13-03-2003 12:16									#1
	A moment of silence Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Master of Orion is truly dead. The third installment plays like a spreadsheet. I'd say more but it's already been said in ten other threads. Let us mourn the passing of a truly great franchise.

...

	13-03-2003 12:22									#2
	Inflate your Upload Space

I'd like to break this moment of silence with a rude noise, then follow it up with a similar rude noise after a somewhat dramatic pause. Its the next installment, like it or love it, but its still alive. Couldn't your "mourning" go into some other whine thread?

	13-03-2003 12:40									#3
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

No need to be uncivil. Just saying the odds of a Master of Orion 4 look pretty damned bleak right now. The genre will go on, but the franchise is dead.

	13-03-2003 13:00									#4
	Suffering from ads?

The franchise might be dead, but the spirit is not. The failure of MoO3 will inspire fans to create a true sequel one day, be it one of the open source projects or a commercial product that might bear a different name but will be a MoO at heart.

	13-03-2003 13:11									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Moo is dead. Yes.

Moo3 isn't Moo.

Moo3 is alive and kicking

	13-03-2003 20:51									#6
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by statusperfect Moo is dead. Yes. Moo3 isn't Moo. Moo3 is alive and kicking

Yeah, kicking because QS/IG held a pillow over its face, smothering a great brand and whizzing on the fans with this "peacenik" A.I. (Declares war for no reason but never actually attacks) and useless manuals/strat guide/in-game encyclopedia....

	13-03-2003 20:58									#7
	Remove this text

Gotta love how every person who doesn't like the game is called a "whiner".

But if he posted how much he thought the game was the best ever, would he be considered a "Good" whiner?.

	13-03-2003 21:19									#8
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by vee4473 Gotta love how every person who doesn't like the game is called a "whiner". But if he posted how much he thought the game was the best ever, would he be considered a "Good" whiner?.

maybe if constructive criticism was used instead of saying "Yeah, kicking because QS/IG held a pillow over its face, smothering a great brand and whizzing on the fans with this "peacenik" A.I."

	13-03-2003 21:52									#9
	Got spare money?

no, no , you have a point h tower, but i was referring to the original post about the mourning.

the first response was that he should go whine somewhere else.

	13-03-2003 22:07									#10
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Well, I have seen this happen before.

A great game franchise/concept - hyped-up to such a lofty heights (by the developers, the distributers. promoters, and yes, by us loyal fans) to the point that all of our dreams and expectations seem too good to be true.

The game is delayed and delayed - and the expectation grows - loyal fans such as myself pre-purchase it, and the back-orders grow and grow.

Game magazines hype up the 'beta' and our appetites are whetted and we cannot hold out with the suspense.

Then the game hits the shelves...

Let down, disappointment and disbelief that waiting all this time comes to this. We become enraged, start flaming the developers/distributers website with "When will you release the *&#$@% patch", or "this game sucks!", or "what a waste of money". Game magazines start reviewing the game for what it really is (funny they did not do it before when they had the beta copy).

Then sales start to spiral, the developers/distrbuters stop answering our emails about fixes and patches, and finally, they become completely silent (that's when we find out that the bulk of the developing team has found employment elsewhere etc.). Big name fan sites start to dwindle as interest for the game plummets far faster than it should.

Final verdict.

The developers won't touch the product with a ten foot pole, the fan sites (which are the biggest and best promoters of the game) start to disappear, multiplayer servers dry up, and finally the game becomes nothing more than a mere memory (or played at home by a few die hard fans like myself).

I think we have all seen this happen a time or two - I have seen it happen to such games as Birth of the Federation (I know, something more was happening behind the scenes there with ST franchise moving to another company), Reach for the Star 2 (if you think M003 is rotten - you have not played RFTS2), and Imperium Galactica 2.

I only hope that they boys at QS put out a really comprehensive patch soon, or else this game may become another dinosaur exhibit.

Sincerely,

Gaultesian

	13-03-2003 22:10									#11
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I have to agree. I liked all the little videos in moo2, example, when you stole technogy, when the space amobea attacks, destruction of a planet. Its little things that make a game great. There is no real personalization of ships becuase you cant contol research. Even when you direct research to a certain area the ai decides your wrong its right and changes it. With anyluck space empires V will be out by the end of the year.

