10-02-2003 15:56									#1
	Lucky Civs Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

This question is not particulary related to strategy, but it does determine one's attitude to play...

The question is, pauses for dramatic effect, do you play with one civ/leader that you consider lucky? For me, I almost always play Persians/Xeres. With anyone else I tend not to be as lucky. Irrational I know, but it works for me.

For the record I a too lazy to customise a Civ

	10-02-2003 16:10									#2
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Nope - I avoid the dark blue civs - find them hard to see, but otherwise anything goes

Most frequently play Carthaginian

SG[1]

	10-02-2003 16:14									#3
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Nahhhh... never even considered it. There is no "lucky" civ in the game.

It does make sense to take a civ that you don't want to play against. If you hate playing against expansionist civs or against science oriented civs, it does indeed make sense to play one of them to increase the likelyhood of less of them in the game against you.

But to your point... Part of your success in any game is your mental attitude. If you think you are going to fail, you probably will So you probably do gain an advantage by picking a civ you think you will do better with. Just simple human nature

	10-02-2003 16:23									#4
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Luck can be related to starting techs. Avoid the militaristic civs that tend to start with warlike techs which are off the Monarchy path.

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SG(2)

	10-02-2003 18:20									#5
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Or play MP, where if the host gets a tech or two..........
RESTART.

	10-02-2003 19:04									#6
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That's what I like about MP. With humans playing the civs, it really makes no difference. Well, with the exception of the turn order... so i guess it does make a difference

	11-02-2003 10:31									#7
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first to wonders, last to react to the barbs....whites dilemma

the rest reat to barbs, but fall further down the list when it comes to wonders/kings on the same turn...

and then of course there is the host customization thingy that throws some hosts into a frenzy

	11-02-2003 12:55									#8
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I play with the English 90% of the time. I don't consider they are lucky. It's simply that I have customised the names of the cities and the order they are built in. I like to build the Roman cities before the Saxon ones and so on.

I rarely play with the Aztecs - all their cities sound the same to me.

I never thought of choosing the civ I don't want to play against - mind you, in my games there never seems to be a shortage of AI civs queueing up to sneak attack me.

RJM at Sleepers

	11-02-2003 13:56									#9
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quote: Originally posted by rjmatsleepers I like to build the Roman cities before the Saxon ones and so on. RJM at Sleepers

...so by the time Milton Keynes comes in you know you've got a sleaze ....

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SG(2)

	11-02-2003 14:55									#10
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quote: Originally posted by rjmatsleepers I rarely play with the Aztecs - all their cities sound the same to me.

SO TRUE...
I hate playing the Aztecs. I end up renaming ANY city I start because I would like to have SOME CLUE to which city is which.

	11-02-2003 15:16									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits ...so by the time Milton Keynes comes in you know you've got a sleaze .... ----------------- SG(2)

Spoken like a true ICSer.

	12-02-2003 02:57									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Ming SO TRUE... I hate playing the Aztecs. I end up renaming ANY city I start because I would like to have SOME CLUE to which city is which.

Having a clue about where different cities are relative to the core and to the compass led me to make a 'map'. It is based on cities in the area where I now live, in some cases, neighborhoods in bigger cities. Anything to make the game map recognizable.

As for which civ to play, it doesn't seem to matter. Luck is the residue of a great design...or so the saying goes.

Monk

	12-02-2003 11:04									#13
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yes, i always tend to start with the same 10 cities (baseball stadiums) and then take it from there...these i know will need the all important caravan sleeze

	12-02-2003 13:10									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits ...so by the time Milton Keynes comes in you know you've got a sleaze .... ----------------- SG(2)

Actually the Milton Keynes is last but one, followed by Basildon. But I've never played a sufficiently sleazey game to reach them

RJM at Sleepers

	12-02-2003 19:58									#15
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The higher 'up' in the play order that a Civ is (white-highest, purple-lowest) plays a role in determining how good the starting land will be. The white Civ is placed first, giving it the best land... and so on down to purple. On large and medium maps this isn't usually an issue, but on small maps, the purple Civ sometimes gets to start at one of the poles, or an otherwise poor location.

If you look in the GL under 'starting techs', there is a good analysis by the SG's regarding which colour Civs are most likely to get starting techs, and which techs are most likely if you do get starting techs.

And of course, if want to speed up your science acquisition rate, the colour of the Civ you're playing as will affect which Civs you should be giving away techs to (assuming you are 'Supreme'). Again, the GL should have the relevant info on the 'key civ' concept.

