08-04-2003 09:00									#1
	Scenario: Iraq War 2003 (PTW) Got spare money?

This is my first scenario, so I hope that everything works okay. This is a fun and challenging scenario that usually takes as little as an hour to complete.

Description: A Coalition of the US, Britain, Australia and other forces invaded Iraq in an effort to depose Saddam Hussein from power. To suceed you must capture as many victory locations as possible. It would also be advisable to capture Saddam Hussein and his Generals and return them to a Coalition city or base until the end of the conflict. There is a time limit of 6 weeks (game has been shortened from the original time limit of 13 weeks to better serve reality), which is the appoximate length of time before the US/British taxpayers have significant war weariness. Try not to lose too many coalition units and do not decimate too many cities!

Download Version 1.4: http://apolyton.net/upload/files/ma...-2003-ver14.zip -- 12 Apr 03

Some mods in effect:

* Aegis Cruisers have bombard capabilites that simulate cruise missile capabilities
* Airborne Units, Special Forces, Fedayeen Saddam, Al Samoud Missiles, Terrorists and Predator Drones
* Capture the airfields
* Help the Peshmerga Army (Kurds) kick the Iraqis out of their homeland.
* Send special forces to locate and deal with a suspected Ansar al Islam terrorist camp.
* Capture Saddam, Udey (and more) and bring them back...
* Units are named to reflect the actual units that are in theatre.

Credit(s): To the Saddam Hussein scenario by Yoda Power. Also to the cnn.com web site for all the unit names.

Changes:

Version 1.1: (9 Apr 03)
- Fixed bugs in the ISRAELI and JORDANIAN civs that caused the program to crash.
- Added IRAQ air units.
- Added more Kurd units
- Fixed Victory Point locations
- Added some additional Al Samoud Missiles

Version 1.2: (10 Apr 03)
- Adjusted AI settings for IRAQ and COALITION units.
- Added Artillery units.
- Increased IRAQ Regular Armor (PANZER) strength
- Added (+) symbols to the names of all AEGIS units to indicate CRUISE MISSILE bombardment capability.
- Increased the strength of Al Samoud Missiles.

Version 1.3: (11 Apr 03)
- Removed the ability to upgrade some units.

Version 1.4: (12 Apr 03)
- Added food resources for coalition cities.
- Shortened game length to 6 weeks. (Instead of 13 weeks)

Last edited by maxpower144 on 12-04-2003 at 22:00

	09-04-2003 05:09									#2
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Good work! It's a very detailed scenario, you had some very good sources.

Are you going to update this as the situation changes, or leave it as the situation was in march?

Some constructive critics:

- You need airforce for Iraq, fix the air fields (e.g. H2, H3).
- UK forces should belong to UK civ, remember the rules of engagement are slightly different
- Australian SAS is missing
- Special forces unit is way too strong
- Aircraft ranges are too small, use http://www.fas.org/man
- All units should have much more moves, maybe double or triple them
- Al Samoud aren't equipped with nuclear warheads in real life. You should make them similar to cruise missiles, except with lower range.
- Iraqis don't have Marines or Modern Armor
- Boundaries aren't correct, Jordan is too small, Israel too large
- You can make Kuwait a separate civ, same as Qatar and UAE

	09-04-2003 06:20									#3
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I've played this scenario.
(moded it to play Iraquies)

And I was destoyed at the end of 13th turn.

Coalition forces were weared out around turn of 10, when then took all but my last city, but after then Colaution made some alliances with Turks and several other counties and later I lost with their combined force (Turks took the city).

It would probably be boring to me to play on US side (too many units to move).


Now some commments:
What's scoring system.
Egypt had most victory locations at the end for example.
Should they only be in Iraq?

Iraq has no air-force.

Al Samud missiles are ridiculus.
They do use Nuke animation, but they are nothing more then one-use catapult (bomb. str 5, ROF just 1).
I bombed with all of them one US modern armor and it have't took even one HP damage.

Range of aircraft is OK, since US succeeded in boming almost everything on map.


While I like the way you made US superior by making Mod. Armor vs Tank, and Mech. Inf. vs Guerrila comparation, but I think that those defensive values of Iraq units should be slightly better. They should be able to hold ground in cities for some time without need of Mech. Inf. unit.

Defense of 12 would be OK.

Also, those Panzer Tanks are a little bit useless.
(Mech. Inf. is way to better for attack).

