03-03-2003 03:50									#1
	Antaran Expeditions: Strategies? Got spare money?

OK, I've managed to get 3 Xs, but I've managed to open up another front in an ongoing war, and I have to pour some resources into that. Thus, I'd like to make my expeditions more efficient.

So, some questions:

1) What determines how fast an expedition loses ships? Could I just create a whole aramda of ships with nothing but Research Bays? Or do I need to give them some protection? Does hull size improve the chances of success?

2) Is there any way to choose what ships get sent on an expedition? In the beginning, I was wondering why my ships were disappearing, until I figured out that they just randomly take ships from your reserves. It would be nice if you could designate ships for the Antaran Expedition. Or can you?


At first, MOO3 looked really intimidating, but after 300 or so turns, I'm getting the hang of it. I think.

	03-03-2003 04:57									#2
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This, as with most games, is unknown right now.

I have had a 3 ship squad find stuff (and then disappear while researching)

I've had a 16 ship armada find stuff (but I stopped the game before anything happened, it was taking a long time for anything, may go back.)

Who knows?

Are the results similar to the Antaran X results? If so, I will send out more, many more expeditions.

	03-03-2003 16:31									#3
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I built a class of ships dedicated to searching for X's (speed, scanners, research labs) but only a couple of them get chosen for each mission. You seem to be building a task force with the same sort of structure as a long range mission, so it will select a few of several classes to fill the picket, exscort and core slots.

So far on limited evidence I'd say that bigger higher tech ships have increased speed and survivability. Since my ship naturally have the best of everything available its hard to say if its armor, weapons, shields or a combination of everything that is keeping them alive.

I think you'd be foolish to send anything less than a pack of ships on a mission. Casualties are random but generally high.

	03-03-2003 17:38									#4
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Well you can build TF's wuith all ships except mthe ones you want to send ;=)
currently i would only need to create uhm TF's with 628 Ships
(126Transporters)
uhh that could take a while...

	03-03-2003 20:43									#5
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I have been having a problem in that they are not actually taking any ships from my reserves. The expiditions all say something like "waiting for X more ships" when I have 40 odd ships in reserve all of different types and abilities.

	04-03-2003 10:20									#6
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To reach your destination faster, use the best warp engines. Use the largest ship possible as it is most likely to come back in one piece. Use the maximum size always, but you can always use some crappy and fast ships just to fill the quota. Some types of ships are ignored for the Antaran expedition. Generally, I build some very large recon ship with research labs, and use other ships to fill up the 16 quota. Orbital and System ships cannot be use for the expedition.

	04-03-2003 18:57									#7
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I'm having trouble figuring this out because it's so poorly documented in the manual. I see a lot of people talking about research labs. Do ships selected for Antaran expeditions need to have research labs? Does it help anything for them to have labs?

	04-03-2003 19:28									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Cabbagemeister I'm having trouble figuring this out because it's so poorly documented in the manual. I see a lot of people talking about research labs. Do ships selected for Antaran expeditions need to have research labs? Does it help anything for them to have labs?

It rises the chances to find anything on the Expedition.
If you look in the Entry for the Research Labs at the Technology - Matrix, there it is explained in further detail.

	04-03-2003 20:25									#9
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If you look in spreadsheets.mob, antarans.txt appears to give you an estimate of your chances of losing a ship each turn the TF is in a particular phase of the expedition.

	04-03-2003 20:39									#10
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I can't figure out how to send a TF out on an Antaran mission. Where can I do this?

	04-03-2003 21:01									#11
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Under Victory Conditions (F9) -Antaran Expeditions

	05-03-2003 06:23									#12
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So the antaran expeditions use the ships you produce on your own! Could anyone tell me WHAT ships they use? the ones i produce after ordering an antaran expedition? or can i select them from the reserve pool?

	05-03-2003 15:01									#13
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They grab ships out of the pool. Unlike the normal TF construction you can't pick which ones to send. Make sure your have any ships that you need for normal play in TF's already.

I've not had problems sending expeditions as long as I've had a balanced group of ships in my reserves. It always picks some recon, some escorts and some warships. I havent noticed if it takes transports.

	05-03-2003 18:26									#14
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^it depends what you sent
if you send a Armada it will pick two recon ships 4 PD/LR -escort ships and 10 mainBattleships
if you only send a detachment it will send two ships of teh same group (LR/SR/CR etc)

	05-03-2003 19:50									#15
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A few notes from my attempt at a 'X-win'


I've dragged out a game I could have easily have won by now in the senate to attempt a X-win and I've noticed I few oddities. Don't know if they're bugs, design decissions, or if I'm just missing something.

After building all the tak forces I wanted for combat, I was left with ALOT of obsolite ship designs in my reserves. So instead of scraping them I sent them off into the wild black yonder to look for the 'Xs". ended up with 8 armadas searching. The first four went through the 'Outbound', 'Destination', 'Archeology', 'Inbound' phases with no problems. 4 Xs recovered, researched, and institutionalized. The 5th X... well things went badly....

The 5th fleet, reached destination, did the archeology, and headed home. In the mean time the remianing 3 fleets reached thier destinations... and then it all stopped. The 5th fleet never made it home, they just sat in 'Inbound' status FOREVER (forever = 100+ turns... (I did mention that I was dragging this game out, right )

So I'm left wondering if since I have other fleets out at destinations if this caused a glitch what wouldn't let my 5th X reach home. I've just now had ALL the remaining ships in ALL the expidetion fleets die off (FINALLY). and have sent one lone armade to reattempt the last X. Will let ya'll know the result.

