24-01-2003 11:20									#31
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You cannot place a city on a tier 1 tile of another city. Hence the order given is incorrect. It should be

1. Move a settler across the rr to the polluted tile then (wait) the piece

2. Sell everything you can from (old) Frankfurt

3. Abandon (old Frankfurt)

please note that the borders redraw placing the polluted tile in German lands. If you did not pre-position the settler, it would run out of movement when it reached the polluted tile.

4. Reactivate the settler and Build (new) Frankfurt

5. Move (old) Frankfurt defenders etc to (new) Frankfurt

	24-01-2003 12:08									#32
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But that's Frankfurt SW of the tile to be settled!

Maybe I misundersand roadcage.... it happens sometimes.

	24-01-2003 13:23									#33
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Btw, don't forget to garrison the city and rush several cultural buildings in order to keep it from flipping.
I'm pretty sure that this was already said, and that you all know this, I'm just paranoid... I really don't mean to offend anyone by saying the obvious.

	24-01-2003 13:56									#34
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quote: Originally posted by roadcage I know this will get flamed, but we need to abandon Frankfurt and use one of our inventoried settlers to replace it. Turning 8 resisters requires too much of our meager forces to be worth the candle. The question that arises, is should it be replaced at the same tile, or moved slightly closer to Leipzig. By moving closer to Liepzig, we will be able to fire our Artillery at Leipzig one turn sooner. And I expect a similarly high resistor count out of Leipzig so that New Frankfurt being closer is not a problem. We will most likely be moving Leipzig as well. Greeks have been moving Northward, probably targeting Heidelburg, and the Aztecs have probably been beating on Heidelberg for some time. What I am trying to say is that it is unlikely that Heidelberg will be in blue togs when we get there so our focus beyond Leipzig should probably be some other city.

Sheesh, I go and get rid of Hamburg (and Stuttgart) and all H*ll Breaks loose, AND it had NOTHING going for it. Whereas, Frankfurt has a lot of stuff that is still there, and no one even blinks an Eyelid about getting rid of it.

I Tell you, There Ain't No Justice!!!

E_T

	24-01-2003 16:21									#35
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We were suffering from much less war weariness back then, plus these cities had considerably less citizens.
Losing a factory and a hospital ain't that bad, especially given the fact that Frankfurt is very likely to flip (close to the German capital, the city has more German culture than Apolytonian culture, it will go into disorder next turn and so on).

	24-01-2003 17:10									#36
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About Frankfurt, can we sell any improvment before we abandon the city, even with the resistance?

IMPORTANT NOTE


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(I'll print these orders to be prepared... )

	24-01-2003 19:53									#37
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Aro, my plan said sell everything you can. I believe that we can sell most of the stuff but we will find out won't we? Even if you can't sell a certain structure, it doesn't hurt to try.

E_T, the difference is that I built a consensus within the forums before the act. Sort of sugar coating the medicine.

	24-01-2003 20:29									#38
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I'm not sure if any imporvements can be sold in a resting city. But I'm fairly sure that only 1 improvement can be sold per turn, so try the most expensive improvement.

I remember people posting about creating a chain of cities to form a canal in Civ III shortly after the game was first released; perhaps this was secreatly removed in a patch?

	24-01-2003 21:47									#39
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quote: Originally posted by joncnunn I'm not sure if any imporvements can be sold in a resting city. But I'm fairly sure that only 1 improvement can be sold per turn, so try the most expensive improvement. I remember people posting about creating a chain of cities to form a canal in Civ III shortly after the game was first released; perhaps this was secreatly removed in a patch?

We can sell all improvements (except the ones we've got from a Wonder, like barracks and granaries, in our case), I've just checked in one of my games.

About the chain of cities, we can't, no with the 1.21.

	24-01-2003 22:48									#40
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As I said earlier, the move will more or less force the relocation of Leipzig as well. This city is even larger than Frankfurt and will most likely have atleast as many resisters, so abandonment (probably delayed to facilitate settler positioning) is highly likely.

Considering this and other previous city sites we crave (Cologne, Vladivostok), we need to make some more settlers.

Unfortunately, due to RL issues, I will not be able to join you at the beginning of the turnchat. I expect to be able before it ends and will join when I can.

Rest assured, I want to be with you during these exciting times, but RL is a demanding thing. And it pays the bills which allow me to play with you all.

Ssgt roadcage (retired)

	24-01-2003 22:54									#41
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quote: Originally posted by roadcage Rest assured, I want to be with you during these exciting times, but RL is a demanding thing. And it pays the bills which allow me to play with you all. Ssgt roadcage (retired)

You're right, Sarge...

	24-01-2003 23:14									#42
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I still think abandoning frankfurt is a mistake, we are loosing many people and prebuilt factroies etc. Please reconsider.
Aggie

	24-01-2003 23:25									#43
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Well we need to come to a finalized decision now, on the Frankfurt issue. I don't wish to see our first turnchat of the 8th Term be delayed because we can't decide.

The majority has obviously voted to abandon Frankfurt. But a few ( like Aggie) still maintain that it wouldn't be a good decision to abandon it.

Problem is, we need to make a decision on this the 1st or 2nd turn of the turnchat; it's not something we can wait to solve itself.

	24-01-2003 23:26									#44
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Aggie could you elaborate more on why we should keep Frankfurt standing?

	24-01-2003 23:30									#45
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In fact, we need to make a decision before we can end the 1325 AD turn.

	24-01-2003 23:36									#46
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I agree with Aro, old Frankfurt would go into disorder if more than 2 or 3 of the resisters stop resisting.

Resisting citizens count double against the normal culture-flip and have a chance of an outright revolt indepedant of culture after the first turn.

Cities in disorder also have a double chance of culture-flip and this might also increase the chance of an outright revolt if resisters are also present.

	25-01-2003 00:21									#47
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Add to that the fact that the city has more German culture than Apolytonian culture built into it, and we're in trouble.
OTOH, Neu Frankfurt, while still being dangerously close to the German capital, will not have any German culture, German resistors or unhappy citizens and will celebrate WLTPD after we join 5 workers to the city, thus minimizing the chance of a culture flip.

	25-01-2003 00:44									#48
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Not to mention our plans to move the German capital further away.

	25-01-2003 01:05									#49
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Remember all they culture formula has the ratio of cultures in it, at this point in time that ration is overwhelmingly in our favor and as more cities fall it gets more lopsided in our favor. That ratio along brings the odds of cflip to at best 10:1.
Aggie