Somthing that it's not done well in civ:
if unit is not Mechanized, it DOES NOT mean that it has poor defense. So I would assume that Guerrila should have more standard defense of 10, better equiped Rep. Guard (represented by marine pic) would be 12. In that case make Rilflemen looking unit with defense of 8.

Also Rep. Guard shoudl be ELITE!

And lower Mech. Inf. attack to 18 (20 is way too much).

And make "Panzer" tanks more like 20/14 (still inferior to Modern Armor, will have has better attack then Mech. Inf and better defense then ordinary infantry).


To sum up:
Rifle: 8/8/1
Guerrila: 10/10/1
Rep. Guard: 12/12/1
Tank: just remove it from the game
"Panzer": 20/14/3 (it's still pretty inferior unit, but now Mech. Inf won't replace it)
Mech. Inf: 18/18/3
Mod Armor:24/16/4 (as it is)
(if Panzer seems to strong, then make it 18/14/3, but then make Mech. Inf with attack of just 16, since Mech. Inf should not make Tanks obsolete)

US Inf: up to 12/12, sp. forces are ok with 14/14



P.S.
And scenario lacks of Artillery.
Iraq should have artillery.


P.P.S.
Also to make Iraq more defenseive, add defense flag to Marine units (in rules), and then make all Rep. Guard unit defnesive (in units properites on the map), while keeping Coalition Infantry units with Offense flag.

	09-04-2003 06:35									#4
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Are you sure that spec ops should have 14/14? AFAIK spec ops aren't destined for frontline battles or defence, they wouldn't stand a chance against regular infantry (because of much larger numbers and heavy equipment for the latter). Instead, they should have special roles, like high movement rate, "invisible", etc.

	09-04-2003 06:42									#5
	Full PM-box? Change here!

By the way, I don't have idea what Stealth falg would do to Spec. Ops.

Isn't that flag used for Subs?

	09-04-2003 08:45									#6
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Re: spec ops. Invisible, not stealth. That way enemy won't see your units. Spec ops should have "Detect Invisible" ability, guess why...

Create a special unit "Terrorist" - also with Invisible ability, using "worker" icon.

I played this scenario as Iraq and... lost!

I lost 3 southern cities, including Basra. I held all other cities even if Israel, Jordan and Turkey were also at war with me (hmmm....). I had alliance with Syria and Iran against Coalition.

Score: Turkey - 1st, Egypt - 2nd, Iran 3rd, Iraq 4th... Humiliating time limit defeat, as the game said. "Saddam Hussein the Foolish" even if I destroyed ALL Coalition forces as they were advancing on Najaf and Kut LOL

There's no point playing this as Iraq without invading Syria or Turkey, otherwise Turkey or Egypt will always win.

Al Samoud are useless, Al Hussein don't exist, there's no artillery. BTW, Jordan built "Republican Guard Barracks" (or Palace, can't remember).

Resources are extremely limited, Iraq has more than one major oil field

But don't get me wrong, it was seriously fun to play this, especially after week 13 when I conquered Turkey, Jordan, etc

Need any screenshots or help with the units?

I guess if you already have Jessica Lynch Leader unit, then the scenario starts in late March. You can update the troop positions from this source:

http://globalsecurity.org/military/ops/iraq_orbat.htm
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/ir...ullpage.troops/

Last edited by maciek on 09-04-2003 at 12:13

	09-04-2003 13:10									#7
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Possibly a bug? Whenever I want to talk with Israelis, the game just crashes (no error messages even)...

Check if you have proper Israeli civ entry in game rules.

	09-04-2003 18:10									#8
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Hey you made this scenario from a basic made by me, postet at cfc. You could atleast ask me to use it.

here is a link to the thread i postet it in-http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=32940

and here is an update i made later for PTW-http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=48378

Last edited by Yoda Power on 09-04-2003 at 18:20

	09-04-2003 20:49									#9
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Credit should go to the Saddam Hussein Scenario for the start it gave me with the map. (Thanks to Yoda Power for pointing this out)

While we are listing credits:

Credit for the the unit names and descriptions are from the CNN web site.

You guys have pointed out some bugs andf fixes and I am working on these right now.

Some points:

- The Aussie special forces are in Kuwait City
- The Al Samoud Missiles are designed to be ominous looking but very ineffective.
- The Special forces are 10-10. The Airborne has the 14 attack strength.
- I am not sure if Britain and Kuwait having their own CIVS will fit in the type of scenario planned. (Doesn't COALITION cover all?)
- The Victory Points locations are screwed up and I will fix them.

	10-04-2003 04:31									#10
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Maybe for next version you could remove Rubber from needed resouces for units, since today synthetic rubber is used.

