02-03-2003 01:00									#1
	How to kill a Guardian? Suffering from ads?

Well how?
in moo2 all you needed was 5 BS with Gyro destabilizers but now uhmm
well i dealt like 8000+ damage ( had brought only a few battleships/dreads) but that Thing wasnt even scratched!!
Eeek!!
Any1 have a 'secret guard killer design' ?
Im arround level 26 in the important Techs.

	02-03-2003 01:05									#2
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You need lots of ships..........I had to pull together 60+ ships (all crusier or above with atleast Ion cannon tech) to kill a Guardian. Not pretty.

Also!!! Have a colony task force right behind the assault fleet. If you don't, someone else may steal those juciy planets (that happened to me).

	02-03-2003 02:09									#3
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I killed the Bulrathi guardian with a single superdreadnaught armada. Can't recall what they were armed with, but it was over kill.

This after being crushed on several attempts.

	02-03-2003 02:15									#4
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Well he just crashed 4 ARmada's Missle accompanied by several PD/SR Swarms
I concur the Blue Number that appears if i hit him is only his shield?
Also Just like MoO2 Missles as said dont seem to help much..
Will set up a LR FLeet and hope that will deal with it :=)
Thnx :=)

	02-03-2003 02:43									#5
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quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel I killed the Bulrathi guardian with a single superdreadnaught armada. Can't recall what they were armed with, but it was over kill. This after being crushed on several attempts.

superdreadnaught tech is fairly late game....

	02-03-2003 02:45									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Corentor superdreadnaught tech is fairly late game....

I suppose. Its still a ways from the titan and behemoth class ships. I would say late-mid game. I play the first games a little too conservatively, I will admit.

	02-03-2003 08:04									#7
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A superdreadnaught armada was what I used as well. It was MAJOR overkill.

I figure they can be killed off a lot sooner than I got around to it, but I'd lost enough ships trying earlier in the game that I didn't feel like wasting more ships until I was sure it would work.

I'd like to be able to figure out the minimal or at least reasonable amount/composition of force required to beat them... that I might get my hands on those planets as soon as possible in a game.

	02-03-2003 09:42									#8
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You can save some costlier units by saving a lot of cheesy obsolete ships and sending them in as fodder. A dreadnaught armada of 60% LRA, 20% SRA, 10 IF, 5% Carriers, and 5% PD with a few recon escorts should be all but sufficient to handle most Guardians (as well as nearly any system's defenses )

Has anyone attacked the New Orions? I'm curious about warring with them.

	02-03-2003 09:45									#9
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4 Carrier Groups & one LongRange Armada did the job quite well&quick
( i wont tell the hull sizes for now ;=) )

	02-03-2003 13:52									#10
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I'm guessing no smaller than dreadnaughts, and perhaps as large as titans for the carriers, since they would be relatively cheap....

	02-03-2003 19:33									#11
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Nope the Carriers were Cruisers. As the Cruiser design was one of the smallest arround tha Ai built me uhmm *quite a Bunch* of them. the LR fitted a SD, two D and some BS.
the whole fleet was relativly cheap if I find another Guardian i'll replace the Dreads&Sd LR armada with three cheap obsolete SR/LR Armadas and look whter thats enough too :=)

Unfortunatly the Guardian i killed was teh Bulrathi one...
and as Klackons .. uhh well the High G worlds
I turned most messages in the Sitrep of, so is all you get those Planets? I hoped for some juicy Tech!

Turn 220: I have Titan design but only built a few yet.
I wait for my new developed Super(dread)Carriers to enter service

	03-03-2003 02:53									#12
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quote: Originally posted by canamrock Has anyone attacked the New Orions? I'm curious about warring with them.

I sent 3 superdreadnaught armadas against them and didn't even scratch any of them

	04-03-2003 03:35									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Nick014 I sent 3 superdreadnaught armadas against them and didn't even scratch any of them

Well, I found that they also improve their armadas along the game. I waited too long and I was annoyed to see my 10 armadas going boom. Mine were somewhat obsolete, but theirs were with damper field....

At the end (late game) I obliterate their race (nice ground defense) by using a combination of Armadas of Carriers, Missiles (LOTS) and assorted LR and SRs, each one with lots of PD (beam and missile) and reco to scan the location of those cloaked bastards.

And who gets the New Orions TFs often doing incursions out of their system?

Gretz

Alex

	04-03-2003 03:54									#14
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If you don't mind being "gamey", the Guardians are reported to suffer from the PD bug, making them susceptible to concentrated IF.

	04-03-2003 03:58									#15
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Alex, in my first game, the NOs came abroad. Their first trip might have been recon, after that they appeared to be traveling through my territory to get to somebody with whom they were at war. (In the process, they were kind enough to wipe out the defenses of a planet that I wanted to invade that had fought me to a standstill.)

