07-01-2003 07:53									#31
	Put an end to popups!

Bring it on!!!

	07-01-2003 12:29									#32
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I could do random on the settings or the worst settings. What does everyone want?

And everyone differs on worst climate. Cold give you lots of tundra. I think dry gives you lots of desrt. Wet gives you lots of jungle.

3 billion is probably the worst age. It gives lots of hills and mountains (which can be good for resources, but lots of tough terrritory).

	07-01-2003 14:39									#33
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

It's a pity there isn't a way of choosing random that would guarantee to throw up extremes.

I would be happy with either worst climate or random.

The only thing I would not like is 3 billion age. I tried this once and found myself alone on a micro-continent with about 50 mountains and two grassland. That is a bit too tough for me.

	07-01-2003 16:38									#34
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I would prefer standard average settings for the map.
I want to fight other players, not the elements.

Logically, I also don't want too many barbarians.
I want to fight other players, not ... (guess )


My playtime is 19-21h GMT.

	07-01-2003 16:39									#35
	Increase Your PM Length

I am OK with anything.

Whatever position/civ I end up with...I will play to the bitter end.

I do like the idea of the worst world conditions....thats why I suggested it

I hate barbarians though...so raging barbs ??? not sure I would like this.

	07-01-2003 16:42									#36
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Flandrien,

So I cant count on your vote for a diplomacy win ???

Scap that strategy

	07-01-2003 17:18									#37
	Increase Your PM Length

Random age/geo/climo/barb for me. If it turns out to be really bad, I am ready. If not, fine as well.

I will put the playing windows together and propose the playing order.

	07-01-2003 18:05									#38
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Flandrien I would prefer standard average settings for the map. I want to fight other players, not the elements

I think Flandrien has a point. The original idea was to get the most out of the poorly rated civs and a very extreme map might dominate that, regardless of how good the players and civs are.

How about;

standard size map
random climate
random temperature
continents
70%water
4 billion years age
roaming barbarians

That may throw up some extremes for those who want it tough without being so bad that some players are dead in the water from the start.

	07-01-2003 18:43									#39
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by CerberusIV How about; standard size map random climate random temperature continents 70%water 4 billion years age roaming barbarians That may throw up some extremes for those who want it tough without being so bad that some players are dead in the water from the start.

That would be fine with me.

Also, I have sorted through the "playing time windows" and it seems the best playing order would be (anyone can be the first one, I think, the list starts with myself just because of my egocentrism... ):

08-09 GMT ... vondrack (GMT+1)
08-14 GMT ... Hot_Enamel (GMT+10)
17-21 GMT ... Tiberius (GMT+2)
19-21 GMT ... Flandrien (GMT+1?)
19-22 GMT ... CerberusIV (GMT)
23-04 GMT ... BetaHound (GMT-5)

The only pair I am not 100% sure about is Flandrien and CerberusIV. As CerberusIV gave a window extending into a little bit later time and also being in a later timezone, I've put him behind Flandrien.

How does that sound to you?

Who is going to set the game up, effectively becoming the first player? Flandrien? Anyone else?

	07-01-2003 19:08									#40
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by CerberusIV I think Flandrien has a point. The original idea was to get the most out of the poorly rated civs and a very extreme map might dominate that, regardless of how good the players and civs are. How about; standard size map random climate random temperature continents 70%water 4 billion years age roaming barbarians That may throw up some extremes for those who want it tough without being so bad that some players are dead in the water from the start.

I agree. The civs are the game here.

How are we going to decide that? How about :

Since the order is set, Dissident numbers the players, and throws a six sided die. That player will be first, and he picks the civ for the next player. And then that player picks for the next.

So for example - he throws a three. Tiberius will be starting. But first he picks a civ for Flandrien and posts it here. Then Flandrien picks a civ for Cerberus and posts it here. Then Cerberus , etc.

Then Dissident sets the game up and we are off and running.

	07-01-2003 21:20									#41
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by vondrack 17-21 GMT ... Tiberius (GMT+2) 19-21 GMT ... Flandrien (GMT+1?) 19-22 GMT ... CerberusIV (GMT)

I doubt this will work.
I think the risk is too high that I will receive the turn from Tiberius too late to play it on the same day, or I send it too late to CerberusIV.

Better is it to make the game go round in two days.

Like this:
08-09 GMT ... vondrack (GMT+1)
17-21 GMT ... Tiberius (GMT+2)
19-21 GMT ... Flandrien (GMT+1?)
23-04 GMT ... BetaHound (GMT-5)
08-14 GMT ... Hot_Enamel (GMT+10)
19-22 GMT ... CerberusIV (GMT)

Or like this:
08-09 GMT ... vondrack (GMT+1)
17-21 GMT ... Tiberius (GMT+2)
23-04 GMT ... BetaHound (GMT-5)
08-14 GMT ... Hot_Enamel (GMT+10)
19-21 GMT ... Flandrien (GMT+1?)
19-22 GMT ... CerberusIV (GMT)

	07-01-2003 21:32									#42
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Yup - I agree. I think it is a better idea having me play before hot_enamel, given the time zones, with the other 4 grouped. Either one of the above - depending on the times of day that the four of you in similar time zones (from GMT to GMT+2) prefer to play.

