17-02-2003 02:09									#61
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc quote: increased interdependence What does that have to do with anything? It isn't like economic interdependence staved off WWI. [/nitpicking]

There's somewhat more interdependence the days- after all, the EU has made us into a signle market. Supposedly.

	17-02-2003 02:09									#62
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My personal one-word theory is "nukes".





What?

	17-02-2003 02:13									#63
	Got spare money?

Buck your entire list was a direct result of a unifying presence of American troops.

	17-02-2003 02:13									#64
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Single market?
So what? What has that to do with the price of tea in...China ?

	17-02-2003 02:14									#65
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quote: Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn Ok, its obvious English isn't your first language as your miscomprehension of Sloww's original argument is the main cause of the misunderstanding and your little hissy-fit. So I'll sum up his argument now, slooooooowly..... Sloww thinks that US troops should be withdrawn from European (etc) countries. He thinks that by stationing troops in Europe (at the US's expense), it allows those host countries to spend money they would otherwise spend on defense on other things. By removing troops, those countries are more or less on their own. He never said there was a war being "postponed", but in the event of any kind of threat (whenever or whatever that may be), those countries would have to rely more heavily on their own capital (which means money in english) rather than mooching under the American safety net. Clearer?

Petty insults on my English aside, you should have paid more attention. I even made sure to quote all posts so that people can see who I'm shouting at.
First, the "postponed" issue was with Lancer, which you obviously failed to notice.
Second, my issue with Sloww boiled down to me accusing him of gloating in his OP and then acting as if he hadn't done it, which you also should have noticed but didn't.

	17-02-2003 02:24									#66
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JimmyCracksCorn... see you in a week. Enjoy your restriction. And next time, read before you type.

	17-02-2003 02:26									#67
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Gloated ? I missed that, I guess.
JimmyCracksCorn understood to perfection exactly what I was saying, not that he shouuldn't have understood.
It was pretty clear and consise, IMO.

	17-02-2003 02:32									#68
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand Gloated ? I missed that, I guess. JimmyCracksCorn understood to perfection exactly what I was saying, not that he shouuldn't have understood. It was pretty clear and consise, IMO.

"See how the former host country feel then."

I have a very hard time believing that was anything but gloating (or "throwing your toys out of the pram" sort of gloating, in case there's a better word for it), especially in such a short post as your OP.

I trust you can find the post where I said this the first time.

	17-02-2003 02:37									#69
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For once, I agree with Sloww.

Leave. We don't need you.

	17-02-2003 02:37									#70
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It's easier to trust people when thereis an authority to prevent people from hurting each other. When you remove that authority mistrust may increase. That's why Europe has been able to mend their wounds.

	17-02-2003 02:37									#71
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker Buck your entire list was a direct result of a unifying presence of American troops.

Unifying certainly (because of the superpower dichotomy going on, and the strategic importance of alliance with america and their troups on your front line), pacifying, no.

America could have withdrawn its troops in about 1955 (or possibly even a few years earlier) without western europe falling out with each other. They'd have been angry with the US, sure, and it would have been a tactically stupid move to make at the height of the Cold War, but I can't see France and Germany entering a war since then because of that move. Except for a few years before the formation of the BRD, the troops never had an active role in keeping squabbles down whether in the public or the government. It was hardly the threat of an american invation that kept France and Germany in line, was it?

	17-02-2003 02:40									#72
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quote: Originally posted by DuncanK It's easier to trust people when thereis an authority to prevent people from hurting each other. When you remove that authority mistrust may increase. That's why Europe has been able to mend their wounds.

And you're claiming there was such an authority in Europe after the second world war... and that this authority was the US?

The US certainly did not have the desire to lay down the law at anyone in the age of the Marshall plan.

	17-02-2003 02:41									#73
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That's strategic, not tactical Buck.

For the record, I am a member of Pedants Anonymous.

	17-02-2003 02:44									#74
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No, you're saying timing is key, Buck?
I'm saying, I don't care on iota about timing.
Spiffor and Jaakko are demonstrating to a "T" why I have this opinion.
NOT a personal attack, just a statement of fact.

