03-03-2003 13:22									#1
	Federation Bounty Put an end to popups!

The damn Federation put a 8G bounty on my head!!!!

What did I do wrong?

Possibilities:

killed a tiny planet with newbie ship and orbitting newbie ship in Unchartered Space - thought that was legit ...

lost my connection and found I had two windows on the game opened - closed the one with fewer turns used - I guess this is some sort of infringement, but it wasn't my fault

Some other sin I had no idea I had committed

HELP!!!!

SG[1]

	03-03-2003 22:33									#2
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Nailing a player whose score is less than about 75% of your own is likely to get you a Fed bounty. When attacking another ship directly, you will be warned whether or not the attack will result in a bounty. In my experience, killing a ship on a planet will not get you a bounty, but that may not be the rule. Bounties tend to be about 1/6 your net worth, much of which is invested in your ship and planets.

	04-03-2003 04:26									#3
	Suffering from ads?

SG,

It was the newbie in orbit. Oh and do not worry so much, cuz....you died

	04-03-2003 20:55									#4
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Ah well - you live, you learn...

SG[1]

	05-03-2003 16:42									#5
	Increase the size of your Attachments

RPM

OK - but what kind of ship do you use to kill a planet with 7M fighters & Torps with a reasonable fighting vessel in dock?
I noticed that two ships were lost in the attacks - how can you afford this?
Please - more info - I'm a newbie here

SG[1]

	06-03-2003 23:54									#6
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Okay, this is my current ship:

Ship Report
Player: Spaced Cowboy
Ship: Electric Steed
Credits: 36,867,172,098

Ship Component Levels
Hull Level 24
Engines Level 14
Power Level 26
Computer Level 27
Sensors Level 20
Armour Level 26
Shields Level 25
Beam Weapons Level 28
Torpedo launchers Level 25
Cloak Level 20
Average tech level Level 24.14

Armour & Weapons
Armour points 3,787,675 / 3,787,675
Fighters 5,681,513 / 5,681,513
Torpedoes 2,525,117 / 2,525,117
Energy 18,938,376 / 18,938,376

Devices
Space Beacons 0
Warp Editors 27
Genesis Torpedoes 8
Mine Deflectors 19887944
Emegency Warp Device 10
Escape Pod Yes
Fuel Scoop Yes
Last ship seen device Yes

The game has 3 phases:
The trade phase
The planet farm phase
The bank phase.

Pretty much over by the 3rd phase, cuz the leader will have more cash and get more interest making them a steamroller.

Chaos Theory almost has this game wrapped up.

RPM

	07-03-2003 11:08									#7
	Suffering from ads?

I break it down in more detail:
1. Warp-lane trading
2. Real space trading
3. Colonization funded by trading
4. Colonization funded by colonies
5. (Optional) Reinforce colonies and upgrade ship
6. Conquer
7. (Optional) Reinforce colonies while banking
8. Bank without reinforcing colonies
9 (if winning). Bank while losing colonies
9 (if losing). Conquer and kamikaze banks

	07-03-2003 11:11									#8
	Remove this text

Oh yeah, if the log tells you that your planet destroyed the attacker, it's not necessarily true. If the attack ends in a stalemate, the log incorrectly reports that the planet destroyed the attacker.

	07-03-2003 16:43									#9
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Hey - thanks a lot guys - in bnt#1 (which I joined late)I'm playing as a pure trader and getting to learn the ropes of that phase - probably went overboard on hull - 26, with Engines - 13, Power - 23 all else 0, but have amassed a nice nest egg in the bank

In #2 I think I went colonial too soon and didn't have the cash to make either my colonies or my ship impregnable - as you guys found

But did you actually benefit from the attacks - there wasn't that much cash <10G - or am I missing something again?

Thanks again SG[1]

	07-03-2003 16:57									#10
	Put an end to popups!

and if you don't mind?

How do you decide whether an attack is going to successful - with so much loot tied up in your ship you can't really afford to lose -- on the face of it my planet of New Liverpool with ~7M Fighters and Torpedoes + my ship with 1.4M of each had you outgunned -- but obviously not - my Beams were comparatively weak - is this the key?

Still trying to learn, SG[1]

	07-03-2003 19:32									#11
	Put an end to popups!

Yes,

My beams take out you fighters, pretty much one for one (might have to go through the shields first??). Then your beams take on my shields and then my armor.

