19-02-2003 19:56									#91
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"I take it this is least your 2nd marriage?"

Nope, only one in this incanation.

	19-02-2003 19:56									#92
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I tend to think that people who go on marches full stop are a bit whacko.

Ok the big crowds wich got rid of the Rummanian bloke and similar such things are ok. But I hate it when pople march and burn effigies and take theri kids as if they automaticaly support their view

	19-02-2003 20:14									#93
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quote: Originally posted by DetroitDave Yeah, I stumbled upon a pro-war rally just outside town. All those beer-swilling, NASCAR watching, mullet wearing wackos were sporting signs like "nuke Baghdad, Osama/saddam partners in crime, Anti-war/anti-patriot." I never saw such a concentration of loonies. Then again, I wouldn't expect anything less of the pro-war movement.

Wow, that's scary. It's one thing to stand by and let it happen, it's another to get off your ass and support the mass destruction of another group of people. Propoganda must be really strong for a bunch of uneducated people to support the deaths of a group of people they've never met and have little knowledge about.

MarkG - that picture was scary

	19-02-2003 20:24									#94
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Orange, I was only using that as an illustration of how anti-war movements are stereotyped. On this board alone, someone anti-war like me has been described as everything from a "hoodlum" to a commie. It can cut both ways.

	19-02-2003 20:25									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola "I take it this is least your 2nd marriage?" Nope, only one in this incanation.

Did you feel the draft as that passed over your head?
I was being smartass about your "13 year old son and wife".
You know, like she's 13, too.

	19-02-2003 20:29									#96
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Ok, so slightly more than half of the American participants in the survey said they would support war against Iraq, even at the cost of alienating our allies? I would also like to know the demographics of these survey participants (gender, economic class, ethnicity/race, and religion). That would really reveal what kind of cross-section we're talking about here.

Why does it matter, 66% is 66% regardless of how it is made up.

Do you not get it. The majority of the American people are with Bush on this issue.
The usual vocal minority, get all the press.
But I believe that most western democratic countries, who have suffered through inumerable protest marches, are now coming to realise that the protest movement (of whatever it is about) does not represent the majority view.
I believe, the vast majority of people are now starting to simply ignore news on protests, except for the novelty value, and are forming their own opinion.

	19-02-2003 20:36									#97
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71% support. So you minority people get over it.

	19-02-2003 20:46									#98
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Sloww, a great majority of that 71% are those "beer-swilling, NASCAR watching, mullet wearing wackos" Detroit Dave was talking about. I don't really give a sh1t what these people think. And just because something is popular, or supported by the majority, doesn't make it right. Plus, polls are of small sample sizes and not even close to 0.01% of the total American population.

	19-02-2003 20:49									#99
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quote: Originally posted by Sava Sloww, a great majority of that 71% are those "beer-swilling, NASCAR watching, mullet wearing wackos" Detroit Dave was talking about. I don't really give a sh1t what these people think. And just because something is popular, or supported by the majority, doesn't make it right. Plus, polls are of small sample sizes and not even close to 0.01% of the total American population.

whenever polls don't support someones views that bleat on about sample sizes.

If they were wrong political parties wouldn't use them

	19-02-2003 21:01									#100
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Sure, political parties are bastions of honesty and good will!

I wouldn't pay attention to polls even if they showed majority support for Bush being spanked in public. IMO most polls are rigged to show the results the pollsters are looking for.

	19-02-2003 21:10									#101
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What DO you pay attention to?

	19-02-2003 21:14									#102
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I try to find as much information on a subject and come up with my own conclusion. I pity those that treat biased news/polls like the Holy Grail.

	19-02-2003 21:20									#103
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Statistics are mostly meaningless, I will agree.
Anyone can manipulate to illustrate their side.

	19-02-2003 21:21									#104
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While the worldwide demonstrations were impressive they only included a very small percentage of the worlds population. Bush cannot dictate policy to a group that screams the loudest thats just retarded...His job is not to do something that everyone aggrees to, his job is to protect the United States, Her interests, and her population. Those that HAVE rosen up against the possible invasion do so because it has become a popular sentiment. Strange how those that flee from Iraq and have first hand accounts of the atrocities that go on their are pro-regime change...but others that barely read the news stories and sit in the safety at their home and countrie are against it.

