03-04-2003 13:43									#1
	Hollywood hypersensitivity Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Chicago has finally made it to Turkey, and the first time I saw it (my kid and I are both big musical fans), I noticed they changed the ending to conform with post-9/11 sensitivities. Really. The film now end with Roxy and Velma cynically thanking the audience for "making this all possible." But the stage play is more cynical, nastier, and more specifically critical:

quote: Velma: Thank you. Roxie and I would just like to thank you - for you faith and your belief in our innocence. Roxie: Yes, it was letters, telegrams, and words of encouragement that helped see us through this terrible ordeal of ours. Velma: You know, a lot of people has lost faith in America. Roxie: And for what America stands for. Velma: But we are the living examples of what a wonderful country this is. Roxie: So we'd just like to say thank you and God Bless you.

Well, I love that ending, but maybe, just maybe, it was too much for a traumatized nation (albeit a nation in which, Velma- and Roxie-style, Monica Lewinsky is about to get her own tv show...but I digress). But now, just today, comes this story from the AP via the Canadian press:

quote: Warner doesn't want to get political Pulls original ads with star flashing peace sign Canadian Press Tuesday, April 01, 2003 LOS ANGELES (AP) -- What a Girl Wants is to avoid making a political statement. Print advertisements for the teen comedy originally featured a photograph of star Amanda Bynes wearing a tank top with an American flag on it and flashing the peace sign with her fingers as she stands between two British royal guards. But with the war in Iraq sparking anti-war protests in the United States and abroad, Warner Bros. quickly changed the ad. The studio said Monday it feared the peace sign would be viewed as a political message. New versions of the image feature Bynes with her right hand at her side, although many of the original posters already had been placed on billboards and buses before the change was made. In the film, Bynes plays an American girl who travels to London to find the father she never knew, who's a British politician. What a Girl Wants opens Friday.

http://www.canada.com/entertainment...2D-738B30AD2552

A peace sign? I mean, Holy Mary Mother of God, they censored a freaking peace sign? Can we please, please consign the myth of "liberal Hollywood" to the same dustbin that now holds the "liberal media"?

	03-04-2003 13:46									#2
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They didn't censor anything. They decided to switch the ad to one that would have the best effect for generating viewers- that is what ads are for.

Most actors are still very much left-wing, and popular culture is filled with very liberal social values.

	03-04-2003 13:52									#3
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Fine, it's a marketing decision, not censorship. Still, I love an industry that specializes in the graphic depiction of wholesale carnage worrying that a peace symbol might offend someone's sensibilities.

	03-04-2003 14:12									#4
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shi, except the popular culture you and people like dinodoc and drake subscribe to...

	03-04-2003 23:18									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly Fine, it's a marketing decision, not censorship. Still, I love an industry that specializes in the graphic depiction of wholesale carnage worrying that a peace symbol might offend someone's sensibilities.

The whole "consumer sensitivity" argument is crap. Recenttly Visa pulled its "Sheen and Sheen" add, which was actually one of the best add they had come out with recently, because Martin Sheen is anti-war. How many of the tens of millions, if not hunderads of millions of people who watched this add wrote to Visa to ask the add to be pulled? Anyone here hear about large movements to boycott Visa for using Sheen? No. A millin people would have to proest before 1% of the US TV viewing audience was involved..and yet, they pull the add....

By censoring stuff 'preactively', in the face of no, or insignificant outrage from marginal radical right wing whackos, is trully chilling. So basically, corporations now censor any anti-war activity or even symbol for fear that some imbicile might take offense, probably an imbecile who would not use thier product anyway. So what message are large corporations sending? Don't allow anyting that even comes close to showing support for the idea of Peace (we should ban Jesus fishes on fundies cars..Jesus said blessed are the peacemakers..that communist pig!) for fear of being labelled anti-American. I guess the immense and heartbnreaking irony of the notion of any political expression being "anti-American" is lost to them, or to much of the public.

	04-04-2003 00:08									#6
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quote: because Martin Sheen is anti-war.

Visa has denied this saying it had nothing to do with Martin Sheen being anti-war. But then again Visa always/never lies & Hollywood is never wrong/right.

	04-04-2003 00:21									#7
	Inflate your Upload Space

I wanted the ads pulled off because I'm anti-Sheen.

But as well all know the media almost always makes a huge deal out of the loudest protesters. Their opinions may not agree at all with mainstream America but because they're obnoxious we hear about them all the time. And of course since we hear about them all the time we begin to believe that this what the majority of people think so instead of thinking for ourselves we go with the group. This generally causes a lot of pain for companies that might offend some wacky loud minority.

	04-04-2003 00:27									#8
	Got spare money?

