02-01-2003 20:37									#1
	Help Tassadar get a Video Card Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I need a new video card. I'm completly ignorant in this area. Don't know the differences between them, don't know how to install them....So help free me from my ignorance by guiding me to the right video card. Preferably good but cheap. Better than an Intel 82810E Graphics Card (Integrated).

	02-01-2003 20:41									#2
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I myself use Geforce 3 card, it still does everything great. You can buy worse card (Geforce 2, etc.) if you want (it would be cheaper), but everything depends on what you are doing with your computer. If you are playing newest 3D action games or multimedia such card could be too bad. You might even consider getting Geforce 4 then, cause it wouldn't age so fastly.
If you are only working with computer and/or playing low-requirements games (TBS, etc.), Geforce 3 should be more than enough and gerforce 2 should be OK in my opinion.

	02-01-2003 20:43									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Are you sure you can put one in?
(some MOBO with integrated grafic cards, have no AGP slot)
You could have an PCI one though

I would go for ATI. Better all-round quality
(Prices should/will drop later this month, when the Nvidea cards hit the market)
Could be februari though, not sure)

	02-01-2003 20:45									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

What the rest of your config btw...

No real use putting a ATI 9700 or geforce4600 in a PII pc...

	02-01-2003 21:47									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

PIII 700 MHz, 128MB Ram. Ask for more info....And I'm not sure if I can install it or not How would I find out?

	02-01-2003 23:47									#6
	Increase the size of your Attachments

One way to find out (other than looking at documentation that came with your computer) is to take a peek inside your case. Look for a video card, also take note what kind of slots you have. If you have a onboard video card, that can be disabled through jumpers or some other means.

I was able to look a motherboard up on the internet to disable a mobo using jumpers. But it helps to have the documentation.

If you aren't certain what slots you have. Maybe you can draw a crude picture. And sometimes the name of the slot is in small print written on the motherboard. Look for an AGP slot. This is the best one to use for graphics cards. Other slots include PCI and ISA.

	02-01-2003 23:57									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 PIII 700 MHz, 128MB Ram. Ask for more info....And I'm not sure if I can install it or not How would I find out?

i've never messed with overriding integrated video, but i'm fairly sure you'd need a new motherboard for this job.

if you still want to look, check your manual for your motherboard for an AGP slot.

if you dont have the manual, pop open your box and look for it. it's usually brown and shorter than the PCI slots (white ones), and theres only 1 (if it's there at all).

if you dont have one, you're limited to PCI-based graphics cards, which will eb cheaper but crappier in terms of preformance (high end anyway).

if you do have one, it's either 2x or 4x, and that'll determine which cared is best for you.

	03-01-2003 00:09									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

an easier solution is to look it up on the web.

I helped a guy with his. All I had was some writing on the motherboard. It was called Florida and had some letters and numbers.

I was able to find it on a google search. This will bring you to the company website which will show you a picture of the board. If you do find the correct picture- compare it with your board, post it here.

Again you need the type of motherboard. Knowing the computer isn't all that usefull. I think the guy I helped had a gateway. And they used cheap motherboards that had onboard video

and onboard video can be overridden. Unless you have some whacky motherboard that won't let you do this for some strange reason.

	03-01-2003 02:20									#9
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

for a PIII700:
I would say, go for a second hand geforce 2 or 3 and add some memory(not for the grafic card, memory for your MOBO), this should put you back 50$, if that much at all.
The MOBO brand and type would be handy

	03-01-2003 03:05									#10
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

yes. Just for your info. I have a p3 700 with 256 megs of ram. I bought a geoforce 2 MX400 that has 64 MG of video ram. Fairly cheap and it can run games like Morrowind fairly well.

	03-01-2003 04:48									#11
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Yeah, a GeForce2 MX is a fairly decent cheap card, it can run 3d games fairly well. It won't be able to do the more modern games well, but that is ok as your cpu wouldn't be able to handle the newer games either.

	03-01-2003 04:59									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

don't be bad mouthing 700's. I can still run Morrowind just fine. I was thinking about upgrading, but I really don't need to. so I won't upgrade my processor any time soon.

	03-01-2003 06:06									#13
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Whatever you do, don't go for the geforce MX series, their crap...the 2 and 4 series(well the 4 series is the same as the 2 series, just costs more )

you would far better of buying a second hand geforce 3 classic

Sorry Dissident
don't worry ,I still have the original geforce (with SDR mem )

Last edited by alva on 03-01-2003 at 06:53

	03-01-2003 06:28									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Get yourself a S3Trio64, 2mb of video RAM. Works fine for me.

	03-01-2003 07:07									#15
	Tired of ads?

Well.. as for motherboard... you certainly do not need to change it.

It must have at least one free PCI slot, but most likely has an AGP slot too. If it has AGP, you can buy any card you want... the slot will be probably black or brown and first (or in the middle of the motherboard) after it there will be a couple of PCI slots (usually white).

If you get a card you will need to disable the on-board video after you put the card in. That is done in your BIOS... you should have some manual... or if you do not have a manual find in system info what type of motherboard you have, and check on manufacturers website for the manual. All should be decribed in enough details in the manual to make you understand what options you have to choose. (actually the manual will tell you if you have AGP slot and how to find it ) ....

To figure out what motherboard you have you can try downloading this http://www.belarc.com/free_download.html and running, I haven't tried it myself but I have heard it can detect what motherboard you have, it is a ~654 kb file only. (alternativley Sisoft Sandra) but that is a few MB download.