And would also help Iraqes to build infantry after all thier resouces are destoyed.

	10-04-2003 04:38									#11
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Republic Guard is still "regular" not ELITE!!!

They are supposed to be best traied troops (ELITE).

You should really add ROF of 3 to Al Samud Missiles.

They would still be pretty useless.
But would be able to take out maybe 1hp from Tank.

The way they are now 10 of them together can't take 1hp from tank (I've tired).

	10-04-2003 04:51									#12
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Found a BUG!

It only appears if you modify game to play Iraq.

Airborne and Special Forces have no AI strategy flag, so they stay on strating positions without attacking (if you don't play US).

In order to fix this, if playing Iraq, you need to add Offense AI flag to these 2 units.

	10-04-2003 04:54									#13
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For those interested:

-fixed Airborne and Special Forces AI flag
-starts as Iraq

Attachment: iraq-war-2003-ver11_modified.zip
This has been downloaded 9 time(s).

	10-04-2003 05:15									#14
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IMHO-- Republican Guard might suppose to be ELITE but if you compare them to the COALITION forces they are not. Thye might have been ELITE at one time but in 2003 they are not. So to keep it realistic I have downgraded the REP. GUARD units.

The lack of resources means that IRAQ can't build much. This is what is planned because this is a "come as you are" type of conflict. There isn't to be much built in 13 weeks.

That is how I designed it.

Last edited by maxpower144 on 10-04-2003 at 05:35

	10-04-2003 13:30									#15
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I don't know.
Republic Gaurd is supposed to be best trained and equped part of Iraq military.
Now, it looks that irregulars such as Feddayin or Kurdish units have better experience?!?
Not to say that there is no difference between normal Iraq infantry and Rep. Guard?!?
And isn't superiority of US described by stats of their units (like 14/14/2).
At least, seems more like Veteran status then Regular.

.

Some other thigns:

You can upgrade Popular Army to Mech. Infatry for 60gp.
Is that intended?
I don't thing so.

"Panzer" is useless.
Even if it's intended, they should have a little bit better stats (Like 18/12/3, although still weaker then armored cars). No army in the world uses WWII Tanks.

Add some Artillery units for Iraque!
They should have plenty of them.

Some things to increse AI of units:
Add offense flag to Airborne and Special Forces, in unit rules screen.
(to make scenario playable by Iraques, without crippling US)

Add defense flag to Marine units in unit rules screen.
Then manualy, in units properties, on maps screen, change AI strategy for all Iraque Marine units to defensive, while keeping "offense" strategy for Coalition and other countries.
That way Iraq will be more on defense.

You can get great effects by changing manually AI startegy for some units like Mech. Inf, or Infantry.
(for example when playing Iraques, Kuwait Defense force goes on invasion, instead of staying at home, becasue it's AI strategy is set to random)



P.S.
Are there any "home-rules" for this scenario which you need to follow in order to play it correctly.
(like never pay Syria or Iran to go on war against Iraq, because it's unrealistic)

Some docs would be nice too (just to explain some unit stats and other things).

	10-04-2003 16:35									#16
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I agree, rep. guard weren't anywhere near being elite, they simply had "better" equipment. Now they're history. AFAIK the only troops in the region that are elite are coalition troops. Just compare the number of casualties on both sides...

Last edited by maciek on 10-04-2003 at 16:43

	10-04-2003 19:03									#17
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Player 1 - you make some good points and I will fix some of this up. One point to note is that the scenario was not originally designed to be played as the IRAQIs.

	10-04-2003 19:24									#18
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As for Republican Guard - they may have been elite at one time or even just considered to be elite, but in reality they are not acting elite. (Probably more like Regular) One point of contention is that they use the MODERN ARMOR unit. (Should be a T72 tank) Do you think they would be better represented by something else?

As for the PANZERS, this unit represents the ARMOR of the Regular IRAQI Army which use T55 tanks. (I like the a sounds and the animation of the PANZERS)

	11-04-2003 00:02									#19
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Thanks for all the feedback and help. I have updated and placed version 1.2 on the first post in the thread.

	11-04-2003 01:58									#20
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I've played US with new 1.1 version.

Now, I won in 3rd week!

First turn I conquered all cities south of Bagdad.
(haven't touched Al Samuds since they are too weak to be threat)
And several Tanks got near Mosul at the north (thanks to ROP with Turks).
My airforce was used to weaken Iraqui armored divisions to 1hp (and destroy them with Tanks in same turn).
I also deplyed some Infantry to north by using Helicopters and new conquerder Kurdish airport.