You can be cocky, right now.

	17-02-2003 03:03									#75
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand Spiffor and Jaakko are demonstrating to a "T" why I have this opinion.

Did I demonstrate something ? I thought I was just stating my agreement with you

	17-02-2003 03:06									#76
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand No, you're saying timing is key, Buck? I'm saying, I don't care on iota about timing. Spiffor and Jaakko are demonstrating to a "T" why I have this opinion. NOT a personal attack, just a statement of fact. You can be cocky, right now.

What's so wrong with my opinion? I've never said a bad word about the troops themselves.

	17-02-2003 03:09									#77
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Did I demonstrate something ? I thought I was just stating my agreement with you

"Leave. We don't need you"

I read this as an antagonistic statement.

	17-02-2003 03:12									#78
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Uh right Sloww. I was carried away by all the antagonism my country got these days. I should have said :
"Please do so. There is no need for American troops on German ground anymore"

	17-02-2003 03:34									#79
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Well Buck, your whole argument relies on the optimism of Eurocom to behave himself. Given the track record, I am not so optimistic.

A recent example is the crap that went on in the Balkans when the Commie overlords left town. "Hey, we haven't killed each other in 50 years well now I'm getting a little sentimental for the old days."

Of course US comes in again and pacifies the situation.

I also doubt the Turks and Greeks wouldn't be fighting if the US weren't around.

	17-02-2003 03:46									#80
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Ted, we pull outa europe and Apolyton will end up being administrated by DanQ and Otmar the Turk. Instread of bannings we'll have virtual stonings, but besides that everything will remain fairly balkan around here.

I assume the Turks would win that fight?

	17-02-2003 03:50									#81
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Ok, lets admit it. There was time when US troops had very important role in securing europes freedom. We have to give you credit for that. Then again decade after the fall of soviet empire, we should seriously rethink the need for US troops in europe. I agree with Spiffor in this, your boys and girls should return home from a mission accomplished. Thank you and goodbye.

---theres something wrong with the replying?---

Last edited by laurentius on 17-02-2003 at 04:17

	17-02-2003 03:53									#82
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triple post

Last edited by laurentius on 17-02-2003 at 04:14

	17-02-2003 04:01									#83
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You know who leads the World in executions?
China. More than the rest of the World combined.
And murder isn't necessarily the crime that will get one executed. Talking, for instance will do the trick.

Little trivia for the day.

But that's ok. Down with USA.

	17-02-2003 04:06									#84
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dreaded dp.

	17-02-2003 04:06									#85
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triple post

Last edited by laurentius on 17-02-2003 at 04:13

	17-02-2003 04:11									#86
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer Ted, we pull outa europe and Apolyton will end up being administrated by DanQ and Otmar the Turk. Instread of bannings we'll have virtual stonings, but besides that everything will remain fairly balkan around here. I assume the Turks would win that fight?

Again, I offer full asylum for all Turkish hotties who need to leave the country.

	17-02-2003 04:12									#87
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Gladly, laurentius.

	17-02-2003 04:13									#88
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quote: Originally posted by laurentius Ok, lets admit it. The was time when US troops had very important role in securing europes freedom. We have to give you credit for that. Then again decade after the fall of soviet empire, we should seriously rethink the need for US troops in europe. I agree with Spiffor in this, your boys and girls should return home from a mission accomplished. Thank you and goodbye.

I got no problem with that, though, if indeed there are going to be bases in Poland, I think that's a good thing. Certainly there is no need for a US presence in Deutschland, however.

Finns have done a commendable job of behaving themselves and beating up Soviets by the way.

	17-02-2003 04:15									#89
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Also, Viking Eurocom is the only one that can claim being civilized due to his own accord.

	17-02-2003 04:18									#90
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why is the world afraid to stand up to bush? it seems like most countries and their populations oppose war as do many ppl within the US....why can't we all just stand up to him? how long till the next election?