05-05-2000 22:37									#1
	New Faction - the matrix Suffering from ads?

i love the matrix! it is one of the greatest movies ever so i decided to make a matrix faction that is based on the computers ok they are a tad bit over powered but maybe you can help me balance them out

quote: [b]free punishment sphere at every base (what is the matrix? the matrix is control.) drone, 1 {every citizen is a drone} +2 support (it is simple, if you are not one of us then you are one of them. people do not know about the matrix and they will fight to protect it) -1 growth -1 morale -2 police immunity morale immunity mindcontrol tech cost 75% hurry cost 75% -4% interest (we don't know who struck first, but we do know that we scorched the sky. at the time solar energy was their main source of power) tech: self aware machines agenda: free market (we recreated your society at its height, and i do say your society, because when we started making the descions for you it became our society aversion: eudimonic (when we first created the matrix we tried to make it perfect. it was a disaster, entire crops were lost)

	06-05-2000 00:43									#2
	Support Apolyton

There's very little point to making everyone a drone, except if an evil probe team blows up your free Sphere. THAT's a killer strategy!

I LOVE the Matrix, and your faction is awesome! But, why the morale penalty? The citizens didn't know they were in the Matrix, so why would they be upset about it?

	06-05-2000 09:33									#3
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Jasonian

well a morale penalty with an immunity morale means that pretty much reguardless of your SE settings (except for fundy/power/thought control) that your troops would start out at green unless some type of morale enhancing facility was in their city...they are machines so unless a maching has a better design (morale building or high morale) it takes experiance to make them better...they are learning machines

that are my reasons, so what do you think?

korn469

	06-05-2000 09:49									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Well... they're not really machines. They are humans, hooked up to a computer that simulates the world around them. The humans could learn, even if the machine could not.

	06-05-2000 11:22									#5
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Actually, they are machines, the humans are just hooked up to a virtual world and life support system and they are used as batteries. Well here's my thoughts.

-3 Planet (Does not care about organice lifeforms.)
+3 Industry (Machines are very productive)
-1 Morale (Machines are incapable of agression)
+1 drone for every 3-4 citizens (Some people get "unplugged")
+1 Growth (We are no longer born, we are grown)
+1 Research (Vast Computer database)

Energy Grid, Free Recycling Tanks and Network Node at all bases.

Likes: Police State
Hates: Democratic

Starting tech: Information Networks, Industrial base, Applied Physics

Immune to Inefficiency

This may be way overpowered, but this is the way they would be in real life, and I like being brutally honest.


------------------
And I asked him,
What is thy name?
And he replied saying:
My Name is iMac: for we
are many..

	07-05-2000 03:33									#6
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Oh I get it now!

I thought that we were playing as the Agents and the citizens of the cities would be the humans (inside the Matrix)

But I guess we're playing as the main AI, controling machines and stuff. (outside the Matrix)

	07-05-2000 09:36									#7
	Remove this text

in my opinion the humans are the powersource of the machines and the cities are the production centers that produces new batteries (population), new production centers (cities), and new units, (sentinals for the outside world, agents for the inside the matrix)

the punishment spheres represent the matrix...and the humans power the machines as long as they are hooked up to the matrix...if you ever wake the people up from the matrix (destroy the punishment sphere) you only get the production from the base square (the fusion part of the human/fusion powersource) and what ever humans you can bribe+force to work for you (with either pysch spending or police units)

anyways i would say that hurry 75% is better than +3 industry

also in the matrix, which is apparently in the USA late 1990s (dem/FM/wealth) Neo says that he has rights, at least he thinks he has rights so this implies a democracy, he works at a software company, that and the other features that implies free market, and the people seem obsessed with money this implies wealth...but with a punishment sphere it doesn't matter if you have +10 police (can't get it) and ten military units in your base or -20 police, and ten military units outside of your territory you won't have any drones or talents...nobody knows they are in the matrix, nobody knows they are a battery that is why they will fight to defend the matrix because they don't know it exists

as for "free facilities" when i think of a free facility it is something that i think is a natural part of the faction, that it is not really a building but more of a virtue thta that factions posseses...if the faction would build the facility then it shouldn't be free...in my opinion the most likely free facilities would be punishment spheres representing the matrix, network nodes representing the global artificial intelligence or psi gates representing the agents ability to warp anywhere in the matrix

just my opinion

korn469

	07-05-2000 22:57									#8
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I agree with korn469 in that 75% hurry costs is better than +3 industry; the latter is just too powerful.

