02-02-2001 09:45									#1
	Skunkwork ability to preserve minerals Full PM-box? Change here!

The undocumented ability of skunkworks to bypass mineral loss due to production shifting: do most of you consider using this deliberately (in multiplay) for the purpose of deceiveing an opponent a cheat?

-or-

Was this feature intended by the creators?

	02-02-2001 12:24									#2
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I had actually managed to miss this ability until very recently. Pretty much doubt I will ever use it much, it can be ok for lightning switches to a war footing, but you generally get enough warning to allow you to complete and then build the cheap units and upgrade.

It is probably much more vital to a hybrid Yang (or other economically challenged faction) than anyone able to get to +2 econ.

But using it, well, I think it would be a cheat to do it in multiplay, and in sp it is already ridiculously easy to whack the ai silly.

	03-02-2001 04:00									#3
	Tired of ads?

Thanx. Anyone else?

	03-02-2001 06:58									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

As it is not on the MP cheat list, it is not considered one yet.

I would think it would be more of an undocumented feature. I can't think of many uses, unless you just happened to be surprised by an attack on a base with a skunkworks. It doesn't hurt to allow the switch, and would be balanced in MP, so there is no reason to disallow it.

	03-02-2001 11:30									#5
	Put an end to popups!

Yes, that is my opinion concerning this. Otherwise, there isn't much point in building more than one skunkworks for your entire empire (redundancy?).

Just trying to get the general consensus.

	05-02-2001 20:14									#6
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I didn't know you could actually *build* skunkworks. I have always researched the technology, but I just assumed that it was an ability that was acquired across the board. Am I missing something? Is there a patch that I need to download? I thought I D/L'ed the latest patch.

	05-02-2001 20:18									#7
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

In the lower difficulty levels you can't build it as you get free prototypes anyway. I forget which level it first shows up, the middle one I think.

	05-02-2001 21:25									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Two questions:

1) Does the computer ever build these things?

2) Does it bypass mineral loss when shifting between categories? (ie SP, units, and base enhancements)

And related to number two, what if I've changed the alphax.txt to penalize any change in production at all, does it still work?

	06-02-2001 10:27									#9
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Assuming that it was considered cheating to reap the benefits, wouldn't that in effect prohibit changing production in a base with skunkworks (after the first 10 mins) or can someone come up with a way to balance out the ill gotten gains?

------------------
John

	07-02-2001 04:39									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

At first glance I didn't really give this much thought, Big deal skunkworks avoids some min loss on a switch, but then as I thought more on the issue I can see where some human players might put this to good (or evil depending on POV) use. As akways tho' I'm intrigued that I hadn't read this before, just going to prove you always learn something.

However, I think this tidbit has some profound implications, consider no penalty due to change in category. Consider also a faction going 100% allocation to research or otherwise energy poor, then a cunning human could set up a number of skunksworks and set productions to an otherwise prototype unit and or an SP and cash crawlers in for full mineral benefit. In the same turn after the cash in, switch to an expensive facility such as Hybrids and get full min value for a crawler(s) and have to spend nary a milliwatt to get the facility next turn.

As always my feeling is if all are aware and choose to allow it, then go for it. As it stands all factions could benefit from this 'cept the poor spartans who already are hosed with respect to poor industry rating and can't build skunkworks.

Og

	07-02-2001 09:27									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I too was unaware of this feature and will try, hopefully tonight, the following: I will rush build an expensive facility at a cost of 2 energy per mineral, and then switch to an expensive military unit. If the Skunkworks is as advertised, rush builds of military units is now economically viable.

	07-02-2001 16:20									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

From what I can tell in a current SMAC 4.0 pbem game I am in, the 'skunk-effect' only works for production switching within categories.

Has anyone seen otherwise?

	09-02-2001 00:33									#14
	Tired of ads?

If you are planning to prototype one of them shiny Planet Busters, it actually pays off (mineral-wise) to build Skunkworks first. If I remember it correctly, each Planet Buster costs quite a hefty 289 minerals and an additional 50% causes it to shoot up to 436(!).