	19-02-2003 21:22									#105
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Sloww and I agree!

Attachment: champagne-lg.jpg
This has been downloaded 71 time(s).

	19-02-2003 21:26									#106
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I posted this in the other thread... due to a lack of a single Iraq thread, I must cut and paste.

quote: I'm not simply against the war because I'm a hippie peacenik... Here are my reasons for being against the war. 1. 100 billion dollar+ price tag 2. American lives at risk 3. Hatred towards America it will spawn 4. Possibility for sparking a greater conflict 5. Possibility of Saddam launching a WoMD against someone before he dies 6. Bush's motives 7. What happens to Iraq afterwards I'm not convinced that the end result of going after Saddam is worth the price we are going to pay for the war. It's a results vs rewards situation for me. Anytime a politician wants something like this so bad, I get suspicious.

I don't care about how many people protest. I don't care about public support for the war. I don't care about biased polls. I just wish the media, the Bush admin, or SOMEONE would just address these 7 points. That's what we should be talking about. Public opinion is irrelevant. The public (including myself) isn't privy to the information needed to make an intelligent decision anyways. I wish there was a more open discussion of my concerns.

	19-02-2003 21:27									#107
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"His job is not to do something that everyone aggrees to"

Uh huh, right. Like pleasing all, always, is even a reasonable expectation.
Pass the doob over to me, Bogart.

	19-02-2003 21:37									#108
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Did you not read it right are do you just need a hit...? Read it again then see if I'm smoking da doobie.

	19-02-2003 21:46									#109
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Obviously, DF and others believe that we should run the country on the basis of opinion polls, even if the whims of people are incredibly malleable.

We elect officials to speak for us. To make decisions on larger issues.

That's what they get paid to do.

If you disagree with the decisions they make, vote them out of office.

Pretty simple stuff.

-=Vel=-

	19-02-2003 21:57									#110
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The problem with our elected officials, as of late, is that there has been a deafening silence in debating the merits and drawbacks of the impending war.

This recent speech by Robert Byrd shows how passive our representatives have been.

	19-02-2003 22:05									#111
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quote: Originally posted by DetroitDave The problem with our elected officials, as of late, is that there has been a deafening silence in debating the merits and drawbacks of the impending war.

Shouldn't they have done that before voting to give him the power to wage war?

	19-02-2003 22:20									#112
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75% of all statistics are fake

	19-02-2003 22:22									#113
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90% of them are also made up on the spot.

	19-02-2003 22:26									#114
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95% percent of statistics are asking a biased question
looking for a predetermined answer.

	19-02-2003 23:00									#115
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DD, people vote guys like Robert Byrd into office because they want the influence his seniority gets the state. They aren't thinking about his stance on issues. They aren't thinking one inch beyond their own noses.

	19-02-2003 23:18									#116
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Anyone have a link to the original news article that was posted?

	20-02-2003 08:51									#117
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quote: Originally posted by CICSMaster Why does it matter, 66% is 66% regardless of how it is made up. Do you not get it. The majority of the American people are with Bush on this issue. The usual vocal minority, get all the press. But I believe that most western democratic countries, who have suffered through inumerable protest marches, are now coming to realise that the protest movement (of whatever it is about) does not represent the majority view. I believe, the vast majority of people are now starting to simply ignore news on protests, except for the novelty value, and are forming their own opinion.

I would like to know the demographics of the voters in this poll because I want to see how diverse these voters are.

Isn't it the case that the more diverse the voters are in any poll, the more of a legitimate cross-section you have of the society?

	20-02-2003 08:56									#118
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Isn't it the case that the more diverse the voters are in any poll, the more of a legitimate cross-section you have of the society?

No. The most accurate polls are random samples.

	20-02-2003 09:14									#119
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov No. The most accurate polls are random samples.

Right, but the more randomly a poll is conducted, doesn't that increase the chances of greater diversity among voters?

So really randomness and diversity of voters are somewhat interrelated?

	20-02-2003 10:42									#120
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So no one has the source article?