	08-01-2003 03:17									#43
	Put an end to popups!

World settings as suggested is fine with me.

Throwing the dice for starting positions and civ choices is fine with me.

I say go with the first timetable.
Flanderin, if you get it late and cant play, then the game is delayed 1 day....but there is also a chance that we will do 1 entire round a day.

Is it not better to have a gamble for 1 round per day which will default to 1 per two days if missed, than just set up the game up so we will only have a choice of 1 round per two days ?

But.. whatever is decided, I will be cool with that.

	08-01-2003 03:30									#44
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Here is another thought ...

In another PBEM game I set up (PBEM Slow), I created multiple games.

Every player played every game in the first round, and ranked each game from best to worst. Gave them a score, and posted it on the forum.

At the end of the first round, the score for each game was added, and the best game only was continued.

This method ensures most people have moderatly good starts.

The same world settings was used in each game, so the only deciding factor was starting position.
Everyone had the ability to veto a game completely out, if they had an impossible start.

I would never veto a game out because I enjoy the prospect of a difficult start (PBEM Pandora - I am stuck on a island)...but I get the feeling that some of the others may want a good start.

Regs

	08-01-2003 03:38									#45
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Hot_Enamel I say go with the first timetable. Flanderin, if you get it late and cant play, then the game is delayed 1 day....but there is also a chance that we will do 1 entire round a day. Is it not better to have a gamble for 1 round per day which will default to 1 per two days if missed, than just set up the game up so we will only have a choice of 1 round per two days ?

Exactly, that's what I was thinking of - if Flandrien or CerberusIV miss their turn on Day A, they will sure be able to play on Day A+1, extending the turn from 1 to 2 days. With the other schedule, we would never be able to make a turn faster than in two days. In the long run, this can make a HUGE difference.

Actually, Tiberius shall be able to send the save to Flandrien in time almost every day, as he's is well ahead of him timezone-wise. Besides, he's just one of those poor Civ3 addicts and he will be so eager to play his turn... It was only Flandrien and CerberusIV I felt a little bit unsure about.

	08-01-2003 05:00									#46
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

OK we are settled on these. I'm putting these in order for easier game creation.

World Size: Standard
barbarians: roaming
Landmass: continents
Water Coverage: 70% water
Climate: random
Temperature: random
age: 4 billion
Difficulty: ?


And I'm assuming we are playing with standard civ3 rules? No funky things like regicide?

And what about culturally linked starting positions and cultural conversions?

And what is the game difficulty and any other winning conditions we might want to change (diplomatic victory etc.)?

And Flandrien, you're going to have to tell me how you set up a PBEM game as administator and assign passwords, without playing the first turn. I can't figure out how to do that.

Last edited by Dis on 08-01-2003 at 05:15

	08-01-2003 05:37									#47
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

For difficulty I suggest Regent or Monarch - the only difference being the barbarian combat bonus.

I think culturally linked start should be on. It will be one more aspect of strategy when picking the civs.

Yes to cultural conversions - although in a human vs human game I don't think it will matter much. It may, but I doubt it.

For victory conditions - use the standard ones, including diplomatic - which is hugely redundant anyway in a human game. (Unless of course you mail me $500 in which case - sure, I'll vote for you. )

	08-01-2003 06:39									#48
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by BetaHound For difficulty I suggest Regent or Monarch - the only difference being the barbarian combat bonus. I think culturally linked start should be on. It will be one more aspect of strategy when picking the civs. Yes to cultural conversions - although in a human vs human game I don't think it will matter much. It may, but I doubt it. For victory conditions - use the standard ones, including diplomatic - which is hugely redundant anyway in a human game. (Unless of course you mail me $500 in which case - sure, I'll vote for you. )

	08-01-2003 07:32									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Dissident,

Work out the starting order, and ask the first person to email you their password.
Set up the game, you choose the administrator password, & key in the first players password.

Save the game, and email it to the first player who will play their turn. They forward to the next person who chooses their password as per normal.

As for my choice of remaining settings
Monarch
Culture links off
Standard victories
Accel Prod OFF

Regicide & Mass Regicide is OK.
At least it gives you more units to move around during the early stages of the game.

Lets agree on the playing order ASAP and roll the dice.
I am keen to choose a civ and see what I am playing.
I hope its not the Chinese

	08-01-2003 08:35									#50
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

This seems the best order I guess. It was posted on the previous page. Any tweaks needed. Sometimes you can't always get 1 turn a day, but sometims you can.

08-09 GMT ... vondrack (GMT+1)
08-14 GMT ... Hot_Enamel (GMT+10)
17-21 GMT ... Tiberius (GMT+2)
19-21 GMT ... Flandrien (GMT+1?)
19-22 GMT ... CerberusIV (GMT)
23-04 GMT ... BetaHound (GMT-5)

let my try that pbem set up again.

Yeah that way works. I did something wrong when I tried that before. It seemed to skip a person. OK that should work fine.

Last edited by Dis on 08-01-2003 at 08:45

	08-01-2003 08:43									#51
	Increase Your PM Length

Diss - the order of play makes good sense.

