05-02-2003 04:12									#31
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

But you said "a great player with insane mad skills can out pretty much outplay any cheater", that was what I objected to..........now you seem to be saying different. Or are the bots available for qw not as good at the q3 ogc bot?

	05-02-2003 16:02									#32
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by pg you'd probably need access to the editable map files to recomplie new fixed maps.

Several unofficial map fixes are available on various websites, so most of the glitches seen in the stock maps have been fixed by fans.

quote: i thought you were just relying on spectating ppl without any hard evidence. i have to mention this though because it's really related to cheating and some people even consider it the same subject - some of these realism games are too stringent and name too many things as cheats.

Well, in the world of MoH:AA, spectating has never been called cheating (I've never encountered or heard about a such case), while I do agree that only using the spectator mode isn't a good way to get evidence about cheating, except for recoil and wall related hacks as the values can't be checked easily. I only inform the other players about a cheating player if I'm absolutely sure about it (these cases have always been related to walking under the map as you can see it in spectator mode and if you see someone's head just above the surface).

quote: the best example are the games which have started to limit your gamma settings(does mohaa do this?). that's just insane considering how much those values vary per video card, monitor, drivers, etc.

Indeed, that's very odd and in general I don't see it as acceptable. However MoH:AA and SH don't lock your gamma settings. In SH there's even an in-game monitor calibration tool for adjusting your gamma settings.

quote: of course it's telling that most games don't limit sound yet because the mob doesn't understand it very well, yet tweaked sound settings are usually much more important than anything graphical.

Indeed. Enhancing your sound effects so that you could hear some reloading metres away is much more revealing than any graphics related cheats.

	05-02-2003 18:59									#33
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Skill does get mistaken for hax sometimes, but I've played enough Counter-Strike to know when people are cheating. Since 1.5 there isn't much cheating. 1.0 and 1.3 were really bad though.

	06-02-2003 01:44									#34
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by DrSpike But you said "a great player with insane mad skills can out pretty much outplay any cheater", that was what I objected to..........now you seem to be saying different. Or are the bots available for qw not as good at the q3 ogc bot?

you can still outplay any cheater. let me clarify... there are a few places where cheats obviously help but overall they aren't that big a boost. like i said before they are a crutch which limits your skill. i've seen this many times.

basically the gist of it is since you are using an aimbot you are going to have to rely heavily on the weapons the aimbot is better with than humans mainly, lightning gun(lg), and railgun(rg). or whatever else the cheats gives you an advantage in. the best human players will still be better at everything else(usually much better). these great players will then precede to use the strength which the cheat gives you, against you. there are counter strategies for any circumstance more or less. you see this when humans play too - if someone had mad aim you play a cat and mouse game fighting around corners. effective strategy/tactics can pretty much neutralize any cheat except something like god mode.

now there maybe one case where this doesn't work and that's if you have 1 great player with cheats playing another without. this never happens though because you don't get this good by using cheats, and everything else that goes along with cheats just isn't worth it to these people. basically what i'm saying is sure cheats can help in theory give the edge over a great player but in reality it just doesn't seem to work like this. the only people who use cheats are the ones that aren't great, which is why i said skill overcomes. technically cheats could give you an advantage but it never works out like this. you never seen huge competitions online won by cheaters because they can't get away with it, nor is effective. so if you can't win using cheats doesn't skill overcome?

i'm making my brain hurt... i don't think i explained that well at all. i think i just buried myself deeper! i guess my mental illnesses are showing through once i can't think straight anymore.

	06-02-2003 03:13									#35
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I guess I know players that would give a player using the ogc bot a run for his money in a duel.......maybe.

	06-02-2003 04:04									#36
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Easy Solution:
Throwevery Player with SKill/dieRatio abnormal from the Server.
Die-hard Player can play with other Diehards if they want, but i've seen racking up on kills that were fun no more..
If you have no Challenge on a Server for God's Sake: Leave!
Give noobs a Chance! Let us play alone!
:=)

	06-02-2003 05:20									#37
	Full PM-box? Change here!

You can't ban people for being good.

	06-02-2003 05:30									#38
	Got spare money?

You betcha...

:=)

	06-02-2003 08:57									#39
	Increase Your PM Length

i only like playing with people that beat me some but that i beat them some too. quake needs a setup like warcraft 3 with rankings/etc!

	06-02-2003 12:03									#40
	Tired of ads?

pg,

indeed, there's counter strategies against people who cheat (e.g. aimbot), but they still have an advantage if they use a wallhack (which seems to be the most popular hack for MoH), so cheating is still an issue. However you're right that more talented players can cope with it, but you can't do much for people who walk under a map.

	06-02-2003 14:23									#41
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Yeah ogc has the wallhack as well.......would make it tough to beat.

	06-02-2003 18:27									#42
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by DrSpike Yeah ogc has the wallhack as well.......would make it tough to beat.

Depends on how the person uses it. But if you are aware the person is using it you can move around keeping that in mind and making sure to always keep a thick wall between you and him, if he is dumb he will eventually empty his clip at a wall that the bullets can't go through, then you can zip around the corner and kill him while he reloads. You can also lure him to where you want, specifically areas of the map where the field is more level. (ie. a large open field, where you would be able to see each other regardless)

If it's one of those people who are really blatant about it and just sit around with a sniper rifle killing people all over the map, you just need to remember to keep moving and don't try to hide - even from his team mates - because the second you stop he's going to kill you. (unless you are certain the bullet can't reach you, of course)

And simply playing with the knowledge that they always know where you are can give you an advantage. Cheaters generally think that they control the battlefield, and don't even consider that other people can be aware of their cheats and use them to form a new strategy or anticipate their actions.