24-01-2003 08:46									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Static23 That's what his father thought in 92.

Desert Storm was quite along time in political years from the actual Presidential election. Desert Storm II won't have that problem.

	24-01-2003 09:04									#32
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Desert Storm was quite along time in political years from the actual Presidential election. Desert Storm II won't have that problem.

That depends on when (and if) Desert Storm II: The Sequel occurs, doesn't it? If it happens within a few months, it won't be that much closer to election.

	24-01-2003 20:51									#33
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quote: That's a pretty feeble restriction Imran.

So? The court decided abortion (up to a certain time) was a constitutional right. There are pretty feeble restrictions on other constitutional rights too, but you don't complain.

quote: The undue burden does not even restrict abortions after viability, so long as one can find abortion doctors willing to perform them.

This is because there hasn't been a state that has banned abortions after viability. If one did, it probably would stand up in court.

	24-01-2003 23:20									#34
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quote: The court decided abortion (up to a certain time) was a constitutional right.

Imran,
If this is true, then why do we even need this new undue burden balancing test in PP vs. Casey?

Part of the problem in Roe v. Wade was the source of this new constitutional right to abortion. They extended a right to privacy and assumed that this right encompassed abortion.

Yet, no one has the right to abuse their children in private. How can privacy encompass a right to abortion yet not a right to abuse your own children?

quote: This is because there hasn't been a state that has banned abortions after viability. If one did, it probably would stand up in court.

Doubtful. Viability would expose how silly this standard is for personhood, more of a measure of technology than anything else.

	25-01-2003 01:42									#35
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quote: If this is true, then why do we even need this new undue burden balancing test in PP vs. Casey?

Why else? To decide if certain restrictions are allowable. If a restriction does not create an 'undue burden' to a person having an abortion than it is allowed.

quote: They extended a right to privacy and assumed that this right encompassed abortion.

In all honesty it probably did. Roe was merely the logical extention of Griswold v. Connecticut which established a constitutional right of privacy from the 'penumbra of the Constitution' (at least that is what the majority opinion said... concurrances used the 9th Amendment, which I think is a better argument).

quote: Doubtful.

According to case law, under the Federal law, I can't see why it would be doubtful. There has always (since Rpe) been an adherance to the idea that a state can restrict abortions after viability.

	25-01-2003 03:42									#36
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I'm for abortions in case of rape, but generally I'm on the fence on the whole issue. Both sides have excellent points... and I think in the end we will need a compromise, not some pro-choice or pro-life legal coup.

	25-01-2003 04:18									#37
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It's good to see the poll numbers coming back down to reality for Bush.

As for abortion: While I might not agree with a woman having a late-term or partial birth abortion without a medical necessity, I question the amount of times it actually happens. I'd like to see statistics on this because it seems stupid to me that a woman would be pregnant for 9 months and in the delivery room, just say, "oh I don't want this baby". But I don't think that government has the right to restrict it, either. Many people make the mistake of making decisions on their stance on abortion based on their love with their own children. My theory is that people think that they could never bring themselve to kill their grown children and they think that that is the equivalent of abortion.

As a pro-choice person, I would like to see less abortions. The best way to do so is to educate and promote the use of contraception... not legislation... not teaching abstinence-only... and not by scare tactics that pro-life wackos favor.

	25-01-2003 06:00									#38
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quote: It's good to see the poll numbers coming back down to reality for Bush.

58% is 'coming down to reality'? That's the same approval rating Reagan had in 1984 when he kicked the crap out of Mondale in the elections.

Though it is true that he couldn't stay at 70% forever.

	25-01-2003 06:02									#39
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quote: The best way to do so is to educate and promote the use of contraception.

Sava, the problem is with organisations like Planned Parenthood that both promote contraception and sell abortions. How can we trust PP when they make large profits off abortion?

BTW what do you mean by scare tactics?