Before you try and start the game - we need to pick civs.

There have been suggestions on how to do it. Use the last order you posted, and roll a die to determine who will be player number one and will pick the next player's civ.

	08-01-2003 08:46									#52
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

yeah I was just testing, it works now. Plus we have to wait a few days for Tiberius.

now where are my die...

	08-01-2003 09:03									#53
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Roll it ... ROLL IT !!!!

I want to know my Civ, so I can start my stratgey planning

I get 1 vote from BetaHound for $500...now is that USD or Euro's ?

	08-01-2003 09:32									#54
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Worse yet - Canadian $'s. Currently trading at 64.25 cents on the U.S. dollar.

	08-01-2003 11:14									#55
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Play Order:
Player 1: vondrack
Player 2: Hot_Enamel
Player 3: Tiberius
Player 4: Flandrien
Player 5: CerberusIV
Player 6: BetaHound

OK I seem to have no dice around. I had to use a website dice roller. My first roll is a 2, so Hot_Enamel gets to pick first. Next roll: 4. Next roll (that isn't a repeat): 6. Next roll: 1. Next roll 3. And that leaves position 5 to pick last.

First pick: Hot_Enamel picks for CerberusIV
Second pick: Flandrien picks for Tiberius
Third pick: BetaHound picks for Vondrack
Fourth pick: Vondrack picks for Betahound
Fifth pick: Tiberius picks for Flandrien
Sixth pick: CerberusIV picks Hot_Enamel

Is this good? or do you want to not have people pick for each other?

I could have the person pick for the person following them. Say

Hot_Enamel picks for Tiberious.
Flandrien picks for CerberusIV.
Betahound picks for Vondrack.
Vondrack picks for Hot Enamel.
Tiberius picks for Flandrien
CerberusIV picks for Betahound.
But this doesn't give the person with the best dice roll the advantage.

Or I could just have the person with the best dice roll get their civ chosen last. In that case.

Flandrien picks for CeberusIV.
Hot_Enamel picks for Tiberius.
BetaHound picks for Vondrack.
CerberusIV picks for Betahound.
Tiberius picks for Flandrien.
Vondrack to pick for Hot_Enamel.

Whichever you guys want to use


official dice roller : http://www.rdinn.com/calc_dice.asp

Last edited by Dis on 08-01-2003 at 11:24

	08-01-2003 14:33									#56
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Dissident Play Order: Player 1: vondrack Player 2: Hot_Enamel Player 3: Tiberius Player 4: Flandrien Player 5: CerberusIV Player 6: BetaHound OK I seem to have no dice around. I had to use a website dice roller. My first roll is a 2, so Hot_Enamel gets to pick first. I could have the person pick for the person following them. Say Hot_Enamel picks for Tiberious. Flandrien picks for CerberusIV. Betahound picks for Vondrack. Vondrack picks for Hot Enamel. Tiberius picks for Flandrien CerberusIV picks for Betahound. But this doesn't give the person with the best dice roll the advantage.

I would go for this.

Otherwise standard victory conditions with culture linking off and accelerated production off.

I would caution against regicide/mass regicide as it cuts down the usefulness of an expansionist civ if anyone is given such a civ.

Dissident - sorry but a little more dice rolling is required to set up the map conditions I suggested. I didn't realise at the time but it is not possible to set random temperature and climate and not random age, it is all three or nothing. Could you determine temperature by a die roll - 1 or 2 gives cold, 3 or 4 gives normal and 5 or 6 gives warm and similarly for climate. Then set the map accordingly.

	08-01-2003 14:44									#57
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

OK I can do that. but I seemed to be able to create 4 billion and random temperature and climate. I just checked my test game. It shows all the settings as custom. So I'm not sure if they stuck.

	08-01-2003 15:01									#58
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Dissident Play Order: Player 1: vondrack Player 2: Hot_Enamel Player 3: Tiberius Player 4: Flandrien Player 5: CerberusIV Player 6: BetaHound I could have the person pick for the person following them. Say Hot_Enamel picks for Tiberious. Flandrien picks for CerberusIV. Betahound picks for Vondrack. Vondrack picks for Hot Enamel. Tiberius picks for Flandrien CerberusIV picks for Betahound. But this doesn't give the person with the best dice roll the advantage. [/url]

I would go for this system, too. The I-give-you-a-civ-you-give-me-a-civ system would not really encourage assignment of crappy civs...

I do not think the person with the best dice roll was supposed to get any advantage for himself. I believe that person was supposed to be able to deal the greatest deal of damage...

	08-01-2003 16:34									#59
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Ok - If we all agree that I get to pick first ...

quote: Hot_Enamel picks for Tiberious. Flandrien picks for CerberusIV. Betahound picks for Vondrack. Vondrack picks for Hot Enamel. Tiberius picks for Flandrien CerberusIV picks for Betahound.

Nice die roll BTW

Then I choose to give Tiberious the dreadful English

What a hoot

	08-01-2003 18:23									#60
	Support Apolyton

Oooooh - I'm scared already. Those man-o-war's just keep me awake at night.