So... depending on what strategy you like... there may be one or two Civs that have characteristics that fit well into that strategy, and are thus 'lucky' for you

edit: Both threads still work - 'techs, starting', and 'beakers - the key to tech gifting'.

I don't have a favorite Civ. I used to play as the Americans or Chinese to get starting techs, but I seldom worry about that anymore.

	13-02-2003 02:20									#16
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I just play the mongols...they were a warrior race...i am a warrior.....

but really it makes no difference to me, especially since i reset until there are no techs when i play the ai....

though i have played out some starts where i had tech, all that told me was there were ciites to take over close by

	13-02-2003 02:35									#17
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Precisely... although the SG's research did indicate, all other things being equal, that the light blue civs do seem to get more techs.

	13-02-2003 03:06									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man The higher 'up' in the play order that a Civ is (white-highest, purple-lowest) plays a role in determining how good the starting land will be. The white Civ is placed first, giving it the best land...

While you are indeed correct... sometimes the computer and you don't agree on what the "best" land is

Also... in a MP game with more than two players... It will in many cases place the White Civ in the middle of the board... surrounded by everybody else

	13-02-2003 03:15									#19
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If you play with more than one continent white also often cannot use black map clicking......which is another potential disadvantage.

	13-02-2003 03:31									#20
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Yes, some turns it worked and some turns it didn't. We were never able to figure out what the pattern/cause of that was. I haven't played white in quite a while so I had forgotten about that.

And I agree with Ming that what the software considers a good starting position doesn't always match my definition.

	13-02-2003 07:17									#21
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the software determines good starts by the amount of food IIRC...which in MP is usually the least important thing on my list....

i am looking for trade, with ONE or two good squares...not abunch of grass with crap around them..

	13-02-2003 11:01									#22
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Yeah... a four pattern with all food, and no production or trade anywhere to be seen. And the AI is licking it's chops...

	13-02-2003 18:27									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Ming Yeah... a four pattern with all food, and no production or trade anywhere to be seen. And the AI is licking it's chops...

And Ming is saying "THIS BLOWWWWWWSSSSS"

	13-02-2003 19:36									#24
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quote: Originally posted by rah And I agree with Ming that what the software considers a good starting position doesn't always match my definition.

Clearly I should have qualified my observation that white gets the 'best' land. Obviously 'best' is best to the AIs reasoning.

Still, I've occasionally been stuck on a pole with an orange Civ... and several times with purple. White may not get any objectively better land than say, green or yellow, but they never seem to get a polar start, either.

So what's the 'ideal' start for everyone? Trade specials for sure... rivered grass with a couple of golds/whales/wines in the radius?

Last night I started a game with a 3 whale/1 pheasant starting location... founded a second city, wandered a bit, and put my third city down on another 3 whale site. To me, that's a great start - many other good sites around, too.

	13-02-2003 20:09									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man So what's the 'ideal' start for everyone? Trade specials for sure... rivered grass with a couple of golds/whales/wines in the radius? Last night I started a game with a 3 whale/1 pheasant starting location... founded a second city, wandered a bit, and put my third city down on another 3 whale site. To me, that's a great start - many other good sites around, too.

Hehe don't think many would cry over that start........though of course there are people who cry over their start by rote no matter what they get.

	13-02-2003 20:32									#26
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I only got three whales :sob:

SG[1]

	13-02-2003 20:37									#27
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In MP games... whining is not only expected, it's required

	13-02-2003 20:42									#28
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quote: Originally posted by DrSpike Hehe don't think many would cry over that start........though of course there are people who cry over their start by rote no matter what they get.

The only crying I would do would involve the fact that the 1st city wasn't placed until @3400BC, and the 3d city didn't get put down until @2500 BC due to a lot of wandering picking up huts

Otherwise, had I been able to found on both of those 2 sites before 3500BC, I don't see why I couldn't get all the early wonders and Monarchy before 3000

Anyway that game will have to be put aside in favour of the succession turns I promised to play

	13-02-2003 20:49									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Ming In MP games... whining is not only expected, it's required

Hehe a necessary skill perhaps. I do like going back over afterwards and correlating icq/king chat whining with actual experience. It is often very amusing.

*cough* Markus *cough*.

	13-02-2003 22:36									#30
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Lucky Civs?

Ugh mee,i play all (even barbiaans?!with civ2hack)

But really,in civ2, i think that there has no ONE...

maybe it whoos leader is best... But anyway?
Someone is better ships and other use Air units good
but i say "mix is best,or it is?"

And some ones builds good deffended cities! With city walls and missiles and SDI! and lot of mechings and air units...