21-01-2003 00:14									#1
	SENATE BILL: Resolution calling for the eventual abolition of slavery Increase the size of your Attachments

PURPOSE: To express the Senate's desire for the abolition of the practice of slavery within the borders of the Apolytonian Republic

The Senate of the Apolytonian Republic,

Observing that the practice of utilizing the work of foreign laborers without pay is slavery,

Realizing that slavery is inhumane and barbaric,

Believing that the Apolytonian Republic should be more enlightened than to be responsible for such barbarism,

Recognizing that the abolision of slavery has logistical difficulties for the nation and will take time and planning to coordinate and execute properly while safeguarding the national interest,

1. Hereby resolves that the practice of utilizing the labor of foreign citizens without paying them for their labor is slavery and should be abolished within the territories of the enlightened Apolytonian Republic,

2. Further resolves that the government of the Apolytonian Republic and specifically the Domestic Minister should be given leeway to make decisions on the timing and manner in which slavery should be ended,

3. Encourages the Domestic Minister to make such decisions with regard to the national interest as well as the need for the eventual complete abolition of slavery.

--------------------------

Poll options:
1. Yea
2. Nay
3. Abstain

This poll will last 72 hours, as required by the Constitution.

All citizens have the right to vote in this poll.

--------------------------

EDIT: Removed an accidental "/I" tag that messed up the formatting.

Last edited by Arnelos on 21-01-2003 at 02:49

	21-01-2003 00:20									#2
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It is now the policy of the Democratic Industrialists of Apolyton (DIA) to support the abolition of slavery, for we believe it to be an intollerably barbaric practice for our modern nation.

While we aren't counting on the support of those FEAR and ARM barbarians, we had heard that the Apolytonian Labor Party (ALP) and their illustrious elected President, Aro, were in favor of such a policy as well.

Let them show that by supporting this bill

	21-01-2003 01:10									#3
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Beautiful...

I support this gladly..

mss

	21-01-2003 01:25									#4
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We may have lost a President, but we gained a great Senator!

Amen to this Bill!

	21-01-2003 01:34									#5
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I hate role-play getting ahead of gameplay.

	21-01-2003 01:44									#6
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quote: Originally posted by MJW I hate role-play getting ahead of gameplay.

Oh, not this again!

It has already been discussed and proven that assimilating foreign workers is economically the same or better. So while Arnelos may be enjoying a bit of roleplay here, it is not at the sacrifice of gameplay.

I can't stand the legal nonsense of this game - but you don't see me slamming/spamming the court threads and legal discussions.

	21-01-2003 01:59									#7
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With great pleasure!

	21-01-2003 02:24									#8
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quote: Originally posted by MJW I hate role-play getting ahead of gameplay.

If you read the bill closely (which I recommended before voting), you'll note that the Domestic Minister is basically given authority to make decisions of his own accord on this issue, almost carte blanche...

That's MORE than enough room for the DM to make decisions based upon concrete national interest, though eventually getting rid of the slaves is something that a lot of people want done.

The idea is that a lot of the RPers want to get rid of the slaves, but the "we hate RP" people think that it either shouldn't be done or should at least be done in a manner that's in the national interest.

The idea here is that this isn't quite what either side would find IDEAL, no... but I'd hope it's at least acceptable to most

	21-01-2003 02:33									#9
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I abstain.

I'm not big on RP within the context of this game, and I'm not a domestic guy, so I honestly don't care if this is passed or not . I applaud Arnelos, however, for giving the Domestic Minister the power to make intelligent decisions when needed -- which was my only complaint about previous versions .

-- adaMada

	21-01-2003 02:46									#10
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I agree with adaMada. The highlight of this bill is that it is not restrictive like the previous proposals.

	21-01-2003 03:12									#11
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This stuff is.... a waste...

(no hard feelings though Arne... )

	21-01-2003 04:34									#12
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We have fought long for it. At last the bill came. Now we have to await the government decision.

Great work Arnelos!

