05-03-2003 06:12									#1
	I was attacked Get a bigger avatar today!

I'm only up to turn 143 on my first real game (lots of work and husbandly duties). But, I just got attacked by the Tachidi. It was a turkey shoot, they didn't stand a chance. 23 to my 60+

But, I've been reading that the AI won't attack out of their home systems. That's just not true.

	05-03-2003 06:35									#2
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I was attacked by the Silicoids in my 3rd game. They came at me VERY early in the game with several Destroyer-sized carriers and a TF of short-range beam frigates.

It was only the presence of planetary defenses and LOTS OF LUCK that prevented my third game from ending rather badly

I came back and taught them a lesson down the road when I conquered them (and every other civ on the board other than the Antarans), but they caught me with my pants down early in the game.

I've been very careful about defense ever since. That game I'd been going almost entirely for colony ships (and just building planetary defense as my defense).

Perhaps the AI looks at the # of ships you have deployed and uses it as a gauge for whether to attack you? I didn't have any warships at that point, only colony ships and scouts. I had plenty of planetary defense, but I assume the AI can't see that.

	05-03-2003 18:22									#3
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The AI can see your planetary defence, i am sure of that, and i am also sure that i can see it's Beam Bases or whatever.
A button named System View, or something like that, is
in the screen where you can choose your battle, so you can see in advance what defences exists in yhe system

Last edited by Prothero on 05-03-2003 at 18:34

	05-03-2003 22:44									#4
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got the game today. currently playing my first game. had 2 races declare war and send ships to me attacking several times. not sure what people are talking about

	05-03-2003 23:05									#5
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG got the game today. currently playing my first game. had 2 races declare war and send ships to me attacking several times. not sure what people are talking about

AMAZING 10000 people are saying that the A.I cant attack with a serious force or ever send ground troops but they are all lying.

Play 5 full games then tell me about great A.I fleet & land invasion's.

	05-03-2003 23:50									#6
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With the exception of Mark, it always seems that settlers with less than 10 posts are the ones posting information that is contradicting the majority. suspicious to say the least...

	06-03-2003 00:32									#7
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Uhm. No one is saying that the AI doesn't attack. The complaint is that they do not conquer or invade, other than perhaps an outpost or new colony or two.

So they may indeed attack a lot, though they haven't yet in my games since buying MOO3 a couple days ago, but those attacks are pointless unless they carry the real threat of actually losing the game.

EDIT: To add that I do like the game so far, though I am still in the learning curve. I bought it knowing the issues already brought out thanks to the folks on this board. I think they are fixable.

But lets not call people liars for pointing out the AI agressiveness problem with invasions. That is a flaw that I think most all agree with.

Last edited by Bill_in_PDX on 06-03-2003 at 00:38

	06-03-2003 02:43									#8
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quote: But lets not call people liars

indeed, lets not call people liars. or accuse people of calling other people liars....

	06-03-2003 05:10									#9
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I read the reference above incorrectly. Sorry about that, certainly a bad mistake.

I sure am glad there are friendly boards like this around where people exchange ideas without sarcasm... oh wait, I guess i found the wrong place.

	06-03-2003 05:18									#10
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Yes, I haven't seen the AI land and invade a planet (although I have admitedly not played past 100 turns in a single game) but they do attack with their fleets, and this can often be just as bad. In one of my games I had a huge farming planet that supplied nearly all of my empire with food. The AI came along and blew up the defending system ships, and blockaded it. All but three of my planets where thrown into starvation, and I didn't have the firepower to break the blockade. They essentially crippled me and left me to die a slow painful death.

	06-03-2003 05:19									#11
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The more things change....

I played my first game on Easy. I found a Splinter colony on turn 12, but did not have any defenses when a scout ship came around on turn 25. I restarted, and built 2 ships early to defend that system.

The scout was nowhere to been seen on turn 25.

It seems the AI, just like in Civ, can see your defenses. The Grendarl (who I am at war with - I'm Nommo - my ancestors exiled their ancestors to the surface; some bad blood there I guess) sent 1 ship to attack a relatively new splinter colony I found, but 2 ships of mine arrived there two turns before his. He couldn't turn them around in hyperspace, and the ship never had a chance.

	06-03-2003 05:21									#12
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quote: In one of my games I had a huge farming planet that supplied nearly all of my empire with food

Eggs...basket....y'know the rest

	06-03-2003 05:39									#13
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by justjake73 Eggs...basket....y'know the rest

I know, I know... But I always have a very difficult time finding suitable farming planets while playing as the Sakkra (who are poor bioharvesters to boot). My empire is usually starving by turn 60 and I can never find any way of feeding my people.

My most succesful attempt at feeding my people has been to subjugate and enslave other empires to do my farming for me, but the starvation usually kicks in before i can manage that.

