23-02-2001 10:05									#1
	Zakharov: my research monkey Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Hey everyone,

I was hoping a couple of the experienced players out there could help me with a little strategical/technical question:

In my current game on a huge random map I forced Zakharov into submission kind of early (2170; he was on the other side of Miriam, who I destroyed by 2140) and then went into build-mode.

I have
-AI personalities/agendas randomized
-double blind research
-no steal tech
-tech stag. off


Even with all the conquests I still wasn't left with much room for expansion without going overseas and running into either an aggressive Lal, Yang, or Diedre ("AI personalities randomized" seemed to mean, in this game, "AI dogpiles you") Anyway, its only the AI and I have infiltration on all of them, but I want to maximize the research that Zak feeds me, saving him the time in researching something I already have and helping him research something I don't. So here's the question:

Is there any way to SELECTIVELY share research with him? When I choose "token of gratitude" and only SOME,not ALL of my research, he always asks for something that I don't want to share; other factions don't have it and I don't want him to leak it to them. The only way this would happen is through probes since he's vendetta'd against all of them (my loyal submissive ). Yes, I'm given another option but that is also undesirable for the same reasons.

So basically, SELECTIVE SHARING means I want to give him all the research that I have, minus those techs that the other factions don't have as well. And yes, I know that my fears of him leaking techs applies to the very technology that I'm hoping to benefit from by this selective sharing strategy. But the idea is that I'll have it first for a couple of turns before he leaks it to other factions.

so i've tried to contact him multiple times and suggest other things, but this doesn't work.

Does anything else work? Is this even possible? Is this a silly question?

Thanks

P.S. As an alternate strategy, perhaps if I give my monkey a typewriter and enough time he'll bang out the files for Controlled Singularity.

	23-02-2001 14:44									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

This is certainly no stupid question. I sometimes have the same problem in supporting submissive factions.
I hate to give them all tech, because they can be probed by my enemies.

Sometimes when I offer my submissives a tech, because I want to support them against our enemies and would like to give them DAP or a good weapon tech, they demand something really useless instead of the tech that would save their A$$.

But Yours is a special case, because You have Zak as a "research slave".

I could be an idea, if You have it, to give the base with the HSA away to Zak (or exchange it against another SP base, that would be no cheating in this case), and give him all your tech.
Of course, giving the HSA away would make me real headache, because submissives not always behave properly as they should, and You couldn't do any atrocities like planetbustering for the rest of the game. Additionally You would have to protect Your own bases again with probe teams.
On the other hand, this would make Your research slave immune to probing and would eliminate the risk that Your enemies steal Your tech.

"Steelborn, Starborn"

	24-02-2001 00:31									#3
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Submissive pactmates have a bad tendancy to trade away your hard-earned tech as their vendetta list is seldom the same as yours. This seems to be a worse problem than UoP (or other submissive) being hit by enemy probes.

A tech share should only be contemplated when the submissive is one turn away from a discovery. But the only way to guarantee that your submissive pactmate will get a discovery that you don't already have is to give him all of your tech.

	24-02-2001 01:56									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Could you not protect his bases from enemy probes with your own probe teams. I'm not sure if you can leave probe teams in Pact Mate bases. If not, then position three or four probe teams around each base to protect from enemy probe team incursions and then you can safely give him the techs you are concerned he may lose.

Never tried it myself, but it might work.

	24-02-2001 02:28									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

It is a great idea to station a probe or two, and a stout defender in Zaks bases. Then give him all your tech, and maybe build him a few good science bases and then give them away too!

You will benefit from his discoveries, economic trade, and even maybe a bit from his military. A bit of work to build those probes, but well worth it.

Make sure you help him with his military aims, and share plans regularly. That way he isn't likely to sue for peace by giving away tech with any of your rivals.

	24-02-2001 09:39									#6
	Increase the size of your Attachments

big_canuk, do you have any luck getting your submissive to declare war on your enemies? I usually get a message like, sure, but only if you give me a hugely prohibitive amount of cash. I have much better luck telling them to lay off attacking a friend, they seem to disagree (due to accepting cash for a faction's destruction) only seldom.

	24-02-2001 14:42									#7
	Remove this text

What? Ask nicely?!
They are submissives, they'll declare war on your enemy or you'll squash them! As far as I can tell a submissive has to do anything you ask, as long as you threaten them. Altough the outcome isn't always as favourable as if you had been fair, try buying a submissives base, it becomes one of your bases. Now try ordering them to give you a base, they still give it up but it has the "captured base" properties.

Also submissives can't do anything about your probe actions, so frame your enemy for a probe action on your submissive, if you suceed, great! if you fail, no loss. Peace-time probe actions tend to really screw up future diplomacy between factions so with skillfull framings your pet faction will feel betrayed by all the other factions, and pretty much refuse to do diplomacy with them.

As for asking another faction to make peace with your friend, it works virtually every time regardless of diplomatic stance.

	25-02-2001 05:12									#8
	Got spare money?

Redfred:

I have good luck with submissives right after they submit. After a few turns I have the same experience as you, so I do as Blake suggests. Don't ask them nicely. But they do not always comply.