21-03-2003 14:00									#1
	Diplomatic bug, or my misunderstanding? Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I was wondering if anyone else has experienced multiple trade and/or research sharing agreements with other empires. I haven't kept track (though I am considering doing so), but it seems like I get multiple requests for these types of agreements (also seems to happen with alliance offers).

For example, say a race contacts me to ask/offer a trade agreement, and I accept. Within a few turns the same race contacts me again with the same request/offer. This has happened a number of times (with all types of agreements) so I was wondering, are these types of agreements established for a limited number of turns? Or is this perhaps another minor bug? Any help or feedback is appreciated.

	21-03-2003 14:11									#2
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once you have a trade agreement-lets say for research- you can upgrade so to speak that agreement. Every so often you can increase trade with other races. Im not sure if this is a bug or how the game is meant to be--but in real life people increase trade more and more as im sure they do in the game.

	21-03-2003 15:34									#3
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You can improve and expand trade and research agreements over time as you and your partner expand. This is not dissimilar to the way other games work, including MoO2 iirc.

	21-03-2003 15:43									#4
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Bah, just more micromanagement and waste of time. In moo 2 your income with trade kept increasing as you and your friend's empire continued to grow.

	21-03-2003 16:09									#5
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quote: Original post by Sinister1974 once you have a trade agreement-lets say for research- you can upgrade so to speak that agreement. Every so often you can increase trade with other races. Im not sure if this is a bug or how the game is meant to be--but in real life people increase trade more and more as im sure they do in the game.

OK I follow you, but all other factors being the same, why wouldn't an "upgrade" be automatic. I mean, if my general relationship with the race is the same (or perhaps even better) why would I need to make a new agreement. BTW, would a negative response to the second offer mean that the original agreement remains in force, or is it then cancelled?

The only true "upgrade" that I can see would be from a Non-Aggression Pact to a Full Military Alliance.

	22-03-2003 15:54									#6
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quote: Bah, just more micromanagement and waste of time. In moo 2 your income with trade kept increasing as you and your friend's empire continued to grow.

	22-03-2003 17:55									#7
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quote: Originally posted by BobD OK I follow you, but all other factors being the same, why wouldn't an "upgrade" be automatic. I mean, if my general relationship with the race is the same (or perhaps even better) why would I need to make a new agreement. BTW, would a negative response to the second offer mean that the original agreement remains in force, or is it then cancelled? The only true "upgrade" that I can see would be from a Non-Aggression Pact to a Full Military Alliance.

1. I think the old Trade agreement would be still in force it you don´t agree to expand the agreement.

2. I am not sure but I think the improvement of the Trade agreement means that you before expanding the trade agreement have for example a trade volume which consists of 1% of your GDP and with the improved trade agreement are able to expand this value to 2%.
As probably comes at a cost (you first have to invest a few turns, before the improved Trade agreement will earn you money) it is negotiated diplomatically, such as a new trade agreement
(just pure guesses)

	25-03-2003 15:29									#8
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Again no information what kind of trade is going to happen in numbers..just a new pact is done and that's all.

	25-03-2003 17:33									#9
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There is a bug in agreements that makes it possible to agree/make multible agreements of the same type. You just make new offer before other side responds.

Some people have had so many of one agreement that the others no longer show up in diplomatrix.

I've (and others) have reported it allready in official forums.

I've also suggested that they remove the need of renegotiating the trade/research agreements every few turns. It gets anoying pretty quickly and quite frankly is totally pointless (in both gameplay and realism terms)


hmh, moo3.com seems to be down. dang

	27-03-2003 02:13									#10
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And another thing:

Anyone know the difference between and "TA:economic" and a "TApen border trade"

They seem to be the same (one just being greater than the other)...but they are two different requests. (I.E. you can request to "increase economic" or you can request to "open border trade".

Strangely, the manual doesn't mention this.

	27-03-2003 02:55									#11
	Do you really mean that? Inflate your Upload Space

I’ve never had the AI accept a tech trade I’ve proposed. On the other hand, I’ve fairly frequently had the AI ask for a trade, and I generally accept unless the offerred tech is completely useless.

Recently I had a very interesting trade request. The Psilons said they’d declare war on the New Orions for a tech and give me some tech to boot for one of my techs! I was dumbfounded and said No, just to save their pasty white behinds (I’m a nice guy, after all, and we had a budding friendship building). Then the Nommo called up a few turns later and asked for the same thing. I counter-offered, leaving out the declare war. That got messed up somehow and they ended up with my tech and a war with the New Orions. Then it got really funny. The poor Nommo then pleaded for a full alliance. Apparently the AI figured out that they were totally stewed against the New Orions and called on the number one power (me – the gas bags) to save their bacon. I declined, but am watching for the New Orions to go hunting some cuttlefish. I haven’t seen it yet, but it should be interesting!!

My conclusion is that this was a first class ‘oops’, but I liked the way the AI reacted to the oops. Regardless, it was humerous.

	27-03-2003 21:32									#12
	Inflate your Upload Space

Yeah I've seen that sort of thing happen. It seems to be when they want techs so much better than the ones they can offer you that they hunt around for something "really expensive" to add to their end of the table. I usually let them off the hook too, since the NO's only seem to bother stomping planets belonging to powerful people, not weak ones that declare war on them.

	30-03-2003 03:55									#13
	Re: Do you really mean that? Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by yoink15 And another thing: Anyone know the difference between and "TA:economic" and a "TApen border trade" They seem to be the same (one just being greater than the other)...but they are two different requests. (I.E. you can request to "increase economic" or you can request to "open border trade". Strangely, the manual doesn't mention this.

I "think" TA open border trade gives income for your starports for the other players planets while TA economic works on a grander scale. So basicly, open border is of no use if your civilisations dont border each other.