Our torps take out each others fighters, but it is proportional to your torp rating and how many you have. Planets always seem to rule here.

The key is that my beams took all of you fighters out leaving all 5M of mine to do the dirty deed of wacking the planet.

Since I have extra energy after the attack (energy at the same level of shields and beams os way more than you need for one attack). My beams get another go around on your ship. It sort of went pop as a result.

Chaos's breakdown of the game is very nice. He is also a very good player. This game is basically over, cuz he has the lead, and I do not have a clue where his bank is.

I took 30-35 of his planets yesterday, and it did not even make a dent.

Also if you do not want your ship to go pop, do not place it on a planet. Buy 10 emergency warp devices and just park in orbit anywhere. If someone tries to attack you, you'll just warp somewhere else. The chances of someone finding you 10 times before you log on again are real slim.

Spaced

	07-03-2003 19:35									#12
	Remove this text

Oh, I forgot.

I usually gage my strength based on attacking a planet I know that I can take (perhaps a few more fighters than my beams), then note was it left after the attack.

For instance if I attack a planet with 10m fighters, and note that I have 3m fighters and 2m armor left over, then I know that I can take a planet with 15m fighters as long as the owner is at the same strength (beams, torps, shields).

Lastly when doing multiple attacks, make sure that you actually bought more figthers before you commit. I've lost sooooo many ships that way.

Spaced

	08-03-2003 01:29									#13
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Attacks vs planets:

Beams destroy fighters, 1 for 1. Ships cannot lose more than 1/2 their fighters this way

Beams destroy shields, 1 for 1.

Beams destroy ship armor, 1 for 1.

Torpedoes destroy fighters, 10 per torp. Ships cannot lost more than 1/2 their remaining fighters this way. Planets can fire 5x the torps a ship of the same tech level can.

Torpedos destroy planetary shields or ship armor, 10 per torp. Note that ship shields are not useful for anything except soaking beams.

Fighters destroy fighters, 1 for 1. One side loses all its fighters here.

Leftover fighters destroy planetary shields or ship armor 1 for 1, but are not consumed by doing this.

If the ship has <= 0 armor, it is dead. If not, and the planet has <= 0 shields and 0 fighters, it is defeated. Else, both live, but since the attacker can restock and the planet cannot immediately, the attacker will eventually win.

	08-03-2003 01:33									#14
	Inflate your Upload Space

If you don't want your ship to die:

1. Keep your avg tech level <= 8 and hang out in sector 0. I did this with a hull over size 20, because I kept shields, armor, torpedos, and beams at 0 until I would be over tech level 8 anyway.

2. Keep your avg tech level <= 15 and stock up on EWDs. They only work some of the time after tech level 15, so you can't rely on them.

3. Put LOTS of fighters on a planet and stay there. The planet where I stay has 1 billion fighters, for example. If you don't have a cash horde where you stay, you can probably get away with a few dozen million at this point of the game.

	08-03-2003 03:16									#15
	Got spare money?

Again excellent comments Chaos!

Although I finally happened upon that 1B fighter planet today. Nice pile o' cash you got there!

later!

	08-03-2003 09:02									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I noticed those 133M mines. Good thing they don't go off when you leave the planet

Until the last couple of days, I did not think I had the game locked down, and even now sookoll isn't beaten, just losing. My secret is very, very simple. Calculations. Run the numbers, optimize the game, get the edge, run with it. I know exactly how many fighters I can take on, exactly what an opponent needs to capture one of my planets, and exactly how hard it is to kamikaze my bank. Incidentally, this is only my third game of BNT, and only my second game longer than one day.

	08-03-2003 15:04									#17
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Damn, I was hoping that those mines would catch you of guard. I should have put them somewhere else besides you bank sector. At this point they are just extra defense for you.

I looks like you do have this wrapped up. Damn good playing for your second game. I think that I could have given you a run for it if I did not have those two snow days.

l8r

	09-03-2003 00:48									#18
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Does anyone know when the 28th February falls on the Greek canendar?

SG[1]

	09-03-2003 19:36									#19
	Full PM-box? Change here!

As far as I can tell never.

	09-03-2003 22:09									#20
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I think Mark G has a real bad addiction right now.

Some call it mad cow disease, some say he can't stop playing moO!!!

