26-02-2003 18:03									#31
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Are we allowed to sell Literature to others?
(Appologies on being ignorant on these matters, but as stated before, )

	26-02-2003 18:52									#32
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Yes, we are... but of course, RP can sell CoL as well, so we need to make sure we've got deals with everyone before releasing it to them...

DeepO

	26-02-2003 19:04									#33
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We should hold on to it then, for another turn or so?
(maybe next time, instead of saying "we will have X tech in 1 turn" we should say "(very) soon".)

Being a little bit more abstract will give us more options without having to resort to any "dirty tactics"

	26-02-2003 19:43									#34
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ND responded on our CoL offer. See diplomacy thread.

	26-02-2003 19:55									#35
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Re: ND's message,
Their proposal sounds interesting. Such a trade would be very fair, but there remains the matter of trust. On the other hand, if we ask for reassurance (a large sum of gold to assure that they'll give us literature, to be returned when they do), we could offend ND, and ruin a good start on a profitable trust-based relationship.
Regarding the matter of climax and tension, I suggest that we convey the message that we are at peace with Vox, and our relations have remained stable for a long duration and we expect them to continue this way (it's important that we tell others that we're in peace, because nations in war are often easy prey IMHO), but we absolutely must not say a word about our share-all-techs agreement with Vox.

Btw,

quote: (our scouts reported of some people, which raped the women and totured the children)

Now what is so wrong with Lux tutoring their children?
Seriously, ND seems to have poor English (e.g. 'diskuss', 'sientistical'). Perhaps we should review the prospects of communicating with ND in German. It would certainly make their ambassadors much more comfortable, and improve our communication.

	26-02-2003 19:58									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Perhaps we should review the prospects of communicating with ND in German. It would certainly make their ambassadors much more comfortable, and improve our communication.

I can see why we might want to do this, but would that make Sir Ralph the only people able to write to them? Or can DeepO or Alva speak German too? They may have mentioned it already somewhere, but I've forgotten.

	26-02-2003 20:00									#37
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I just noticed that RP also offered Literature for CoL. We have little time left... I suggest that we use this time to find out if either team would be interested in a gold for CoL deal instead, and thus trade CoL for Lit. with one team, and CoL for gold with another, unless someone has a better idea.
I'd support delaying the save as much as needed (we have up to 24 hours) in order to finalize the optimal deals.

	26-02-2003 20:11									#38
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quote: Or can DeepO or Alva speak German too?

Although i understand it reasonably (dutch and german are vaguely similer), my writing is by no means good enough.

In fact the last time I tried it, I got laughed at

	26-02-2003 20:13									#39
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Shall I forward a small message to ND we have no need for literature?
This gives them the chance to come up with something else.

	26-02-2003 20:25									#40
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quote: Originally posted by FrustratedPoet I can see why we might want to do this, but would that make Sir Ralph the only people able to write to them?

I don't think this is much of a problem, if he can translate German to English reliably enough so we can all understand, and if chats can be held in English.
And for the rest of the team, there is always Altavista's Babel Fish. I heard that its German to English translation software is very reliable... though we should never trust the translation of important diplomatic letters to a computer.

	26-02-2003 20:30									#41
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quote: Originally posted by alva Shall I forward a small message to ND we have no need for literature? This gives them the chance to come up with something else.

Yes, definitely. If we're lucky they might offer us gold instead, and then we can have Literature from RP, Map Making from GoW and gold from ND in exchange for CoL. Sweeeet...

	26-02-2003 20:33									#42
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Again, if no one object, I will send this one soon.

quote: quote: Dear Sir Ralph, it’s me again. I thought about your offer of Code of Law. What do you think of this deal? Now, you gift us the Code of Law, and when we research Literature (should be in a few turns) we gift you this for totaly free. I know that your people doesn’t know if they can trust us, but well, this is a great opportunity to develope the friendship between our nations ( I spoke about this in my last letter). Sincerely Murkel Greetings Murkel, I hope all is well with your formal ambassador Picahula? I pray the Gods each day he has not fallen into the hands of those ill minded barbarians, or even worsen those devilish Luxians. Since time is somewhat of the urgence I will come to the matter right away. Although your offer is very much appreciated, I regret to have to tell you that it is not really the deal we are looking for. We have news of travelers who are teaching us these very things you are talking about. Therefore I have to bother you again, and ask you whether your people are willing to offer something different for our discovery? As to the matter of language, it is a bit strange isn’t it? Our languages are very similar, both in-game and in real life (I'm from Antwerp, Belgium). Yet the difference is too big for the both of us to use our mother tongue. However we do have someone who has mastered your language and is able to converse to all of us using some Anglo-Saxon version. So if you feel uncertain about anything, feel free to contact Sir Ralph. My friend, I see my dinner is ready and therefore I have to leave. I hope to hear from you soon, until then goodbye and may your journey be prosperous and safe. Alva of Gathering storm,

edit:
some spelling and grammer corrected by FP - I hope you don't mind, mate.

Edit; I can use all the help I can get, but you missed another I have now corrected.