I saw plenty (too many) of those Sheen commercials & I don't even watch tv much. I don't know how long the same commercials last on average in other countries, but in the US most have a VERY short duration. Even real good ones... like the guy who taught his dog to say, "I wuv vu."

	04-04-2003 01:24									#9
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quote: Can we please, please consign the myth of "liberal Hollywood" to the same dustbin that now holds the "liberal media"?

Are you seriously disputing that Hollywood is liberal?

	04-04-2003 01:42									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Pyrodrew Visa has denied this saying it had nothing to do with Martin Sheen being anti-war. But then again Visa always/never lies & Hollywood is never wrong/right.

What the hell do you mean by "hollywood"? Hollywood is an industry, and just as conservative as any other industry. Given that those Sheen and sheen commercials were lauded and very notable, why would they pull them? Commercials are there to be memorable, so that you buy their product. Pulin memorable adds is like pulling out a good player froma team.

Of coruse there is a counter pressure. If Visa were toa dmit to have done it for political reasons, then it would get flack form the toehr side. Corporations are spooked by politics. Which means as more and more of our media becomes solely corporate, the politics you will get wil be more and more sanatized, made only for general, bland consumption. And that will be the end of the highly vibrant and important press we had in this country once.

	04-04-2003 01:53									#11
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Hollywood is an industry, and just as conservative as any other industry.

Are you thus saying other industries aren't conservative?

Have you even seen any movies lately? Like, perhaps, The Life of David Gale, Bulworth, etc. Have you ever seen a movie where a Republican President is a protagonist? The producers are liberal, the directors are liberal, and, by far, the actors are liberal.

	04-04-2003 01:55									#12
	Got spare money?

And yet movies like Bullworth and Gale are relatively rare. I agee many producers and many actos a liberal, but the industry as a whole is not, anymore than the radio industry can be called inherently conservative, even if some very large corporate players in it are inherently conservative.

	04-04-2003 01:58									#13
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I dunno... I'd call the talk radio industry inherantly conservative, actually .

I'm not a wacko righty that will call every media source a leftist bastion, I recognize conservative bastions of the media as well .

	04-04-2003 02:08									#14
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My problem is not a politicized media: we have always had such a thing. Read old newspapers from the 19th century. they were unabashedly political, openly allying themselves to one political faction or another. Now we have a media increasingly being driven towards mediocrity and avoiding anyting "controversial" in order "not to offend consumers". well, damn consumers. We are citizens first, consumers second.

A media that avoids "politics" is a mdeia that looses the ability to keep in check the people in power, and that is a dangerous thing.

	04-04-2003 02:18									#15
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Now we have a media increasingly being driven towards mediocrity and avoiding anyting "controversial" in order "not to offend consumers".

Well yah . They want to make money. They are private companies. The only way to prevent it is to have state run news (like the BBC).

If you want controversy, you have the internet.

quote: A media that avoids "politics" is a mdeia that looses the ability to keep in check the people in power, and that is a dangerous thing.

I dunno, they seem to love scandels.

	04-04-2003 02:24									#16
	Increase Your PM Length

Scandals only happen when some pol. is bad at covering up. What about successful ones?

As for the bit about makign money: Do people really flee inherently political news? If so, our dmeocracy is doomed long term. Democracy only works as lonmg as people remain Citizens and not just masses eyarning fro bread and circuses.

	04-04-2003 02:26									#17
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quote: Scandals only happen when some pol. is bad at covering up. What about successful ones?

Well obviously you don't hear about successful cover-ups, or else they wouldn't be cover-ups .

quote: As for the bit about makign money: Do people really flee inherently political news? If so, our dmeocracy is doomed long term. Democracy only works as lonmg as people remain Citizens and not just masses eyarning fro bread and circuses.

It's sad isn't it?

The apathy is striking.

I guess that is why liberals and conservatives both agree that at least Bush is good because he got people to actually take a side .

	04-04-2003 02:50									#18
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quote: What the hell do you mean by "hollywood"?

Relax.

quote: Hollywood is an industry, and just as conservative as any other industry. Given that those Sheen and sheen commercials were lauded and very notable, why would they pull them? Commercials are there to be memorable, so that you buy their product. Pulin memorable adds is like pulling out a good player froma team.

When I say Hollywood, I mean Hollywood. Anything you thing you want to assume beyond that is irrelevant. Once you find the smoking gun to prove your theory great, until then we believe in innocent until proven guilty here & your accusation remains only an accusation.

quote: Of coruse there is a counter pressure. If Visa were toa dmit to have done it ... we had in this country once.

And you KNOW Visa did it for political reasons by the same logic others KNOW Saddam has WMD/nukes/whatever? And if you don't know thanks for your speculations.