26-02-2003 08:15									#1
	Seriously...is MOO3 for me? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I've ben reading the threads here and at a couple other places...read the reviews, and have been online long enough to understand that pissy reviews and gushing fanboy reviews are just extremes of the spectrum; I take everything with a grain of salt.

But I'm new to TB strategy games on the computer (though I've table-top wargamed a bit). I played a great deal of Risk online, and just stumbled onto MOO3 by accident. While reading up on MOO3, I got a bargain-bin copy of MOO2 (two) and have played that for a month now. I enjoy it, but want a) more detail and b) more control.

I'm confused by all the posts of "big picture/no micro management" followed by posts about "overwhelming detail and control".

If I liked "Risk" and am looking for an expanded MOO2, will I be disappointed by MOO3?

Many thanks!

	26-02-2003 08:28									#2
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

That's a toughy. The hardest part about MoO3 is the learning curve. If you're willing to put in a lot of effort - and I truly do mean this - you'll find it much more detailed and controllable (without going into micromanagement hell) than you did MoO2.

Another game you might like is Europa Universitalis 2 - it's a strategy game where you control a country in Europe and guide it for 300 years. Quite good, IMO, and sort of like a super version of Risk.

	26-02-2003 08:33									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

for you, i would say give it a shot. ithink deaddirewolf said it best: this game needs to be actively studied to be truly enjoyed.

If you have the patience, you may be rewarded.

However, i think the biggest throw people are going to have is just the way you play it: it's not like any other game i've really experienced. You play from the macro point of view. yes you can jump in and put a new Cruiser in the build queue for Tau Ceti IV, but most of the game is run in a different frame of mind entirely. .It's kinda like handling a marionette by the strings as opposed to just grabbing it and forcing it to move some way - your global *strategy* (not tactics, but true *strategy*) is what will be be interesting.

	26-02-2003 08:44									#4
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

More direct answer.

If your looking for Moo2.5 you will likely be disappointed. This is a new game.

Moo3 uses a completely new model for combat. It's now 2D real time based. Developement, spying and technology have changed as well. Technology uses a far better model than Moo2. The only thing that doesn't seem to be completely different is diplomacy. It is far more detailed but still has the basic treaties in Moo2 plus a number of new options.

If your looking for a large scale indepth TBS game you should consider Moo3.

	26-02-2003 12:15									#5
	Re: Seriously...is MOO3 for me? Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I haven;t played the game...

quote: Originally posted by lcstark I enjoy it, but want a) more detail and b) more control. [/b]

There is more detail in MOO III--that we are sure about. More techs, more spying, more planets, etc. As far as having more control, my impression is that MOO III doesn't really let you have more control. So I guess you get one of your desires...

[b]

quote: I'm confused by all the posts of "big picture/no micro management" followed by posts about "overwhelming detail and control". [b]

There is a lot of detail in the game but you deal with the game from a macro point of view. If you want, you can delve into the details.

Since you enjoyed MOO II, I think you should consider getting MOO III. In the worst case, you'll still enjoy it to some extent.

KoalaBear33

	26-02-2003 15:01									#6
	Inflate your Upload Space

Read the manual and play a game at easy setting to learn the game I would do. I alway start a new computer stragic game. Play the many standard races to see which one you like to play and then see how you can inprove that race to your likeing.javascript:smilie('')
smile

	26-02-2003 15:05									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I question your sig. We will see.

-Jam

	26-02-2003 18:24									#8
	Re: Seriously...is MOO3 for me? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by lcstark ...I've table-top wargamed a bit... I played a great deal of Risk online...

If you like Risk and table-top wargaming, you should check out the Total War series (Shogun: Total War and Medieval: Total War).

	26-02-2003 18:58									#9
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I second Stuie.

-Jam

	26-02-2003 22:37									#10
	Thanks. Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Thanks folks. I think I'll take the leap and go with Moo3, take it home and give it a significant amount of time.

I do like games where the learning curve its steep and have had a couple experiences where something I didnt like at first eventually got me hooked once I understood the mechanics.