First time I saw them coming, I crossed my fingers that they weren't after me. I wasn't in the Senate, so if one of the members had gotten them to declare war on me, I wouldn't have known.

	04-03-2003 07:16									#16
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1 Carrier (Light Cruiser) armada with greater than or equal to gauss cannon fighters, 1 I.F. armada (Light Cruiser) with hercurlite and light missle, or mercurlite and rocket, recon ships that can see the guardian before he starts shooting = dead guardian. in my games all of these techs happen at about the same time. hope this helps.

Seruko

	04-03-2003 07:51									#17
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Hmm... well, I'll be able to give a better estimation shortly... a Guardian planet is isolated off, near my homeworld, and my industrial and technological capacities are just hitting their critical masses.

If nobody else decided to come in after me, I will be send several flotillas of SRA Frigates, a series of Cruiser LRA's and sever BC Carriers. I'm not sure what else to throw in yet, but I've got a few PD ships lined up to act as Guardian fodder.

	04-03-2003 18:40									#18
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Hm, I killed it with several Dreadnought Flotillas. I suffered some loses but not lot. The dreads were armed with laser warheads, heavy missile chassis, I think, escorted by beam corvettes ... Not 100% sure, though.

	04-03-2003 18:43									#19
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So the only thing behind the Guardians are the races that were suposedly wiped out by the NOs? I was hoping for something a little more spectacular...

	04-03-2003 18:50									#20
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More than anything else, I think the important thing is early detection. I tried attacking a guardian with a dreadnought armada (lots of missiles and some LR), and I got waxed. Didn't dent it. Then I tried again after waiting just a couple of turns for the production of my 2 new Lt Cruiser escorts, complete with the high-caliber whatever detection thingy (the one that lets you see 60% farther). This time I knocked the guardian out without taking any damage at all. I think if you want to kill guardians, just run towards the detector tchnologies, and I bet you can do it with battle cruisers.

	04-03-2003 18:52									#21
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How many of the Guardians give you Antaran X's when you kill them? I've killed four so far, and only gotten one X (from the Mrrshan guardian).

	04-03-2003 19:29									#22
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Its random. Its possible to kill all the Guardians and get all 5 X's, I suppose.

-Jam

	04-03-2003 21:03									#23
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I never got an X out of an guardian
but then I only killed 7 thus far

	06-03-2003 01:51									#24
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I read somewhere that it is possible to flee from battle if you encounter a Guardian with insufficient forces, but now I can't find it. How do you flee, if you don't want to fight the Guardian?

Asmodean

	06-03-2003 02:01									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Asmodean I read somewhere that it is possible to flee from battle if you encounter a Guardian with insufficient forces, but now I can't find it. How do you flee, if you don't want to fight the Guardian? Asmodean

you have to control the battle, the computer will fight. Just click on the unit and click on retreat

	06-03-2003 05:25									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Asmodean I read somewhere that it is possible to flee from battle if you encounter a Guardian with insufficient forces, but now I can't find it. How do you flee, if you don't want to fight the Guardian? Asmodean

The readme files says to take control and select blockade planet . When you get to the battles screen hit general withdrawl.

It's always worked for me.


ACK!

	06-03-2003 06:02									#27
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How to kill a guardian? It's relatively easy, I've found, using indirect fire ships. I had about 12 indirects in my an armada of ~Level 27 tech Evon ships, and they took out the guardian in a single volley!

If you have bad missiles, or are behind in tech, I recommend 2 armadas long range attack coupled with carriers. The fighters will draw its fire while you pound away on its shields.

Both these are great ways to wind up winning a fight. Don't try to go in with inferior tech and waste a lot of ships on it. If you send great numbers of inadequate forces the guardian will chew right through them.


The 2 armadas strategy: I only lost 2 ships in this engagment, my tech level was somewhere between 20 and 30 (I forget exactly )

	06-03-2003 07:46									#28
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I think you got the PD bug to get a kill that easy even with missiles. Personally I prefer to use fighters but maybe its just because Carrier TF's appeal to my sense of gameplay.

The NO home planet though is crazy if you use fighters. The planet and orbitals have immense shields. My first two attempts the screen almost froze by the time my fourth volley of fighters went in. It was a huge wave of light and streams of blue damage numbers as thousands of fighters shot at them. It got so bad the battles timed out with the clock still showing over 2 minutes time left. Fortunately my third attempt had my latest design of carriers involved and eventually the shields cracked and the orbitals blew. It really was the most awesome fight

	06-03-2003 13:39									#29
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Grumbold, what was the design you used on the carriers?

	07-03-2003 00:30									#30
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Iirc I was using fusion fighters with the extra fusion pods because they were the best damage/space ratio. 9 carriers in an armada with 4 PD escorts, 2 Long range escorts and 3 recon ships. The NO homeworld took 6 TF's to defeat with one long range TF that didn't do much and one transport TF.