02-03-2003 06:46									#1
	Terraforming, should I and when Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I have not seen the AI spending anything to terraform any of my planets.
I am forcing some spending on it on a Yellow planet, but I am not sure if I should, how much and when.
It sure is nice to have to do everything with no information.
I would like to know if it makes sense to terraform and if so how much, when?
I mean in Moo1 and Moo2 you knew what you would get for terraforming, what could be done to what and when.......

	02-03-2003 10:49									#2
	Got spare money?

you could always start a development plan for yellow and red stars with terraforming.

As soon as you get the requisite techs, it should start happening. of course...

I have seen terraforming on my planets before, entirely AI driven, no messing by me, but it was late game.

	02-03-2003 12:05									#3
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I suspect your are correct. I did have a plan for yellow with terraforming, but I am not sure if I have any requisite tech.

	02-03-2003 19:23									#4
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I think the AI starts terrafoming only when all possible DEA's have been built.

	02-03-2003 21:09									#5
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It's funny vmxa1, that you are asking question, I have to laugh. I am so use to you as answering everyones questions, I expected you to be an expert on the MOO games.

I know Moo3 just came out and we don't know how to play it but thought it was funny you asking a question.

Davor

	02-03-2003 22:36									#6
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Main_Brain I think the AI starts terrafoming only when all possible DEA's have been built.

Or if it's given a high priority in a dev plan, I would imagine.

	03-03-2003 01:08									#7
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Yeah I am at square one and was a bit late in getting the game.

	03-03-2003 04:14									#8
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This got me too. The book or the online help says you can't terrraform until the necessary tech has been researched.

	03-03-2003 04:51									#9
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My problem is not only do we not have the knowledge of the means to terraform (how it is done), but we have a dirth of information on why/when we should do it, if we should do it.
So I fiured out how to do, but I do not know if I should and when and how much.

	03-03-2003 04:55									#10
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 My problem is not only do we not have the knowledge of the means to terraform (how it is done), but we have a dirth of information on why/when we should do it, if we should do it. So I fiured out how to do, but I do not know if I should and when and how much.

Yes, we need some compendium of what each tech does. We need to know how much it costs. Is the 15% spent getting the job done? How does something like the Senates nature preservation act affect it? Like many places in the game, this one is weak in information.If it takes 100 turns to terraform a yellow world, why bother?

	03-03-2003 16:33									#11
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I note the AI will terraform gravity almost as a first priority when the requisite tech (mass converters) is available. On other planets late game I've seen the terraforming budget at circa 9% but havent looked closely to actually see the impact of it.

	03-03-2003 19:44									#12
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Getting to know the techs is the hard part.....so many, and so many are new. I just noticed that one of my worlds was terraforming at a very small rate. Quite nice, actually, and just a tiny bit of cash over a long time....

I really like how you can have a planet do multiple things now (as compared to Moo2). Nice to be able to terraform, build a ship, and build a mine, etc. at the same time.

PS: Asleepathewheel....your icon makes it look like she is drinking a beer :-)

	03-03-2003 21:12									#13
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In my first game, my planets seemed to get terraformed without significant delay. And this was with citizens going to red 2's to escape overcrowding. (and annoying when it meant that Ajadar (red 2) took over a Darlok (sweet spot) planet )

	04-03-2003 05:50									#14
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quote: Originally posted by TrainWreck20 PS: Asleepathewheel....your icon makes it look like she is drinking a beer :-)

I've set my yellow's priority to terraform primary, and man, the terraform was set at like 75% A bit high I would say, esp since there was no infrastructure.

	04-03-2003 15:49									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

If i made correct conclusion, Habitability ring affects Population growth SIGNIFICANTLY - fertility (of current region on planet), max. population affect population growth (mostly if Population = Max population) and immigration depend on habitability ring of planet.

