention softening up ground forces. When the land battle came, Iraq couldn't deploy a single aircraft or helicopter. On top of that, the technological edge for the coalition was nearly unparallelled. The fact that the Iraqis nominally outnumbered the other side is meaningless as soon as you consider the quality of those troops and their equipment.

To be a truly amazing military victory, I'd think it would have to be a situation where the victorious side was not any more technologically advanced than the other (or even less advanced, ideally) and had numerous other odds stacked against them.

	02-01-2003 23:49									#64
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THE ALAM... oh wait

	02-01-2003 23:50									#65
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quote: Originally posted by Lord Merciless Agincourt, because - English were outnumbered at least 8:1 by the French. - French forces were much better equipped and fighting on home terrains. - French had 70 years to prepare for the English Longbowmen tactic.

but, you're admiting they were french.

	02-01-2003 23:50									#66
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Just reading these posts, I suggest that Alesia, Cannae and Agincourt stand out. The reason is that the commander who won did so by his wits against great odds. The enemy in all three cases greatly outnumbered the commander's army and and had well armed troops who knew how to fight (i.e., were not rabble that broke and ran at the first trumpet.)

	02-01-2003 23:59									#67
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I'm trying to rememebr some of the famous battles the Swiss had. IIRC the Swiss pulled off some amazing victories using the dreaded halberd against overwhelming foes.

	03-01-2003 00:12									#68
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Agincourt was won by wits?

Okay, maybe the lack of by the French... charging down a narrow mud covered channel in the rain in heavy armor on horses while English longbowmen have a party and the peon soldiers sit in front of the longbowmen and laugh at the knights...

	03-01-2003 00:15									#69
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Replace Agincourt with Crecy.

	03-01-2003 00:16									#70
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Just to be different, Marengo.

Austria had defeated Bonaparte, all was lost, when General Desaix arrives and says "The battle is lost, but there is time to win another!"
The Austrians are crushed, Bonaparte's fame reaches astronomical heights, and he becomes first council.
Vive Le Napleon!

For more Napoleonic hijinx, Trafalgar, Nelson leads his numerically inferior fleet to victory over the Franco-Spanish, and confirms Britian's rule of the sea for another century.

	03-01-2003 00:31									#71
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I must say that the most amazing military victory is the battle of Breitenfeld inthe 30 years war where the littel nation of sweden kickt the emperial ass it was the battel that turnd sweden in to a major power for a hundred years long live Gustav II Adolf becuse he is the best swedish king ever

	03-01-2003 00:33									#72
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Chinese history gave some very stunning victories:

Guan Du, 201AD: Warlords Cao Cao and Yuan Shao clashed over Northern China. Cao Cao's forces were outnumbered 4:1(30000 vs 120000) and had disastrous supply situation, yet he managed to outsmart his opponent and utterly destroyed Yuan Shao's army.

Chibi(Red Cliff), 208AD: This time, Cao Cao was on the loosing end of another major battle. In an attempt to conquer the southern China, his force of 240,000 men were utterly destroyed by enemies 1/3 of his size. First, his fleet was burned by an incendiary attack, then his army was routed during the retreat.

Fei Shui, 383AD: The barbarian kingdom of Chin(a different one than the first dynasty) unified northern China in 378AD, then drafted every available men to conquer the Eastern Jin kingdom. The odds was 1,000,000 vs 100,000 in favor of Chin, the result was the destruction Chin's army.

Sha-Er-Hon, 1619AD: The most important victory for the Manchus. Manchurian prince Nurhaci rised against the Ming empire in 1616 and soon faced a massive Ming expeditionary force. The Ming force were consisted of veterans against Japan's Hideyoshi and equipped with modern firearms. Manchus had at most 60,000 men available, but Nurhaci used his tactical brilliance to smash the Ming army. In another 26 years, Ming empire was to be conquered by the Manchus.

	03-01-2003 00:35									#73
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quote: Originally posted by Barbarosa I must say that the most amazing military victory is the battle of Breitenfeld inthe 30 years war where the littel nation of sweden kickt the emperial ass it was the battel that turnd sweden in to a major power for a hundred years long live Gustav II Adolf becuse he is the best swedish king ever

I fail to see what's amazing about this battle. The Swedes had numerical parity and superiority in both artilleries and personal firearms.

	03-01-2003 01:42									#74
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Che - this certainly can be a sorta ME thread. only you should only argue about military actions and only about great ones.