	13-03-2003 22:51									#12
	Remove this text

While I am sad that BOTF and Imperium Galactica 2 have faded into obscurity I am not about Moo3 ala Infogreed............

	14-03-2003 04:29									#13
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I'll wait until a patch comes out and give it a go before I decide if this game is dead.

	14-03-2003 05:01									#14
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

IMO the guys at QS and Infogrames can still save this game if they put out a good first patch in a good timely manner.

Otherwise, it may go the way of IG2 and BOTF.

As the word gets out and people read the reviews and customer satisfaction/dissatisfaction, it may deter more people from buying the game.

And we all know that unit sales determine the amount and quality of product support and patches - no one is going to spend a lot of time and resources (and money) on fixing a game that no one buys.

Let's hope a patch comes soon, and some of the bad PR gets stamped out.

Sincerely,

Gaultesian

	14-03-2003 05:53									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Its funny. In every franchise, this type of topic will always repeat over and over again.

Always there will be those who wanted just an upgrade on the old version and didn't like the way the game developers chose to take the sequel. Always there will be the threads about the spirit of the game dying.

But always there will be those who enjoy the sequel and new players entering the scene to build a new community. I have seen it with the Warcraft/Starcraft franchise, the Total Annhiliation franchise, the C&C franchise and even the Street Fighter franchise.

In each and everyone of the franchises there will be those who think their opinions of the game are the be all and end all and will walk away and think that its over. After a few months they will be gone permantly and the those who continue to play will still be there.

	14-03-2003 06:09									#16
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

You could add Civ to that list. BTW TA2 is rumored to be in the works.

	14-03-2003 06:16									#17
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 You could add Civ to that list. BTW TA2 is rumored to be in the works.

Really? Someone managed to ressurect the name after Cavedog went down huh? Neat.

I liked the first one, the second one wasn't to my taste as much.

	14-03-2003 09:09									#18
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Corentor Its funny. In every franchise, this type of topic will always repeat over and over again. Always there will be those who wanted just an upgrade on the old version and didn't like the way the game developers chose to take the sequel. Always there will be the threads about the spirit of the game dying.

Or it could be like CTP2, where a game with great potential is released, but it's riddled with bugs and performance sucks. A single inadequate patch is released and the game really never is heard from again - except for a couple of mutants still fooling around with it. I think the next patch will determine which direction this incarnation is headed.

	14-03-2003 11:06									#19
	Re: A moment of silence Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by DarthVeda Master of Orion is truly dead. The third installment plays like a spreadsheet. I'd say more but it's already been said in ten other threads. Let us mourn the passing of a truly great franchise. ...

IMHO It may be too early to call the franchise dead. MOO has a strong fan base. Match that with a good development team and it should rise again.

	14-03-2003 12:19									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Gaultesian, I ejoyed that post. Not sure how close to the mark you are as it relates to MOO3, but you're surely close.

Myself, I like Moo3 for what it is, but it's not holding my attention. I'm not enraged that the game isn't a 5-Star game, but I have told several friends not to buy it, or to at least wait until it hits the bargan bin. One friend of mine gave his copy to another friend.

	14-03-2003 17:11									#21
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Thanks Lotharun, I believe your post pretty much sums up what I was talking about - if the reviews are not all that favourable (from game magazines, reviewers, and owners such as yourself), then potential sales will be affected (your friends not buying the game, or waiting until it is in the discount bin are a pretty good example).

I work at home and consequently, I have a wee bit'o time on my hands to play good games.

I buy about 1 to 3 titles a month - some just as they hit the stores (about 30%), some after they have been out for a while so that I can hunt the game magazine reviews, and the fan based website forums and the official forums to ascertain the goodness of the game (through threads such as this one), and some I wait until they are in the bargain bin.

When word hits the steets that a big and highly anticipated game has fallen well below expectations (not the expectations of the die-hard fans), then sales generally tend to plummet.