So, new planet you don't need max pop, pop growth and bioharvest - better to terraform after at least some industry is working on planet IMHO, but then immediately terraform on yellow/red planets - terraform is relatively cheap, so better to do it before all infrastrucure is built because you don't need 50%- effectivity of DEA and Maintenance cost > Income.

http://www.orionsector.com/pages/dd/datadumps.shtml
Pop Growth (http://www.orionsector.com/pages/dd...rowth.shtml.htm)

From Spreadsheets.mob

TableStart TerraformCost
ColumnHeadingsStart Cost Mulitplier Cost for First Ring
RowHeadingsStart
RingEquivDist 8 5 // The first number is how far to terraform before the cost goes up, The second number is the percent of terraform cost that maintenance costs,
0 Terraforming Achievement 1,8 200 // needed for calculating maintenance degradation each turn
1 Terraforming Achievement 1,7 175
2 Terraforming Achievement 1,6 150
3 Terraforming Achievement 1,5 125
4 Terraforming Achievement 1,4 100
5 Terraforming Achievement 1,3 80
6 Terraforming Achievement 1,2 60
7 Terraforming Achievement 1,2 60
8 Terraforming Achievement 1,2 60 // get to 8 if you can terraform to paradise
TableEnd

TableStart FertilityLevel
ColumnHeadingsStart Paradise SweetSpot G1 G2 Y1 Y2
R1 R2
RowHeadingsStart
2 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2
1 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1
0 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 1
-1 6 5 4 3 2 1 1 1
-2 5 4 3 2 1 1 1 1
TableEnd

TableStart MaxGrowthRate
ColumnHeadingsStart MaxGrowthRate
RowHeadingsStart
1 0,01 // tenths of a percent
2 0,015
3 0,02
4 0,025
5 0,03
6 0,035
7 0,04
8 0,045
9 0,05
TableEnd

	06-03-2003 09:43									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

From TechTables.txt open in excel. I'm assuming TFormRin+=1 is increasing Terraforming. I've only ever gotten Sunlight Redirection and Magnetic Field Modification though myself.
Sunlight Redirection TASunRdr TBSunRdr None Achieve SunltRd
r Achieve Const_10 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1
Magnetic Field Modification TAMgFdMd TBMgFdMd None Achieve MagFld
Md Achieve MthCm_18 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1
Atmospheric Containment TAAtmCnt TBAtmCnt None Achieve AtmosCn
t Achieve BioSc_25 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1
Climate Controllers TAClmCnt TBClmCnt None Achieve ClimCon
t Achieve MthCm_31 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1
Planetary Core Heat Pumps TAPlnPmp TBPlnPmp None Achieve PlntPump Achi
eve Energ_36 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1
Atmospheric Processors TAAtmPrc TBAtmPrc None Achieve AtmoProc
Achieve Const_41 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1, TFormPar = 1
Bio-Engineered Life TABioLif TBBioLif None Achieve BioEngLf Achie
ve BioSc_45 TFPlanet None TFormRin +=1, TFormPar = 1

	06-03-2003 11:19									#17
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If i colonize a planet with my humanoids and then the Klakons from my overcrowded worlds start moving in because they like it more, how will the planet be terraformed? In the first phase, when the humanoids will be domiinant, the planet will go, let's say, 2 rings towards Sweet Spot and than, with the Klakons as a majority, 2 rings back to where it started?

	06-03-2003 11:51									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Prothero If i colonize a planet with my humanoids and then the Klakons from my overcrowded worlds start moving in because they like it more, how will the planet be terraformed? In the first phase, when the humanoids will be domiinant, the planet will go, let's say, 2 rings towards Sweet Spot and than, with the Klakons as a majority, 2 rings back to where it started?

interesting problem. I can see how it would be possible, esp as klacks are bunnies and humans, well.. interesting, never thought about it.

	07-03-2003 10:03									#19
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On a similar note, how does terraforming affect magnate civilizations? I started in the outskirts and assimultated two or three of these very early on, they are colonizing entire systems under the banner of the Ithkul menace. However, I don't think I've ever seen any indication of what environment these races like, or whether terraforming defaults only to my base race and not the needs of the local population. Since entire systems are 100% magnate-populated and deep into Ithkul red, if the terraforming only works towards Ithkul norms, terraforming risks doing harm from the get go, or doing good for awhile but then overshooting, or all manner of other crazy possiblilties if the terraform isn't specific to the local population.

	07-03-2003 13:41									#20
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I tested this last evening.
(For magnate civs topic)

Terraforming terraforms to preferences of race with maximum population on that planet.

	07-03-2003 19:57									#21
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Does it shift if the max pop. changes without requiring new technologies? That sounds vaguely consistent with something I might have read before, but I can't recall for sure or where it would have been.