13-05-2001 22:19									#1
	The great depresion on chiron :( :( :( :( :(:(:(:(:(:( Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Hello all I am curently playing a game as the spartans although i changed there name to the Russain empire making them offically the rusains and their leader Czar Nicholas Things were going good on all fronts and i had made no contact (still haven't) with other factions wich leaves me a lot of fungus, rich land and moutains well so far so good big center bases 14 ppl is going pop in the "devloped area of my empire" i have planetary trans. and command nexus and i think another s.p with cyborg factory and empath on the way but my money is going south crops are failing in the food producing sector resources are petering all hell is breaking lose on my empire and im the super power therefore -being the superpower,and being on chiron years later I can liken my problem to the great depresion a democratic nation with planed is going into a recession from its previous economic glory M.Y 2291, energy:750 Might:unsurpassed also the wealthiest on planet help please

Tyler Messer
"For the dustbolw has hit chrion"

	14-05-2001 02:13									#2
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How are you doing in way of Pact brothers and treaty partners. Commerce income is important.

Also you should heavily invest in Tree Farms, Hybrid Forrests and Fusion Labs.


Ned

	14-05-2001 02:34									#3
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Read man i have made no contact with the others on chiron

	14-05-2001 02:50									#4
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Sound like a victim of automated formers, no trade, not building energy enhancing facilities (energy bank, fusion labs)and SE settings that are not boosting economy (low efficiency, econ or both).

	14-05-2001 10:46									#5
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Sorry about that. But you have a very common problem. You have build a lot of expensive facilities to get to size 14 bases. I bet you have both Holos and Research Hospitals in every base, am I right? Each costs 6 credits. If you have bases more than twenty tiles away from HQ, your expenses will exceed you income. These bases are costing you big time.

As soon as you research the Empath Guild, a lot of your problems will go away. You will be elected governor. That will provide some cash. As well, you may make a friend or two. This will help with commerce income.

Alternatively, you can learn about Non Lethal Methods to help with the drones while running Green. Don't run Planned.

Finally, you may be forced to run Free Market. This truly helps the cash problem.

Ned

	14-05-2001 23:14									#6
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Are you using Engineers? or are you using your specialists as drone control? If the latter, you should try to switch some; IIRC, engineers should be available by this time in your game. I believe that you should be able to operate a size 14 base without the need for drone control specialists. Once you start getting drones, change them to engineers; they produce more energy than any other specialists and they don't cost any more to feed.

If you have been relying on drone control specialists to increase the number of workers, you may have become dependent on the extra workers to supply the mininum amount of food to maintain your population; in this case, you would need to increase your food supply (probably by crawlers, but perhaps by changing your workers' output) in order to afford to change drone control specialists into engineers. If you've gotten critically out of balance, it may be too late to switch production without going negative in energy or mins - then you'll have to crawl, unless you can enhance the local production with additional terraforming or with TFs or HFs. The sooner you switch over specialists the better; if you've got a solution on the way, you can afford to temporarily go short of food.

You can also crawl energy itself to address your problem, but the specialists give you additional research as well as the energy. Thats not to say that you shouldn't crawl energy or do both, but IMhO, if you are only going to do one, its more efficient to crawl food to feed specialists than to crawl energy.
[This message has been edited by johndmuller (edited May 14, 2001).]

	15-05-2001 00:50									#7
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I agree with the crawler/ specialist suggestion.

Another good idea would be to send out the probes to locate the other factions and steal tech/cash/ establish treaties. Often the Spartans can extort energy from weaker factions just by threatening to "crush them like a bug".

I am playing a game right now where i threatened Morgan, he gave me 650 credits. I am using the 650 to finance a war with Yang. Sending combined probe team/elite spartan troops to invade is a very potent combo. By buying off the defenders you increase your strength and weaken your enemy at the same time. Especially valuable if you are behind in tech.

One of the Spartans great strengths is intimidation. Use it.

	15-05-2001 00:55									#8
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Hey Johnd, If you have a chance, take a look at the "Pollution" thread. I believe the formula for ED I came up with fits the facts as we found them, but a little reflecting from another cannot hurt. Ned

	18-05-2001 09:15									#9
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Well ... it's hard to know exactly where your problems are coming from without seeing the game, but your SPs give a clue. Nexus, Planetary Transit +1, with Cyborg and Empath on the way ...

Hmm. You haven't made contact with anyone else, therefore you're under no threat from anyone else. You are in an *ideal* builder situation - and yet you choose the ***Nexus*** and the Transit above the Weather Paradigm, the Merchant, the HGP, and others. You have the Cyborg under way ... but you aren't in a position where you have to fight anyone.

The Empath is an extremely good decision, giving you instant contact with others and probably the governorship if you play it right.

I think your problems stem from the fact that you're fundamentally a momentum-oriented player. Without other factions to cripple, enslave or subsume, you are lost
[This message has been edited by Misotu (edited May 18, 2001).]

	19-05-2001 03:55									#10
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She speaks the truth. Intrinsically momentum players often struggle when faced with a builder situation, and this is yet another of those circumstances.

When you hit other factions, and have butts to kick, you will begin to thrive once more. My advice would be to get cracking on the EG, and, if you have a large army (and being the Spartans with the nexus, you should have!) go conquer.

Good luck

	19-05-2001 09:16									#11
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Ya ur right im a ****ing War mongerer and herego bulid armies that will never be used un less i find another faction,as a conquerer i need lands to conquer, people to enslave, money to take ,techs to steal armies to subvert, and of course nations to bring to their respective knees.

Without asses to kick im lost, im not much of a bulider although id like to be one and if you could teach me some fundamentals and finer points of "Planet Raping" (As the tree hugging bastards would call it lol ) I would be willing to learn.

Tyler Messer
"Without a world to take I am left dead"

	19-05-2001 10:47									#12
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Umm ... that might take a while, since turning builder would involve a fairly fundamental change in attitude

Conquer games can pretty much always be found on smaller maps. Under those circumstances, you will almost never have trouble finding butts to kick etc. The challenge for a conqueror is playing the war game on a larger map. And for the builder, the reverse ...

	19-05-2001 18:47									#13
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Ummm. I always play on huge map when i play so back to trying to teach me how to be a bulider

Tyler Messer
"Theres no time to discriminate hate every mother****er thats in your way!"

	21-05-2001 20:57									#14
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One of your basic attitude adjsutments to become a builder is "Don't Go Looking for a Fight". Build enough of a standing army to kill worms, discourage extortion, and repel invasion. Be fair with your neighbors but don't turn your back on them. Force yourself to play FM and you'll learn to keep the boys at home.

Explore for the purposes of disovering neighbors to trade with.

Although you may find it difficult at first, refrain from threatening to crush anyone like a bug.