We can all read the news on the front page of Apolyton about how game reviewers are hammering this game in such a bad way (some of the worst I have seen in a long while), and in the official IG forums to see that there are a lot of disgruntled game owners out there.

Let's face it, when a company does not make money on a particular venture, it will cut all expenses and costs with said venture to minimize its losses or to make a small return. For us it may mean that this game will die a relatively quick death online and all official support and fan-based support (mods, files, online play arenas, etc.) will disappear. A patch and a few good reviews might stop or stall it.

Now, before anyone calls me a Moo3 hater let me tell you that I am enjoying the game quite well (I would give it about an 75% approval rating, and higher once a good patch comes out) and I am losing some sleep trying to blast those damn cynoids out of my sector of space.

I am just trying to be realistic in looking at the long-term viability of ths game in particular - not the franchise or the future of the franchise.

Sincerely,

Gaultesian

	15-03-2003 00:01									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by statusperfect Moo is dead. Yes. Moo3 isn't Moo.

Yeah, this isn't moo.

For me Moo was always a glorified ship design simulator. In the end combat was what won games, and good ship designs won combat.

All the planet and infrastructure stuff was to decide what kind of ships you could build and how fast you could build them.

This is what made moo so cool. Because of the tech tree, every game you had different tech, and so different ships.

Moo2 was cool because they added more depth to the combat, even though they removed the coolness of the tech.

Moo3 has actually made their ship design screen worse Control over combat is next to nil, strategic options are eliminated by starlanes, so the core of what Moo was to me has been ripped from this game.

	15-03-2003 00:30									#23
	Got spare money?

Oooh, let's have a fight between Garth Vader and DarthVeda!

	15-03-2003 01:17									#24
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Since we probably agree on Moo3 issues, He'll have to win a name fight based on seinority

	15-03-2003 12:08									#25
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

The prophecies have come true!

	15-03-2003 15:36									#26
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Corentor Its funny. In every franchise, this type of topic will always repeat over and over again. Always there will be those who wanted just an upgrade on the old version and didn't like the way the game developers chose to take the sequel. Always there will be the threads about the spirit of the game dying. But always there will be those who enjoy the sequel and new players entering the scene to build a new community. I have seen it with the Warcraft/Starcraft franchise, the Total Annhiliation franchise, the C&C franchise and even the Street Fighter franchise. In each and everyone of the franchises there will be those who think their opinions of the game are the be all and end all and will walk away and think that its over. After a few months they will be gone permantly and the those who continue to play will still be there.

MOO3 is only suffering from to much from people hight hope. First this isnot going to be MOO 2.5 or MOO 1. They try out new thing. In real life than Galactic overlord isnot to micro-mangerment 200 millions plus planets . Of design
very ship type in the galaxy. He make general polcy guideline and stay out of running the government let the bureacrat run thing. Off tocip : President is being critism for not letting the proffresion diplmatic at the state department do they job, Bush dipl is what make it inpossible to get UN approve on cation against Iraq

	16-03-2003 00:03									#27
	Put an end to popups!

At least with MOO and MOO2 I could play the game for more than 5 minutes without a Direct X error, or even worse, a complete system shutdown! This game is dead (at least for me) until they fix it.

	16-03-2003 01:12									#28
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I played the game. I agree with the poster, I think the game is dead. I doubt any amount of patches would ressurrect it. They might be able to fix the ai, but by the time the patch comes out, in what, 6-15 months? I doubt people even remember a game called Master of Orion 3.

Anyways, I somewhat like the game. Just wished they didn't screwed up making it...

	16-03-2003 12:32									#29
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by BobD At least with MOO and MOO2 I could play the game for more than 5 minutes without a Direct X error, or even worse, a complete system shutdown! This game is dead (at least for me) until they fix it.

I have the same touble untril I went into opion than lower the graphic settleing from hight to medium or low depending on your computer. It work for me.

	19-03-2003 05:15									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by vee4473 Gotta love how every person who doesn't like the game is called a "whiner". But if he posted how much he thought the game was the best ever, would he be considered a "Good" whiner?.

Kinda like anyone who opposes war is "unamerican"...
Or an enemy...