23-03-2003 07:26									#1
	Space Race Victory Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Apologies if this has been done to death, but I hate the space race victory. I always turn it off as having it inevitably robs me of the opportunity to use robot artillery (my favourite unit).

Does anyone else hate it as much as me? I mean the spaceship looks pretty dumb - I thought Civ 1's space race was better: allowing you to sacrifice points for speed or to build a bigger ship for more points.

I always turn off diplomatic victory as well. It's either culture, military or domination for me.

	23-03-2003 07:45									#2
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I'm always too defensive so i dont have time to conquest everything before the space race comes up so it's the way i almost always win. So now i'm disabling it for this and future games

I like it as a way of kinda setting a win that isnt just based on score like the 2050 win (i.e. more satisfying). It finishes the game when it is ready to be finished without you having to take over the world which takes bloody ages with RR everywhere.

	23-03-2003 07:46									#3
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You can use the editor and mod in more requirements, say more than 1 of each piece, maybe that'll make it more interesting.

I'm not too much a fan of Space Victories in my personal games, and in competitive games, usually it is possible to go for a diplomatic victory earlier.

Conquest...

	23-03-2003 09:23									#4
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I must be hated because no one ever votes for me in the UN election. Even though I bribe the hell out of the others.

	23-03-2003 10:30									#5
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There's a good article by Bamspeedy on AI attitude towards you that will help you get the diplomatic victory.

I'll try and find the link for you...

	23-03-2003 11:46									#6
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What I do is delay the availability of the SS parts, with one not available until Integrated Defense, and increasing the costs, some up to 1000 (100 in the editor).

	23-03-2003 13:00									#7
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here it is, it's at CFC

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=44999

	23-03-2003 13:23									#8
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[quote]Space Race Victory [/quote
...is for wussies
I always turn it off, too.

	23-03-2003 22:48									#9
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I used to turn it off too, but I thought "hey, it does not need to be bloodlust EVERY time...". So I turned it on again. Even though I think I'll lose more times.

	24-03-2003 00:09									#10
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If you don't like the space race, try my Space Age Mod (link below in sig). I moved the components to the end of a modified modern tech tree, increased the cost (making leaders more important if you can get them - I narrowly beat the Egyprians once by a leader finishing a single component). Try it out.

	24-03-2003 00:54									#11
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quote: If you don't like the space race, try my Space Age Mod (link below in sig). I moved the components to the end of a modified modern tech tree, increased the cost (making leaders more important if you can get them - I narrowly beat the Egyprians once by a leader finishing a single component). Try it out.

Thanks. Downloading and checking out readme, looking forward to it. Unfortunately I don't have time tonight to play Civ3.

	24-03-2003 02:11									#12
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My first half-dozen full length games were with space race, and i kept either winning or losing (due to space race) before getting to Radar Artillery, AEGIS Cruisers, or Stealth planes.

I finally got pissed off that i'd never gotten far enough to get them and turned it off. Turns out those units were cool enough for me to never turn that goddamn sapce race back on.

	24-03-2003 02:27									#13
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Thanks for the link MZ.

Agreed Jarvin - the Aegis cruisers are worth it alone.

	24-03-2003 02:54									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon Thanks for the link MZ.

No problem

quote: Agreed Jarvin - the Aegis cruisers are worth it alone.

I actually think the Aegis are pretty worthless as it is. However, I do some major modding and enable them to carry cruise missiles, I also take away their ability to see subs and give it to Destroyers because if not then Destroyers are obsolete. That forces you to build both.

	24-03-2003 02:57									#15
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Hey, I don't like to be forced!

	24-03-2003 07:12									#16
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Master Zen,
I've been thinking about modding cruise missiles/AEGIS for a while. Did you just add the "Tactical Missile" flag to the CM and the "Carries...." to the AEGIS? If so, did the AI react poorly to being able to carrry nukes on AEGIS? Thanks!

	24-03-2003 11:06									#17
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I don't suppose there's any way to make a ship (Destroyer) able to bombard but not directly attack subs is there? Without messing up other attack options, I mean.

	24-03-2003 11:10									#18
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I think the 'wussies' are the ones who turn off space race at the set-up screen. Why not just 'turn it off' with your MAs marching into the AI's capital. >:)

	24-03-2003 11:51									#19
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quote: Originally posted by 0bsidi0n Master Zen, I've been thinking about modding cruise missiles/AEGIS for a while. Did you just add the "Tactical Missile" flag to the CM and the "Carries...." to the AEGIS? If so, did the AI react poorly to being able to carrry nukes on AEGIS? Thanks!

Yep, I did just that. However, the AI doesn't ever use them on ships (well, at least I've never seen them do it)

However, I gave the missiles a range of 8 so the AI does shoot them from their cities against your ships. Kinda balances it out a little.

	24-03-2003 11:55									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Rommel2D I don't suppose there's any way to make a ship (Destroyer) able to bombard but not directly attack subs is there? Without messing up other attack options, I mean.

Nope, there isn't.

Would've been interesting though, depth charging

	24-03-2003 21:29									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen Yep, I did just that. However, the AI doesn't ever use them on ships (well, at least I've never seen them do it) However, I gave the missiles a range of 8 so the AI does shoot them from their cities against your ships. Kinda balances it out a little.

I wonder if this is due to the AIs non-use of bombardment type weapons or if it's tied to the AIs use of tactical nukes. I haven't gotten that far very often, so I don't know if the AI uses subs with tactical nukes well.

	24-03-2003 23:44									#22
	Re: Space Race Victory Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Agathon Apologies if this has been done to death, but I hate the space race victory. I always turn it off as having it inevitably robs me of the opportunity to use robot artillery (my favourite unit). Does anyone else hate it as much as me? I mean the spaceship looks pretty dumb - I thought Civ 1's space race was better: allowing you to sacrifice points for speed or to build a bigger ship for more points. I always turn off diplomatic victory as well. It's either culture, military or domination for me.

Not as much as a cultural victory. I'm a culture whore just because I'm always affraid that my cities will flip so I always win by a cultural vic. Well I use to, now I just turn it off.

Spec.

	25-03-2003 00:14									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen I actually think the Aegis are pretty worthless as it is. However, I do some major modding and enable them to carry cruise missiles, I also take away their ability to see subs and give it to Destroyers because if not then Destroyers are obsolete. That forces you to build both.

But they look cool....

	25-03-2003 07:46									#24
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Cool, thanks MZ!

	25-03-2003 08:22									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon But they look cool....

The AEGIS Cruiser looks like a friggin' patrol boat!
I was severely disappointed when I first saw the graphic preview before Civ3 came out.

	25-03-2003 09:07									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Rommel2D I think the 'wussies' are the ones who turn off space race at the set-up screen. Why not just 'turn it off' with your MAs marching into the AI's capital. >

My kind of game. I had a space race victory once, but had to sabotage the iroquois to do it, then nuked the hell out of them just for laughs.

	27-03-2003 03:24									#27
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I moded the AEGIS to carry cruise missles (can carry 4) and to have a bombard radius of 4, with a bombard rating of 10.