I also noticed that operational range for Helicopers and Paratroopers is way to low (6 or 8), compared to other air units (that's why I used rebasing of Helicopters to north of the country).

Second turn I conquered all exempt Bagdad.
Al Samuds took total of 3 HPs from my units (2hp from Paratrooper and 1hp from Marine units)

Airfoce was used to make precision bombing of Bagdad, to destroy defense and lower population to 12 (in order to lower defense bonus).

3rd turn I counquered Bagdad.



P.S.
I'll try v1.2 maybe later.

	11-04-2003 02:21									#21
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I think helicopters have quite accurate range in this scenario. You can'r expect a U/T helicopter to fly more than 150-200km. I think that rebasing helicopters is "cheating"

	11-04-2003 17:45									#22
	Increase the size of your Attachments

What about 4 tiles airdop for paratrooper?
(Sp. Forces have 20 tiles airdrop)

	11-04-2003 17:52									#23
	Inflate your Upload Space

By the way in v1.2 you can still upgarde Riflemen with "upgarde all" Shift-U command (but luckly, not in 1st turn due too much money needed).

I have't tested, but I think it's maybe also possibile from units pull-down menu in city screen too.


P.S.
Remvoing Warrior, Longbowmen and similar units from buildable options for all civs could be good from "flavor perspective" too.

	11-04-2003 18:55									#24
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I fixed the upgrade ability. I also removed many units from the buildable list.

Paratroopers are limited by their range. In this scenario the COALITION uses "Airborne" which have a 20 square tile range. This is similiar for SPECIAL FORCES. This is to simulate the COALITION's ability to drop their forces nearly anywhere on the map, and in reality this is unique to the COALITION.

	11-04-2003 19:48									#25
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It could be handy to add Harbor to Doha (or at least some irrigration).

Just so it won't starve.

	12-04-2003 18:07									#26
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quote: Originally posted by player1 I've played US with new 1.1 version. Now, I won in 3rd week! First turn I conquered all cities south of Bagdad. (haven't touched Al Samuds since they are too weak to be threat) And several Tanks got near Mosul at the north (thanks to ROP with Turks). My airforce was used to weaken Iraqui armored divisions to 1hp (and destroy them with Tanks in same turn). I also deplyed some Infantry to north by using Helicopters and new conquerder Kurdish airport. I also noticed that operational range for Helicopers and Paratroopers is way to low (6 or 8), compared to other air units (that's why I used rebasing of Helicopters to north of the country). Second turn I conquered all exempt Bagdad. Al Samuds took total of 3 HPs from my units (2hp from Paratrooper and 1hp from Marine units) Airfoce was used to make precision bombing of Bagdad, to destroy defense and lower population to 12 (in order to lower defense bonus). 3rd turn I counquered Bagdad. P.S. I'll try v1.2 maybe later.

Excellent. Gotta love those super-accurate scenarios.

	12-04-2003 22:05									#27
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yes, Player 1's game played out almost exactly to the script.

I have posted ver 1.4 which incorporates some suggested food resources for Doha, Qatar.

I have also shortened the game to six weeks. This makes it more challenging and I think better reflects the time period when the significant war weariness would have occured. The original 13 weeks was based on a poll that said that most people could stomach a 3 month war. Now I am not so sure that this would not have been shortened with such an unpopular (in the world stage) and ugly war. Also, a 6 week scenario seems to be more challenging and fun to play.

	13-04-2003 02:23									#28
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There is one thing I just now realised in this scenario.

It's missing some new buildings added in PtW like Stock Exchange and especialy CIVIL DEFENSE.

If they could be added back, then several tougher cities, like Bagdad (must have!) and Basra could have them to reflect something tougher resistance.

Last edited by player1 on 15-04-2003 at 00:39

	14-04-2003 22:01									#29
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Sounds good! I will download it tonight!

	10-05-2003 05:27									#30
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First turn, contacted Iraq, got a world map, all their gold, and workers... for ecology. Same thing with every other civ. So I ended up filthy rich, with a myriad of workers that I'd never use. lol

Might I suggest... instead of making Baghdad fortified with mech inf... what about giving Iraq, less sophisiticated weapons, and just gave them tons and tons of crappy ones. It would give someone (who wants to play as Iraq) more flexibility, and make it more realistic as a whole. Allied troops wouldn't be stopped by overwhelming Iraqi defense (like Baghdad can be in this scenario), but they'd be slowed, from just having to defeat so many enemies.