There were many surprising things about the 73 war and I'll be the first to agree if you nominate several operations to be the most astounding ones.

Yet, in general, the arab armies were warned not to advance since Israel behaved as if it was going to use a certain weapon it was suspected of having.

But still, there are unbelieveable stories, such as a single tank defending for days against mounting syrian attacks. On the radio the tank was referred to as a battallion to confuse the enemy. It was effective just like a batallion.

	03-01-2003 01:51									#75
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Rourke's Drift.

Followed by the Roman defeat of Boudicca (outnumbered 10 to 1, facing an army that had already annihilated the 9th Legion).

	03-01-2003 01:57									#76
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David conquering Goliath.

	03-01-2003 02:04									#77
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand David conquering Goliath.

if we're going to discuss falsified stories i'm going to say SG vs The Rebel Goa'uld group led by Hastor. now THAT was a battle that they tipped the right way

	03-01-2003 02:07									#78
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Without making comment on your observation,
I'll counter with the assault on Helm's Deep.

	03-01-2003 02:10									#79
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The Borg vs The Federation.

	03-01-2003 02:11									#80
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Luke Skywalker taking out the Death Star.

Annakin Skywalker taking out the Trade Federation command post.

	03-01-2003 02:14									#81
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New England Patriots beating St Louis Rams in Superbowl XXXVII.

New York Jets beating Baltimore Colts in Superbowl III.

Tenessee Titans beating Buffalo Bills in 99 Playoffs.

Buffalo Bills beating Houston Oilers in 92 Playoffs.

UC Berkeley beating Stanford in 1982.

	03-01-2003 02:15									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Chris 62 For more Napoleonic hijinx, Trafalgar, Nelson leads his numerically inferior fleet to victory over the Franco-Spanish, and confirms Britian's rule of the sea for another century.

On a more serious note, Englands destruction of the Spanish Armada via Drake.

	03-01-2003 02:37									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Agincourt was won by wits? Okay, maybe the lack of by the French... charging down a narrow mud covered channel in the rain in heavy armor on horses while English longbowmen have a party and the peon soldiers sit in front of the longbowmen and laugh at the knights...

True, it was more than the supidity of the French and the fact that they had no unified command that cost French defeat. They never should've attacked across a freshly plowed field in the first place.

Scratch Agincourt

	03-01-2003 02:48									#84
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quote: Originally posted by Lazarus and the Gimp Rourke's Drift. Followed by the Roman defeat of Boudicca (outnumbered 10 to 1, facing an army that had already annihilated the 9th Legion).

Lazarus, now this really sounds impressive. Could you povide more details on the battle, including the name the Roman commander?

	03-01-2003 03:02									#85
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It took place in 60AD, at Mancetter. The Roman commander was Suetonius, heading the 14th Legion and other auxiliaries. Tacitus lists the British dead at 80,000, the Roman dead at 400.

	03-01-2003 03:24									#86
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quote: Originally posted by Ned True, it was more than the supidity of the French and the fact that they had no unified command that cost French defeat. They never should've attacked across a freshly plowed field in the first place. Scratch Agincourt

My point is that it was by no means a battle won against great odds through a miracle.

	03-01-2003 03:39									#87
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quote: Originally posted by Lord Merciless UC Berkeley beating Stanford in 1982.

Were they playing chess or was it shuffleboard?

	03-01-2003 04:24									#88
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When I went to school at UCSB our women's volleyball team was the national champions. I used to love going to watch their games; all those tall athletic girls, all those tight skimpy outfits, all that jumping, giggling and bouncing.

	03-01-2003 04:34									#89
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How accurate are some of these reports on ancient battles? Thermopylae has been so romanticized I find it hard to believe (the literal version anyway).

	03-01-2003 06:06									#90
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quote: Originally posted by Vesayen Thats like cheating in Civ2 or 3, getting stealth bombers on turn 1, then wiping out enemy cities-nothing surprising

WOW!!@@# THAT WAS EXACTLY WHAT THAT BATTLE WAS LIKE, WASN'T IT?!?@! THANK YOU FOR YOUR VALUABLE INPUT AND TIME, WHERE MAY I EXPLORE THE GIFTS OF YOUR EDUCATED POSTS NEXT??!@??


HOL-Y KAMOLIEZZ!!!!@

!!@@#

!