	06-03-2003 14:02									#14
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coming back to this.....

played more on the same game(now around turn 140). i've had the ai attacking and conquering a planet. i also had it attacking my homeworld. when i'm totally conquered(good god i'm loosing on easy level ) i'll let you know

	06-03-2003 15:45									#15
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG coming back to this..... played more on the same game(now around turn 140). i've had the ai attacking and conquering a planet. i also had it attacking my homeworld. when i'm totally conquered(good god i'm loosing on easy level ) i'll let you know

I agree with you it too soon to say that the AI isnot attacking at all. Like the person who has his farming planet
blockada show that the AI is acting in a more intelligence way compare to game in the past. I than sorry you are loseing your game. I lost quite afew game in MOO before I brought the stragetic guide.

	06-03-2003 15:56									#16
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well i 'm not loosing yet, but not making any advances either

Last edited by MarkG on 06-03-2003 at 16:06

	06-03-2003 16:12									#17
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i still say even if the ai does attack occasionally that its very inconsistent somtimes it attacks other times it won't hit your homesystem even when its completely undefended.

	06-03-2003 16:27									#18
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is it possible that it has defense as it's first priority and/or it has other wars to deal with and/or it doesnt have the "required"(from it's programming) amount of ships to send(usually i see it coming with 3-6 ships(we're talking about my first game/a few hours only))?

	07-03-2003 04:40									#19
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In MOO and MOO2 the computer very rarely built any real defence before they attack you. This mean they are repair better for than attack by you.

	07-03-2003 04:57									#20
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The complaint in moo3 is not that the AI wont ever attack it is that:

1) The AI will only ever attack with small amounts of force, never enough to defeat a significant defense

2) When the AI wins a combat, it will never send in troop transports and actually CONQUER the colony. It will sit there forever, until you either starve to death or come in with a fleet and retake the system.


The AI actually defends pretty well.....it just cant attack worth crap.

Working on mods....

	07-03-2003 17:27									#21
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I read ancient and medival history where the defence was heavy favor.. To storm than heavy fortive castle or cities meanth very heavy loss to the attracker. So most attracker
just laid seige to these stronghold and try to stave then out.
Thoughtout history the swing between offisence and defence went back and forth. The defence value of the local
nobleman in his castle ended when heavy cannons where able to breach the wall.

	07-03-2003 17:36									#22
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I had the Ithkul invading one of my Border Worlds (which I just a couple of turns earlier got from the Klackons for some Tech of mine).
They attacked with an Army of more then 100 Ground-Units and a total Strength of 4400.
Regardless to say, that they succeeded.
At least til I prepared a Fleet for my Counterattack and then bombarded the Population of the Planet (and I hope the Troops with it) to dust.

	07-03-2003 18:15									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Proteus_MST I had the Ithkul invading one of my Border Worlds (which I just a couple of turns earlier got from the Klackons for some Tech of mine). They attacked with an Army of more then 100 Ground-Units and a total Strength of 4400. Regardless to say, that they succeeded. At least til I prepared a Fleet for my Counterattack and then bombarded the Population of the Planet (and I hope the Troops with it) to dust.

This show it still too early to say anything about the AI in the game.

	08-03-2003 04:29									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Alexfrog The complaint in moo3 is not that the AI wont ever attack it is that: 1) The AI will only ever attack with small amounts of force, never enough to defeat a significant defense 2) When the AI wins a combat, it will never send in troop transports and actually CONQUER the colony. It will sit there forever, until you either starve to death or come in with a fleet and retake the system. The AI actually defends pretty well.....it just cant attack worth crap. Working on mods....

Again like all these assertions it isnt enntirely true. The AI can do it, and does do it, but it happens far less often than a human player would manage it.

I've had an enemy invade one of my fully developed systems with enough ships (35, mostly superdreadnoughts) to smash the planetary defences, then land 13,500 points worth of troops on the main world to conquer it in 3 rounds of combat. We just need to encourage it to do this more often, but not so often that most games result in a 3:1 gangbanging of the human player by turn 100.

	08-03-2003 11:49									#25
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I hear the people who make this name are working on than mod base patch to this game instead of trying to change the hard wire programming code their use so it is hard to change they programming code.

	08-03-2003 13:25									#26
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Has anyone ever just for the hell of it just declared war on the New Orions, like around turn 200? I did and they just sent a task force past 2 moderately defended colonies and blew my homeworld to cinders. They didn't even dignify my proclamation of war with a responce.

	08-03-2003 22:34									#27
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: I did and they just sent a task force past 2 moderately defended colonies and blew my homeworld to cinders

Sounds like they considered you beneath contempt; they did not want to engage in debate with a race they consider so far beneath them, but you could not insult them with impunity either.

Typical Antaran behavior - they make examples out of races like yours so no others will dare to follow your lead.

There is likely a Guardian roaming the remains of your home system right now

	08-03-2003 22:36									#28
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: There is likely a Guardian roaming the remains of your home system right now

mmm, guardians are cool. . .

	09-03-2003 00:44									#29
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I believe that they tone down the computer AI to give the human player than change at the game. Remember Star Reach from Interplay.

	09-03-2003 08:30									#30
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I decleared war on the NOs on about turn 500 and it was probably the most fun i had in the game. And to think it only took about 6 hours to get there.