I'll also take a look at the "Total War" suggestions...thanks again! I suppose I should head to the store on my way home from work and see if I can score a copy of Moo3.

Has anyone had trouble today with store selling out? Or is that silly?

	27-02-2003 18:58									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I would say: get civ2 or SMAC/SMACX. It will cost you next to nothing and imho they are the best TBS games ever made.

Note: I have not yet played MOO3 so I can't judge the quality of that game.

	28-02-2003 14:11									#12
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I play MOO3 for 5 or 6 hours already it a great game.

	05-03-2003 03:20									#13
	Converted. Thanks! Enter the AD-FREE zone

I've had the game a week now, and I've only had three space battles (all scout to scout) though I've played maybe a total of 24 hours. this is mostly because I've restarted the game when I had an "A-HAH!" moment and realize how something was working.

The user mods that have come out (primarily the mods that improve the documentation) and the strat guides in conjunction with the Prima guide have nursed me along to the point that I'm really enjoying this game.

I'm currently in my 5th game (turn 72) with the average length of game growing with each iteration. I have yet to win a game (since I keep restarting) but I don't think the game is "too easy".

As I stated when I started this thread, I'm new to TBS games and especially new to 4X games. I wasn't sure if I would like this game, and was very disappointed the first day or two after purchasing it, but I've hung in there and dug in to find a very rich and engaging game. I'll be playing this for years.

Thanks for all your help!

-L

	05-03-2003 05:53									#14
	Re: Converted. Thanks! Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by lcstark I've had the game a week now, and I've only had three space battles (all scout to scout) though I've played maybe a total of 24 hours. this is mostly because I've restarted the game when I had an "A-HAH!" moment and realize how something was working. The user mods that have come out (primarily the mods that improve the documentation) and the strat guides in conjunction with the Prima guide have nursed me along to the point that I'm really enjoying this game. I'm currently in my 5th game (turn 72) with the average length of game growing with each iteration. I have yet to win a game (since I keep restarting) but I don't think the game is "too easy". As I stated when I started this thread, I'm new to TBS games and especially new to 4X games. I wasn't sure if I would like this game, and was very disappointed the first day or two after purchasing it, but I've hung in there and dug in to find a very rich and engaging game. I'll be playing this for years. Thanks for all your help! -L

No game nowday come out of the box ready to play anymore. I remember before the internet when you brought than game it ran well out of the box it if didnot the company lost money.

	05-03-2003 08:05									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Well, I'm new to the MOO forums (my first post) but I think this might be the appropirate thread for my question.

As many Civ players already know, you can break down Civ gamers into two groups: the warmongers and the peace-builders.

Is there any chance that MOO3 can be enjoyed by the peace-builder?

I ask this because I almost bought it the other day. However, I was rather turned off by the description on the back. It bragged about new espionage methods (such as leader assasination) and a bajillion types of military spacecraft and features. Sorry, just not my type of game. However, the screen shots in the strategy guide seemed to hint at a complex economy structure. I didn't have time to read it though.

Then I come here and there seems to be this divided conflict between "too detailed" and "not detailed enough". Well, in what regard is the detail too much or too little? Too much in regard to infrastructure building (the warmonger's nightmare) or too much in regard to tactical combat maneuvers (the peace-builder's nightmare).

Anyway, your input is appreciated.

	05-03-2003 08:28									#16
	Inflate your Upload Space

Well right now the military enemy AI is anemic and not at all aggressive, so the empire building is much more emphasized. And it's damn fun. Diplomacy can be a mixed bag - sometimes allies stick with you, some times they get truly mad at you, and often not telling you why this is so. Spying is great, however. One of my favorite parts of the game. A very cool 'cold war' feel to it. Orion senate can be fun as well. Exploring new worlds, setting up migration, making dev plans and seeing what techs you get and how they improve your empire - all very very cool.

So yeah, it's good for empire building. It's also good for warmongering, but it won't give you as much of a challenge unless you decided to take on the NOs.