Another possibility according to the manual is that one of the remaining civs have recovered a X. If that's the case (again accodring to the manual) If I take out that civ, I'll get thier X. Just one thing... I have yet to find a way to tell if this has happened! nowhere can I find info if another civ has a X ( I have atleast diplomatic contact with all the remaining civs) Is there a way to find out, PLEASE tell me if I'm missing a place where this info is displayed.

Anyone else expeiriences with an X win would be welcome. Thanks

	05-03-2003 21:11									#16
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Maybe try this to peg down wether or not another race has an X.

Save game. Allow yourself a senate win. On the winner screen under each race is something about "number of X's acheived" normally they all are at zero. If someone else has one I guess it would say 1 then. Re-start from before the senate vote. Kill the offending race you have identified as having your last X.

	06-03-2003 01:59									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Bblue A few notes from my attempt at a 'X-win' I've dragged out a game I could have easily have won by now in the senate to attempt a X-win and I've noticed I few oddities. Don't know if they're bugs, design decissions, or if I'm just missing something. After building all the tak forces I wanted for combat, I was left with ALOT of obsolite ship designs in my reserves. So instead of scraping them I sent them off into the wild black yonder to look for the 'Xs". ended up with 8 armadas searching. The first four went through the 'Outbound', 'Destination', 'Archeology', 'Inbound' phases with no problems. 4 Xs recovered, researched, and institutionalized. The 5th X... well things went badly.... The 5th fleet, reached destination, did the archeology, and headed home. In the mean time the remianing 3 fleets reached thier destinations... and then it all stopped. The 5th fleet never made it home, they just sat in 'Inbound' status FOREVER (forever = 100+ turns... (I did mention that I was dragging this game out, right ) So I'm left wondering if since I have other fleets out at destinations if this caused a glitch what wouldn't let my 5th X reach home. I've just now had ALL the remaining ships in ALL the expidetion fleets die off (FINALLY). and have sent one lone armade to reattempt the last X. Will let ya'll know the result. Another possibility according to the manual is that one of the remaining civs have recovered a X. If that's the case (again accodring to the manual) If I take out that civ, I'll get thier X. Just one thing... I have yet to find a way to tell if this has happened! nowhere can I find info if another civ has a X ( I have atleast diplomatic contact with all the remaining civs) Is there a way to find out, PLEASE tell me if I'm missing a place where this info is displayed. Anyone else expeiriences with an X win would be welcome. Thanks

Bblue: This is from the Readme file:

INBOUND ANTARAN EXPEDITION LOST
If you have discovered an X off-map and have an In-Bound Task Force, there’s a rare chance that you may have your X hijacked by an enemy empire. If this is the case, turn your efforts to spying immediately to try and recover it. Remember, Xs are most vulnerable when they are being researched; and be sure to use Scientific Spies!

Asmodean

	06-03-2003 04:48									#18
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Yeem - Thx, good idea next vote I'll try it, should be pretty close as I've played around 30ish turns since the original post a vote should be cominf up soon.




Asmodean - Thx also, I noticed that little passage but didn't give it much thought, I get the feeling this is one of those cases when RTFM isn't alot of help . I made the assumption that I would be notified if I was hi-jacked, but we all know about assuming I wasn't notified on the Victory screen or the SitRep (as far as I know). And I have been using a lot of sci-spies to see if that would help the situation, only thing is, where would I be notified if they did find anything? the SitRep? I would assume (here we go agian) that it would be a red notification and I wouldn't have missed it if that's the case, otherwise I can't find anyplace (other then yeem's idea) where X-infomation related to other civs is posted. Hopefully time will clear this up as we all trudge up the learning curve.

	08-03-2003 05:11									#19
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Just got the vote... Yep, Some stinking roaches (Read: Klackons) grabbed the last X. I wonder if this is what they were referring to with the 'hi-jack' statement in the read me or is there a hi-jack event.

I started a war of exterminated on the roaches. I have dragged this game out so long I using Leviation carriers along with support ships armed with Raid (Read: Steller Converters) But the bugs control about 25 or so systems and having to PERSONALLY control all the ship combat just to get to the bombardment screen is a time consuming micromanagment hell. Finishing this game, although therortically possible, is beyond the limits of human ability. I'll just have to move faster next game.

I just don't see how the beta testers missed this one. For a game where macromanagment is the word of the day (which btw I love) this one remenant of micromanagment ruined my enjoyment of this particular gaming session.

	08-03-2003 22:36									#20
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But you can only control a certain number of combats per turn?

Asmodean

	09-03-2003 08:37									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Asmodean But you can only control a certain number of combats per turn? Asmodean

Not sure If I understand your question exactly, but I'll give it a try

Since I'm playing single player I've set the game options to unlimited number of controled combats, so as long as I can get ships there I can fight. I think(?) unlimited was the default wasn't it? All I know for sure is I was besieging 5-7 systems a turn (both agianst the Klackons and another civ) and the turns were lasting 15-20 mins apiece, most of that waiting for 8 TF of carriers to blow up some piddlly planatary defence.

	10-03-2003 00:59									#22
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I cut my combats down to three minutes for just that reason. If they can't sort it out in three, then...

Does anyone know how many partial discoveries are required to get through the archaeological stage? The most I've gotten so far is five before my fleet was lost.

	10-03-2003 01:13									#23
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Didn't make a note of it, so I'm not 100% sure, but I think it is 5 archeology partial discoveries before it is found and you get to go 'Inbound'

	10-03-2003 22:44									#24
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Bblue, not sure it is always 5, I seem to remember getting one after only two partial discoveries.

	10-03-2003 23:58									#25
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Maybe they just affect your Chances of discovering an Antaran X.
The more partial Discoveries you have made the greater the Chance that your next Discovery will be an Antaran X or the like.