	26-02-2003 20:43									#43
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Looking good.

	26-02-2003 20:52									#44
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Alva, we have to make a thing clear, am I the Ambassador to ND or are you? If you are, go ahead, I have enough work to do and your help is highly appreciated. But in this case we have to tell Murkel, that he shall write you in the future. You could edit this into your post. I have just written him (as PM on the German forum) that he shall send all these messages to me.

	26-02-2003 20:58									#45
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Oh, btw and off-topic, somebody might wonder why I changed my avatar from Knollo the inventor to the noble Sir Dupré. Well, it was a request from GhengisFarb. He said, that "I've been viewing GS lands in my head as Jim Henson's the Muppet Show", so I had to change it to preserve the team honor.

	26-02-2003 21:14									#46
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Well, I was the original ambassador to ND, but I'm more then ok with you taking over.
(it would make things easier on the linguistic side of things I guess, and you do have a better rapport with them then I have.)

The choice is all yours

	26-02-2003 21:46									#47
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I doubt the language will be an issue, aside from that funny "climax" issue. I asked Murkel to write in English and he did. Just respond English and things are ok. I won't take over if it's not necessary, I already have enough work with this and other games .

	26-02-2003 22:13									#48
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Then i'll send it now.(I'll add to contact me, and if in doubt to contact you)

	26-02-2003 22:30									#49
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GF hasn't replied yet, i've sent him a reminder, nothing worth litering the log for- just asking if he got the offer and whether or not it is being discuseed.

	27-02-2003 11:43									#50
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I've got their reply, sent 5 hours ago
It's a yes.

So this is where we stand: 1) No reply from ND 2) a done deal with RP for literature 3) a done deal with GoW for MM- alpng with the 150 gold assurance we give them.

	27-02-2003 14:10									#51
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Assurance they give us, you mean, right?

	27-02-2003 16:46									#52
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Nathan, I guess that's the idea... us giving them 150 gold and CoL would be very silly

So, basically, ND is the only one we need to make a deal with, right? All the rest are covered... sounds good!

DeepO

	27-02-2003 16:59									#53
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It took Gow a while to reply- i had to send GF another PM, and Panzer32 an email to get GF to send me their agreement, but, as i said- they agreed for an assurance, which is good.


Now, what's up with ND, should we follow the tactic that helped with Gow, and send them some reminders?

I could do it, if alva won't show up soon, perhaps a message from the "FAM" would make them think the deal is of higher priority to us, and they'll hurry up (or delay purposly, for that matter)?

Please, if anyone have email addresses of the ND consul(s), post them here so i could use them, if they need arises (or even better, edit them into the ND log).

	27-02-2003 17:50									#54
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Hmm... zeit, a reminder is indeed in order, but I wouldn't go as far as doing it yourself. The ambassadorship to ND has been confusing, not only to us but also to them, it would be best to centralize all messages to Alva. I'm sure he'll be online soon, and can send a reminder then. There has already been a bit of discussion for them, so perhaps it would be best to come with a few suggestions to them. E.g. the assurance deal similar to GoW, or outright gold, workers, tech.

I can imagine that if they aren't especially eager to deal with us urgently on our first contact, so let's give them everything in hand, and don't let them need to take initiative by proposing deals to us.

DeepO

DeepO

	27-02-2003 18:45									#55
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The last message has been read by Borc, since it only went out yesteday evening I think it's a bit too soon to send another one.
-

Zeit, could you edit a sort of 'current deals/proposals' into the first post of the turns threads?
(The same place where the economist etc. place their orders.)

	27-02-2003 22:22									#56
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I have started nagging GoW about 18 hours after not hearing from them- this might have helped speed things up, as it surely didn't hurt our efforts- we have a deal with them.

Alva- please send them a reminder, perhaps, as DeepO suggests, we should push them in the right direction- mention them that we would appreciate gold, preferably cash...

	27-02-2003 22:56									#57
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1. The message has only been read by Borc and not by Murkel (ambassador). I asked for he's e-mail address since I think he's not online (at Poly) very often.
2. They did respond by offering literature which we declined, we should give them some time to discuss.

If I don't anything from them I'll write them an PM saying that time is very limitted.

	27-02-2003 23:41									#58
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Lux is still holding the save, and when they're done Legoland still has to play before the save reaches our hands, and then we can hold it for up to 24 hours. So thankfully, we have a lot more time to finalize the trade deals. I suggest we also ask RP for a clarification of their ETA on Literature, particularly whether they'll be able to respond to the offer of CoL that we send on our turn with Literature or not.

	27-02-2003 23:45									#59
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I found an e-mail address of Murkel in me hotmail box.

He sent the same message to me as the one he sent to SR.

I asked to make a new deal (gold?) and try to be quick about it.

	28-02-2003 00:16									#60
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Shiber, I think RP will have literature ready, or is very close. last message they explicitly told us that when we could offer it, they would be able to respond with their tech.

As to ND: would they be going for construction? I thought I heard something like this from GS, so if we could get a deal on that soon, I wouldn't mind.

DeepO