16-04-2003 15:36									#1
	The classic "to buy or not to buy" question Get a bigger avatar today!

Read the thread title. I.e. is RoN worth to buy it, if you like RTS and TBS games, play all Civ titles, RT and HoMM3? I've tried to follow the progress of RoN and seen quite much from it, but I'm not yet convinced, so some feedback would be welcome.

Thanks!

	16-04-2003 21:11									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I'll buy it anyway, so...

	16-04-2003 21:16									#3
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Demo should be out soon (around the release i reckon), judge from that.

	16-04-2003 23:09									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Alex,

never heard of "try before you buy"?

	17-04-2003 02:08									#5
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

So far I'm leaning toward not buy but the Demo will be a huge help if it impresses me enough.

	17-04-2003 02:58									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Rasbelin never heard of "try before you buy"?

It's not nice to download games off of p2p networks, Rasbey.

	17-04-2003 03:40									#7
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Bad me.



Nah, seriously I'm not going to get an illgeal copy for testing. The demo already sounds good enough for that.

	17-04-2003 05:19									#8
	Re: The classic "to buy or not to buy" question Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Rasbelin Read the thread title. I.e. is RoN worth to buy it, if you like RTS and TBS games, play all Civ titles, RT and HoMM3?

If you like all those...man its a no brainer...this game is it.

	18-04-2003 06:01									#9
	Put an end to popups!

Ras,

I know he gave you very little information but why ask whether to buy or not and then say why not wait to try it before buying? Isn't that the point of this thread to figure out if you can buy it without trying a demo?

	18-04-2003 13:49									#10
	Put an end to popups!

Tniem,

yes, indeed, I'm trying to figure out if it's a good buy. However I just added that the demo will be good enough for a trial, while other comments can help the decision making.

Tass,

	30-04-2003 00:13									#11
	Inflate your Upload Space

Unfortunately today's pcgame market forces the consumer to approach buying new games differently than in the past.

Nowadays it seems that games are released buggy and/or full of CTD's and other gameplay problems. Looking at the market from the publishers' point of view they need to rush games out to make money. If this means an unfinished product, then so be it! Damn the consumer, he is to be used to beta test the game. If there is enough interest then we'll think about patching it. (MOO3, Civ3, etc. etc.)

Consumers are forced to wait for demos, reviews both professional and from forums, borrowing the game from a friend, or other means before buying because it's not fair to just blindly spend your money on trash with no hope of cash refund. Therefor research is key before buying. Hold off for a week or two before buying.

I recently purchased GalCiv after waiting 2 weeks after it was in stores. I'm glad I did because even though GalCiv turned out to be a great game right out of the box it was usefull to read other player's comments. In all the forums I browsed I found many more positive statements about GalCiv than negative ones. I will definately do the same for RON. I want to buy it the day it comes out but I will control my urge and wait for what the word on the street is.

Money and time is too valuable to waste on garbage, buyer beware.

	01-05-2003 20:17									#12
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www.gamerankings.com

Use that site to the fullest! It collects all the (p)reviews of a game into one list for your browsing pleasure, and even avrages out the ratings that each review gives.

	07-05-2003 01:21									#13
	Support Apolyton

I know I am buying it.

	07-05-2003 09:14									#14
	Support Apolyton

My local gamespot has 7 days return policy. It is very convenient, and I actually end up buying more games. True, returning some, but overall I think gamespot makes more money on me with this policy than without it.

To answer the original question, I would buy this particular game on the day of release anyhow, with or without return policy.

	08-05-2003 00:43									#15
	Inflate your Upload Space

Buy it. If you're not completely impressed, I'll buy the copy from you.

	08-05-2003 05:43									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

The game looks promising, and has many great features. The fact that Brian Reynolds, et al are designing the game is a big plus.

However, I note the game does not support Voodoo video cards, so it looks like it will be a longggg time before I wind up buying this game.

Even so, caveat emptor: buyer beware - read reviews and the game forums. . .

	08-05-2003 07:41									#17
	Get a bigger avatar today!

And reviews are getting less reliable by the minute
Good thing 'Poly is here

	08-05-2003 15:16									#18
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quote: However, I note the game does not support Voodoo video cards, so it looks like it will be a longggg time before I wind up buying this game.

Go get a new video card, the game's WELL worth it.

Alva has a point... (p)reviews aren't quite... what we want. Hey, some guy reviewed Civ 3 and gave it a poor rating, it didn't appeal to him, because it's not exactly "fast paced". What are you looking for in a TBS game? Fast pace?

Likewise, I wouldn't really make a good reviewer of something like Unreal Tournament 2003. My review would praise the graphics, but I'd say the game doesn't have nearly enough thinking, is way too dominant on those who move fast, etc. Why? Because I'm a strategy player.

This is why Apolyton is so great, most of us have similar gaming tastes (assuming we all are here because of Civ), so...

