11-02-2003 22:09									#1
	AI expansionism & tech rate vs diff level Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

to all of the testers having played/playing a pre-release copy of the game, like DanQ, JonahFalcon and other selected individuals, I want to know if you can share some information about the AI behavior ( and why not the ships and battle management, not much discussed yet in the previews...). Is the AI NOT cheating on default setting ( normal ), or is it a bit ??? At hard, is it cheating like in Civ III??? Are the AI empires expanding much faster than the human player all conditions being equal ?? Does a AI declares war on you too much often and suddenly, out of a whim ? Can YOU, or can the AI achieve a significant tech lead or is this well balanced?? How is the global balancing for...only 3 diff levels???

Are you really at disadvantage when NOT being an Orion Senate member? By HOW MUCH is your room for expansion really open next to a starting near the center? Well, enough of my questions for now.......I just can't wait for the game...

	11-02-2003 22:12									#2
	Inflate your Upload Space

There are 4 difficulty levels.

	11-02-2003 22:13									#3
	Full PM-box? Change here!

since MOO3 is very data-obscure, it's hard to say, but it would appear that the AI does not "cheat" as such. perhaps on impossible, but certainly not on the other levels that i have observed.

	12-02-2003 04:59									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

The best way to avoid the AI cheating is to play MP.

	12-02-2003 09:48									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by patrickjb53 The best way to avoid the AI cheating is to play MP.

Then you get to deal with cheating humans instead.

	12-02-2003 10:25									#6
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Stuie Then you get to deal with cheating humans instead.

Sad but true.

	12-02-2003 13:52									#7
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

How exactly do you cheat on MP?

	12-02-2003 19:01									#8
	Full PM-box? Change here!

People will find ways. They always do.

It'll be a matter of finding the right people for MP games...

	13-02-2003 03:57									#9
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Daz How exactly do you cheat on MP?

We are hijacking the thread, but this is important.
Stuie and viciouscycle are right: this is the sad reality of MP playing; that's why I still prefer a good SP with a decent AI. There's a lot of crackpots out there; they are skilled, they have the knowledge of coding, modding, altering the rules of a game, in some games they can hack your CD key. High profiles FPS and action games like UT 2003 are simply unplayable on MP servers because of the cheats - cheat protection, even fixed later on, seems to never catch on. It's another debate.

I'm more interested about MoO3's AI...

	13-02-2003 04:29									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

@Master Marcus: Excellent reply.

I only play MP with friends because I hate running into strangers who think it's fun to win by hacking a game. It is already hard enough to find people who are willing to spend a whole day gaming with you and won't run off if something comes up or they are losing.

That's also why I am very interested in a game's AI.

	13-02-2003 13:14									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I never play MP. I like it when the AI is intelligent though thats not often the case. It is somewhat understandable cause the AI simply cannot correctly answer all the possible situations that occur.

What I dont like is have a dumb AI for the sake of it not cheating. Id rather have it cheat and be competetive than be easy beatable on impossible.

	13-02-2003 16:42									#12
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Having multiplayer mode where people can hop in and out of the game is a definite advantage, especially if it turns out that the AI can do a passable job of running an empire if the human opponent bails when he loses his first planet.

	14-02-2003 20:32									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

MP only in LAN then?

	15-02-2003 04:32									#14
	Inflate your Upload Space

Ahh Seems you all saw the Wisdom in my Words and decided to sink away in shame.

	15-02-2003 14:46									#15
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

From the news items, 11 Feb:

quote: Nate Birkholz has posted some odds and ends on MacGamer (MG) regarding the Macintosh port of Master of Orion III in recent days. Developed by MacSoft, this IG representative confirmed that like its PC parent the port will use GameSpy Arcade as its in-game multiplayer browser. This will allow for cross-platform games over the Internet.

	26-02-2003 16:00									#16
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

In Civ 3 you can use some of the computer cheating to your advanger. It than computer control play built cities in a illogical location it can because there is than inportent Stragic resoure locate somewhere in the city radius.

	26-02-2003 16:26									#17
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

By the way, you MUST have computer opponents along with humans in MP, so you can get fair trades. Keep in mind you don't get ALL the techs possible, and some must be acquired from other players -- and computer players won't freeze you out like human players.

As far as cheating - if you're REALLY paranoid about cheaters, the solution is obvious: play with people you KNOW.

	26-02-2003 17:53									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by JonahFalcon By the way, you MUST have computer opponents along with humans in MP, so you can get fair trades. Keep in mind you don't get ALL the techs possible, and some must be acquired from other players -- and computer players won't freeze you out like human players. As far as cheating - if you're REALLY paranoid about cheaters, the solution is obvious: play with people you KNOW.

Eh? That's not a real requirement, just your own suggestion, right?

I prefer to play these games with no computer opponents, they usually just end up being treated as fodder for easy territory and techs.

And why do you have to have computers for fair trades? Quite the opposite, I think - the AI is much more easy to exploit in diplomacy then any human is.

	26-02-2003 18:37									#19
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Exactly. I'd never give anyone a good deal in MP. If they don't have x tech - then they'd better pay for it.

-Jam

	26-02-2003 21:39									#20
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I think the AI tends to treat techs on a "cost" basis rather than an "effect" basis in games. So that level 14 environmental tech will be tradeable with this level 14 energy tech plus a little sweetener even if under present circumstances that tech will be only mildly useful while the energy tech will prove vital. A human player is far more astute at guaging relative worth based on the current in game circumstances. Which gives you the "fairer" trade will depend entirely on your point of view.