	21-01-2003 21:52									#13
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hi ,

yeah

have a nice day

	22-01-2003 01:16									#14
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Dejon says we've gained a great Senator, and I agree. But thank God he doesn't have that Palpatine avatar anymore....that would just be too much.

I agree with your Bill, Arnelos. Giving the DM great freedom in what he wants to do, that's much better than the Senate FORCING him to get rid of slaves...

	22-01-2003 01:54									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Meshelic that's much better than the Senate FORCING him to get rid of slaves...

THAT would be legally questionable (given that the DM is given power to make such decisions about the use of workers w/o Senate input).

In effect, this bill or ANY BILL about the use of workers has a similar standing to a poll under the old CoL. The minister isn't REQUIRED to do what it says, no... but it might not be a positive career move to strongly stand against stated public opinion

As under the old CoL, most ministers are good enough to abide by the public will that the difference tends to go somewhat unoticed

	22-01-2003 02:09									#16
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Subtle. You're very good on this, Arnelos...

	22-01-2003 02:39									#17
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Interesting thing about this bill is that technically it seems to have no legal force. The same is true of the GL bill, all it does technically is says we're not going to use him yet. I support both though .

	22-01-2003 06:23									#18
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President Aro, can we next make sure everyone gets three meals a day

	22-01-2003 06:24									#19
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We have the game won anyway...And if you can not legally froce him then this bill is pointless.

	22-01-2003 06:46									#20
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quote: Originally posted by MJW We have the game won anyway...And if you can not legally froce him then this bill is pointless.

It's not pointless at all.

You see, a legislative "resolution" (or legislative statement of opinion) has a long-standing place in legal tradition...

It also has a long-standing place in this democracy game. There once was a time not long ago before the existence of "senate bills" when ALL polls conducted carried equal legal weight to this bill

The officers carried out those decisions not because they were FORCED to do so under threat of the immediate start of impeachment proceedings, but because they respected popular will and were willing to take it into account... though had more flexibility to incorporate it into other plans rather than be straightjacketed by it.

It was also understood that any minister who disobeyed the result of a widely passed poll would have hell to pay, even if we didn't impeach them

	22-01-2003 07:38									#21
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quote: Originally posted by pikesfan President Aro, can we next make sure everyone gets three meals a day

I'm glad to see that you know what's going on here...

quote: Originally posted by Arnelos ........................ It was also understood that any minister who disobeyed the result of a widely passed poll would have hell to pay, even if we didn't impeach them

The best part of the game!

	22-01-2003 10:44									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Arnelos It's not pointless at all. You see, a legislative "resolution" (or legislative statement of opinion) has a long-standing place in legal tradition... It also has a long-standing place in this democracy game. There once was a time not long ago before the existence of "senate bills" when ALL polls conducted carried equal legal weight to this bill The officers carried out those decisions not because they were FORCED to do so under threat of the immediate start of impeachment proceedings, but because they respected popular will and were willing to take it into account... though had more flexibility to incorporate it into other plans rather than be straightjacketed by it. It was also understood that any minister who disobeyed the result of a widely passed poll would have hell to pay, even if we didn't impeach them

That is VERY True. Especially if you weren't aware of a particular Poll (or discussion) that was expressing the wishes of the Population. THis had happend to me in the first part of my CP Term and it was not very pretty.

E_T

	22-01-2003 11:18									#23
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quote: Originally posted by E_T That is VERY True. Especially if you weren't aware of a particular Poll (or discussion) that was expressing the wishes of the Population. THis had happend to me in the first part of my CP Term and it was not very pretty.

hehe, I do remember that... yeah, you got put through the ringer

And that debacle was the centerpiece of the opposition to your candidacy for DM in the next term... which lead to yet another debable... the first tied election in Apolytonian history... which the NewCon didn't have any way to solve

We survived all of that, though

	24-01-2003 01:38									#24
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This bill is PASSED!

	24-01-2003 03:11									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Kloreep This bill is PASSED!

hi ,

at last

have a nice day