Ok once when you figure this out, my advice for the product would be either a GF3Ti200 that can probably be well under 100 USD maybe 60, 70 if there are still prdoduced. Or even better go for ATI RADEON 9000, 9000 pro is better but 9000 will probably do what you want. Actually ATI 9000 pro is quite a bit faster than GF3TI200, and the normal (just 9000) is probably a little better too, still both cards have the functionality you need for a PIII 700 and will serve you well, as they are DX8 generation cards. Buy whatever is cheaper.

If you are in US (and I think you are) buy from here www.newegg.com, as many have been quite happy with the prices and service from there. So just checking quickly, the cheapest was a Radeon 9000 for 66 USD (i think without shipping) here http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProdu...ycodevalue=3045

If you want to save money this is the product to go for. (assuming you have an AGP slot.

If you don't have an AGP slot you will surely have a PCI slot and there was a Radeon 9000 PCI for 99 USD. So here you go.

As they said previously a Geoforce 4 MX or 2MX is not worth going for as you don't get all the features most new games already use. (UT2003/Morrowind/Battlefiueld 1942... there is more) And all new 2003 games certainly will use.

	03-01-2003 07:15									#16
	Put an end to popups!

heh just to post this

probably easier to check what you have is to open the case and see it for yourself... here is a pic.

Hope it helps...

AGP is the brown slot in the middle and PCI slots are all white ones.

Your mobo is very likely to look something like this.

Attachment: ka7-1001.jpg
This has been downloaded 56 time(s).

	03-01-2003 07:32									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

That's the worst P I have ever seen

	03-01-2003 08:44									#18
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I had a G-force 2 w/32 meg that came with my computer and never had any trouble with it.
Last Friday I had a Ge Force 4 Ti 4200 w/AGP8X 128 meg installed.
Also installed another 256 meg of RAM. Both item together cost $317.00 out the door.
The video card was $196.00
My computer was build by DSI.

	03-01-2003 08:45									#19
	Suffering from ads?

What you can to is to get a bad arse graphics card now, and upgrade your mobo and/or CPU a bit later. A lot of people upgrade their computers bit by bit.

	03-01-2003 14:13									#20
	Put an end to popups!

Yeah- kinda like a continual upgrading.

Gf4 Ti4200 all the way But, which company? Asus would probably be my choice.

	03-01-2003 18:03									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Dissident That's the worst P I have ever seen

Ok.

8 minutes to find the pic edit it and make the post

	03-01-2003 18:57									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Since its kinda on topic I'll ask a similar question. I'm planning my next PC which will probably use a XP 2100 (or so) and a Gigabyte MB. Of course there are thousands of video cards so the choice becomes tougher. Just like the CPU I'm looking for a middle of the road card rather than the top of the line (to avoid paying the premium for the latest stuff). I'm looking at the Radeon 9500, and the GF4 TI 4200.

From what I've seen on Anantech it looks like the 4200 is slightly faster bit the 9500 is compatible with DX9 so will have a longer life span.

Any advice?

Last edited by SpencerH on 03-01-2003 at 19:22

	04-01-2003 20:03									#23
	Got spare money?

Hey Spence... do not buy Radeon 9500, but Radeon 9500 Pro.

The 9500 Pro is DX9 compatible and faster than GF4 ti 4600.

Ok it is a bit more expensive than GF4Ti4200, but quite a bit faster.
Just be careful to buy Radeon 9500 Pro as the "only" 9500 is a lot slower.

	04-01-2003 21:17									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Thanks for the advice.

	04-01-2003 22:12									#25
	messy! Tired of ads?

personally i'd wait until spring when the the nv30 and next ati card are coming out. or just get a cheap used gf3 then upgrade when doom3 comes out. you really don't need a gf4/ati 9700 class card unless you want to play ut2k3 at 1600*1200 w/ full details and antialiasing. the reason i'm reluctant to recommend the new ati because while it's in theory directx9 compatible dx9 will likely be like directx8 and change as time goes by. plus just because it's dx9 compatible does not mean it will be able to run dx9 games at good preformance. there are not any dx9 games out on the market yet so no one knows these things yet. which is really why i recommend going with a cheap upgrade of a gf3(read: a stopgap measure) or waiting it out.

you also might want to check other options. a cpu upgrade(along with perhaps mobo/ram)coupled with a gf2 would probably get you superior preformance in low resolutions and 2d games than just upgrading to a high gfx card. lower resolutions, and 2d games are usually cpu limited not gfx card limited. this might actually be cheaper depending on certain things. upgrading is a complex business.

i think you should give us more info - what do you want to do w/ your pc? do you have to have high framerates to play games? i'm relatively picky and i still have a 750mhz/gf1 ddr and get good preformance in almost eveything except for ut2k3(which runs at 35fps). are you just going to be playing strategy games like civ3? rendering 3d art? just browsing apolyton? more info please!

	04-01-2003 23:10									#26
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

The implication of your comments is that no one should buy any recent video cards unless they're playing the latest games. I agree that all of these cards are overkill for my current games and graphics. However, I prefer to buy 2nd tier hardware so that it lasts a little longer than a PC that meets my current needs. Given that I need to build a new PC from scratch, and that the 2nd tier cards are all priced around $100 (give or take), I prefer to buy the best of those.

With that in mind, I dont need high frame rates so I'm not interested in a card like the 9700. The 128MB 9500 pro looks like a card that will last me a while but the price tag ($180) is a little high. If they come out with a 64MB version I'll probably go for that since I dont need the VRAM. If not I'll wait for the price to drop or go with the Ti4200.