	08-05-2003 15:38									#19
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Solver Hey, some guy reviewed Civ 3 and gave it a poor rating

So? Sounds like a pretty good review to me


But yeah, game reviews from magazines and websites are crap. I remember one review for CtP2 where the reviewer praised the game for it's great AI but complained about the lack of moddability

I'm very grateful to BHG for releasing a demo for RoN -- not many companies do that anymore these days

	08-05-2003 16:54									#20
	Support Apolyton

After reading Solvers' review on beta RoN and other comments by players of the beta on the various fansites I feel pretty good about buying RoN. I probably won't buy the game the day it comes out only because I want to read about any bugs with the game first.

Yin:

Your statement alone carries great weight. I have read your comments on GalCiv and other games and trust what you say about them. You seem to be a fair and knowledgeable critic who know's his games. I have a feeling that you won't need to be buying anyones' copy of RoN as long as it's not plagued with any bugs or AI issues.

	08-05-2003 17:36									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Haupt. Dietrich:

Hey, thanks for the comments! I think I could only afford to buy back one copy of RON, so as long as Rasbelin is satisfied, I'm out of the woods! LOL

I do think it will be an outstanding game, though ...

	08-05-2003 20:28									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Solver Go get a new video card, the game's WELL worth it.

Nada - it won't happen. . .

I'm just not one of those people who jump on the upgrade treadmill to chase after every new game that hits the market.

Heck, some TBS games are now hitting the market that require a 32MB graphics card

Talk about an incestuous relationship between game makers and video card companies. . .

They keep racheting up the game requirements without adding much in the way of game substance. . .

	08-05-2003 23:01									#23
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Thanks Haupt. Dietrich, I'm glad I have helped in convincing you.

	09-05-2003 01:07									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Leonidas Heck, some TBS games are now hitting the market that require a 32MB graphics card Talk about an incestuous relationship between game makers and video card companies. . .

Supply and demand: gamers demand more eye-candy, the industry supplies it.

And its not always eye-candy either! Sometimes, hardware limits are pushed by the gameplay too, wether it be by improved A.I.s or farther reaching graphics to immerse players in deeper worlds.

	09-05-2003 02:45									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Anun Ik Oba Supply and demand: gamers demand more eye-candy, the industry supplies it. And its not always eye-candy either! Sometimes, hardware limits are pushed by the gameplay too, wether it be by improved A.I.s or farther reaching graphics to immerse players in deeper worlds.

This may or may not be the case.

If more/better graphics came out of new TBS games requiring the very hyped-up graphic requirements, then that would be fine.

But the problem is, newer/better graphics are not always the result.

It's an old Microsoft ploy: continually put out new software, rending the older software obsolete. Example: XP will not play DOS games. . .

The new software then requires the consumer (note - this is the operative word), to buy the new product and dispense with the older software/games.

Check out Matrix Games. Most of their NEW wargames, even the TBS ones, will require a 32MB graphics card. Remember, we're talking about TBS wargames: no flash; no tinsel; no moving units. Not even FPS with high system demands, requires this much muscle.

We're being sucker-punched. . .

Right now there are video cards that carry 128MB of RAM. With some really sloppy programming, I am sure there are game makers out there who can rachet-up a game's requirements that will force gamers to buy this card in the very near future. . .

Case in point: The game "Empires in Arms" by Matrix. It looks like a great Napoleonic game. But they are recommending a 32MB video card and 128MB of RAM to play it!

Check out the screenshots and see if you think this game needs such high requirements:

http://www.matrixgames.com/Games/na...screenshots.asp

	09-05-2003 03:26									#26
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I had those kind of graphics on my C64

	09-05-2003 05:51									#27
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Leonidas:

I believe your assesment on us (the consumer) being sucker punched is spot on

Another industry ingeniously concocting ways to extract money from the consumer. The gaming industry is not the only industry that practices these kinds of tactics. Unfortunately for every 1 of us smart consumers there are 100 idiots out there willing to plop down their money on anything and everything.

Until the general public is educated enough, and can practice shopping restraint, we are doomed to be sucker punched again and again.

	09-05-2003 10:14									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

128 mb ram?

32 mb video card?

Give me a break. You can get the combined for less than 200 dollars US, and can probably do a lot better, especially on the ram front. Instead of spending time on Poly, get a part time job, you'll have that 200 in less than a month.

Sheesh

compared to what is available, these standards are still pretty minimal.

	09-05-2003 19:06									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I don't that's the point Sleepy, if they ask for 32MB, the graphics should be worth it.
-
Besides it has become normal one has to upgrade his PC every two years and that just isn't right.
I recently upgraded my processor to a 2G XP even that one is no longer top

	09-05-2003 19:49									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by alva I don't that's the point Sleepy, if they ask for 32MB, the graphics should be worth it. - Besides it has become normal one has to upgrade his PC every two years and that just isn't right. I recently upgraded my processor to a 2G XP even that one is no longer top

I admit I was a bit, ahem, out of it when I posted that. I agree that 32MB should show results, and it does seem that these days those results are less and less visible.