10-03-2003 06:59									#1
	Rise and Fall of Civs Put an end to popups!

On thing that really isn't accurate about all the Civ games made to date is that once a civ is conquered, it is gone. Sometimes they "respawn" somewhere else, which is equally silly. In RL, when an empire falls, generally it splits up. This was modeled to some extent in Civ2 by the "conquer the capital to get a civil war" idea. It made conquering the capital worth something. This was a good idea, but it's not perfect.

My idea is that if, say, the Romans conquer Egypt (as in it has no cities or units left) but then the capital city of Rome is captured, Egypt returns! Because of the disorganization of Rome from losing its capital, the Egyptian people manage to break away from their oppressors and return to their former glory, etc. The return of a conquered civilization happened countless times over history, and I think my idea models it best.

	10-03-2003 07:18									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

The problem though is that some Civs integrated so well with their captors that they wouldn't think of rebelling. On the other hand sometimes groups that had never had a nation demand autonomy after their old nation is dissolved.

	10-03-2003 18:50									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

The culture flipping of civ3 is an attempt at something like this...........and it showed it is hard to introduce these factors whilst retaining good gameplay.

	13-03-2003 01:53									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Culture flipping doesn't make much sense IMO, and doesn't allow a dead civ to reappear.
In order to get civil wars and such, you need a model of nationalities which evolve with time as conquered people either become assimilated, replaced, or more and more opposed to their rulers. CtP2's slave rebellions was good for example, except it created new civs or barbarians. If the slaves knew which civ they came from, the game could make the city revolt into that civ if the slaves won their upheaval. Same if the city is discontent enough. If it can remember it used to be part of Empire X, it will revolt. That leads to the same abuse as culture flipping, except you'd have to be able to win fights in order for the city to flip (with the population providing the fighters, and taking appropriate damage when they are killed).