	10-03-2003 01:41									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Chaos Theory My secret is very, very simple. Calculations. Run the numbers, optimize the game, get the edge, run with it.

That's THE only secret to the game. Which is why I find it kind of boring. I mean, other than universe creation, nothing is ever random, and what little is random in universe creation only matters in the very first "phase", warp lane trading.

A game without rnd() is hardly a game at all. A spreadsheet game in the truest sense of the term. TradeWars at least uses some randomization in fights, and is a little more involved than "click trade route then click repeat 50 times". Plus it doesn't suffer from the geometric expansion problem which just causes whoever takes the lead to automatically keep that lead.

I guess you could call it realistic. Rich get richer... heh

	12-03-2003 01:18									#22
	So long, sookoll Inflate your Upload Space

Having disposed of sookoll, I can finally say with confidence that I've locked down BNT2.

	12-03-2003 12:29									#23
	Increase the size of your Attachments

What was your ship configuration? How did you stand the cost of losing your prime ship? So many questions?
What are the criteria for when to swap from one tactic to another in your otherwise excellent step-by-step formula?

SG[1]

	12-03-2003 13:40									#24
	Suffering from ads?

... and how is it that sookol is no more yet still owns planets?

SG[1]

	12-03-2003 21:20									#25
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I have no idea why sookoll still owns planets. Either he's not truly dead or it's a bug with BNT.

I kamikazed his bank, of course. It was pitifully poorly defended, and many other players could have taken it and possibly jumped ahead of me, so I had to act. I calculated that 28 comp 28 beams 24 power 24 torps 13 engine 0 else was the best kamikaze ship to use against him, at about 570B per ship. His planet had 16T credits to reimburse me and then some.

	13-03-2003 01:16									#26
	When to change styles Tired of ads?

1. Warp-lane trading

Play this style from the start, naturally. Invest everything in hull.

2. Real space trading

Switching to this requires buying an engine of level >= 10. Paying for this engine diverts funds away from upgrading your hull, so the decision depends on how far away good port pairs are from specials. For 1M (engine 10) you can travel between a good number of sectors in real space for 1 or 2 turns. Pick up a fuel scoop for increased trade income around this time.

3. Colonization funded by trading

By now you should have an escape pod., but it should still be the first day. The precise point at which to switch to this depends on the max number of colonists per planet, the colonist growth rate, the credit production rate, the availability of profitable ports, how many fighters it takes to defend a planet against your strongest opponent, how many turns you start with and get per day, and other factors. I worked out that hull 20 was a good point for BNT2. Trade only as much as needed to pay for colonists and the fighters to protect them.

If you don't want to lose, PROTECT YOUR NEW COLONIES! Fighters alone are enough, so you only need to upgrade your ship's computer system. For the first day of BNT2, 15M colos and 2.5M figs per new planet worked well. That required 45 colo trips, or 180 turns, plus trading.

4. Colonization funded by colonies

Naturally, do this when you can. Upgrade your hull with excess income only when it won't prevent you from spending most of your turns on colonizing.

5. (Optional) Reinforce colonies and upgrade ship

2.5M figs per planet won't last forever. I bolstered all my planets to 4M, then 6M, then 8.5M at various points. Your ship should get weapons (besides fighters) around the time EWDs stop working, but the hull should still be the largest system.

6. Conquer

Sooner or later, while finding sectors to colonize, you'll find poorly defended enemy planets. Take them. The credits spend on weapons systems indirectly purchase the turns it would take to make those planets yourself.

7. (Optional) Reinforce colonies while banking

You will either run out of soft targets, or stop caring about taking them. Make sure you don't become a soft target yet, by further boosting your fighter count. Mine rose to 10M per planet. A high beam system helps keep out intruders, too. However, you need to save most of your money. Pretty soon, that money will become more profitable than your colonies.

8. Bank without reinforcing colonies

When your colonies produce less than it takes to defend them, stop bothering and sit on your cash. I hit a peak of 133 planets with at least 10M fighters each. To keep up with my opponents, I would have needed 15M fighters each in 2 days, which was not worth my while.

9 (if winning). Bank while losing colonies

Sit on your cash and continue to rise above your competition. By now, your planets are meaningless, except your bank. Always make sure it can't be kamikazed effectively.

9 (if losing). Conquer and kamikaze banks

Find other banks and kamikaze them. If you can't, you've already lost. Give all your credits to your strongest alliance member, if possible.