I would use:
+2 Growth (We are no longer born, we are grown)
+1 Research (Vast Computer Intelligence)
75% hurry costs (Machines are very able engineers)
-1 Probe (Matrix vulnerable to sabotage by Neo and his outside friends)
+1 drone for every 4 citizens (Some people get "unplugged")
-3 Planet (Does not care about organic lifeforms.)
Robust Efficiency

- Free faq each base: Hologram Theatre
- Free Punishment Sphere when apropriate tech is discovered
- Free Algorithmic Enhancement to all units with appropriate tech (NanoMin)
- Tech: Information Networks, Planetary Networks (gives them first crack at building the Virtual World)
- x2 Penalty for Democratic Politics (Matrix is not suited to having the humans in control)
- Focus: Build, Conquer, Explore
- Likes: Police State
- Not Allowed: Eudaimonic
- SE focus: Probe
This would read:
Politics, Police State, Planet (or Probe)
Politics, Democratic, nil

Putting Planet in place of 'nil' is a neat AI-enhancing tactic I use in my new module to have the AI make better SE choices. It will look to get Police State and avoid Democratic, but will also look for an SE choice that will enhance its Planet rating, since that is where it is most weak, most likely Green Economy. If you pick Probe instead, it may sometimes opt to switch to Fundamentalism, or wait until Thought Control with its +2 probe bonus.

I would have liked to have disallowed both Decmocratic and Eudaimonic, so instead I just put PENALTY, Democratic

Here are some calculated SE possibilities:
1:Police State, Green, Knowledge, Thought Control
2:Police State, Green
3:Police State, Planned, Power
4:Police State, Planned, Power, Cybernetic

Here are the results:

	1	2	3	4
ECONOMY	0	0	0	0
EFFICIENCY	+2	+1	-2	0
SUPPORT	-1	+2	+4	+4
MORALE	+2	0	+2	+2
POLICE	+4	+2	+2	-1
GROWT H	0	0	+4	+4
PLANET	-1	-1	-3	-1
PROBE	-1	-1	-1	-1
INDUSTRY	0	0	-1	-1
RESEARCH	+2	+1	+1	+3

Korn469 is also dead on, I think, in what The Matrix is with repect to the rest of the Planet -- we are the outsiders looking in. But even though the "Hologram Theatre" world they have is Democratic & Free Market, the real politics of the matrix as perceived by those who are unplugged is one of a Police State and Power. They have Hologram Theatre for free instead of Punishment Sphere, which is already a huge bonus, and more in keeping with the concept that they have created this vast virtual Reality (or virtual jail) for its citizenry. And the fact that the free faq they start out with matches the free tech they start out with, always a point of game balance with me with regards to faction design.

A good tactic, if you can prevent them from developing the HSA, is to probe them (with a -1 to their probe) and sabotage all their Hologram Theatres, which could potentially put all their bases in drone riot on account of the '+1 drone/3-4 citizens'. They would also be great at hurrying SPs, so that would be another thing to watch out for. The only major weakness is that this faction may not last the first 30 turns or so on a high fungus world because of their -3 Planet.
There is no mention of Morale, good or bad here, because all of its morale-like abilities are within its own citizenry (Police, Psych), and not with the outside world. Since Neo has acheived ascention, he and his merry band are a big thorn in the Matrix's side (higher drones as more people get unplugged).

They are, make no doubt about it, a very powerful faction, but their weakness is psi warefare. So exploit it. Build units with Empath ability and fungal payloads, build mind-worms and such, and they will be weak.
But watch out for when they get Nanominiaturization, for then all their units become probe-hardened, and the battle becomes very challenging.
[This message has been edited by AlexanderIII (edited May 07, 2000).]