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Vesayen
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Published by national geographic, my thoughts?
I feel betrayed by the public school system for the lies in their textbooks......
Edit, to add what got cut off:
I know a tremendous amount of history, always been very interested in it and I could always sort between the bullhonkey my schooling has tried to teach me and the truth......HOWEVER I didnt know anything about the founding of Islam-other then what my schooling had taught me, and knowing how bias that is I decided to go look it up on my own.
SO I figured I should go read up on it......who is more neutral then national geographic right? Read their book and..........man, I want to burn my old textbooks lol.
I didnt know the religion of peace had a kick off near constant wafare since its inception......my school books somehow left that out.........im sure it was an honest mistake, right?
Last edited by Vesayen on 17-04-2003 at 03:20
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Bereta_Eder
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Christianity is also drenched in blood. How is it different than Islam in this regard?
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Bereta_Eder
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Is that supposed to put a veil on the bloody history of Christianity?
All I'm asking is how blooddrenched Islam history is different than blooddrenched Christianity history?
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Bereta_Eder
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Well AFAIK Christianity had a pretty bloody history too. That's all and I don't claim to be an expert in this regard.
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Spiffor
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CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:27
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Exactly, like Christianty, Islam calls for mass conversion, becuase it believes the salvation can only come from the belief in Allah and his prphet Mohammed.
At least, it is the justification of holy wars, which were used as a tool for the expansion of the Arabic people. Islam became quickly the backbone of the thriving Arab civilization, who had expanded its territory drastically thanks to Mohammed's cunning, and the sense of obedience it gave to its followers.
I think Islam, like christianty, is an "imperial" religion, i.e a religion that has been actively used by a large or growing empire as a tool for political and cultural dominance.
Islam is no more bound to violence than christianty. The agressive expansion of the countries that called themselves Muslim was violent. It is a very different story.
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Bereta_Eder
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Fine. I admit it was a poorly aimed attempt at "living up" the conversation. Pathetically failed.
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Bereta_Eder
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It will propably take some time. 1.000 years of evolution give or take if (christianity) is any indication.
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Ned
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of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Vesayen
Published by national geographic, my thoughts?
I didnt know the religion of peace had a kick off near constant wafare since its inception......my school books somehow left that out.........im sure it was an honest mistake, right? |
I am SHOCKED, utterly SHOCKED that you would learn a PC view of history from school!
As I have said here before, I was similarly shocked to find my daughter one day telling me that Kennedy was the best president ever and that Nixon was the worst - because he STARTED the Vietnam War.
Now turning to private schools, I learned a very "filtered" view of history because I went to catholic schools 'til college. Imagine how I felt when I read Gibbon's "Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire."
Yes Mohammed was constantly at war. So were his followers for more than a 100 years. They conquered to spread his faith and to acquire the right to the 20% every conquered person had to tithe, not to mention the women.
I have asked this here before, but have never received an answer: When did Islam become peaceful?
I don't believe it ever did. It was merely defeated by stronger powerers, mostly from Europe. The followers of its faith used forced conversions, ethnic cleansing and genocide well into modern times.
Do you think the Islamic goal re Israel has anything really to do with providing equal rights to the Pals. No. From history we know what the real objective all along was: genocide with subjugation of any survivors. Quotations to this effect by Islamic leaders are pandemic.
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Spiffor
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CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:27
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Ned :
In Islam, there are three kind of Jihads (holy wars) :
The most important is clearly the intenral Jihad, i.e the struggle of one individual against his own temptations and evil.
The second, definitely less important is the major external Jihad : it means actively looking for other Muslims to follow the "good virtues"
the thirs and least important is the minor external Jihad, i.e the effort to convert the infidels, even if it means war.
The third and least important Jihad is the only Jihad we westerners are interested in.
IIRC, the Arabic expansion in Europe was stopped at Poitiers in 732. The Arabs, and their religion as well, became mostly peaceful and enlightened once their territory was settled, despite having to fight against the invading crusaders, and despite much internal struggle between the various Arabic factions.
This growing lack of military prowess and cohesion eventually led the Arabs to be subjugated by the Ottomans.
The Arabs aren't more bend to hatred or love than any other folk on this planet : when the good catholic Isabella expelled all the Jews from Spain, most of them took refuge in Arabic countries, notably Morocco. Jews were accepted in these countries and had thriving communities, far away from the European intolerance.
During WW2, the King of Morocco, depite eing under the French (hence Vichy) protectorate, harbored many Jews far away from the nazi menace.
If I might tell, the western culture you love so much was in constant warfare even during the enlightenment, and the only century of relative peace the West ever knew was the 19th century. The now peaceful Japanese people were in semi-constant warfare during their whole medieval period, until 1600 when Tokugawa unified Japan (there were some short periods of unifications behind one Shogun before), and Japanese Samurais tried to invade their neighbours as soon as their civil war was over. I don't know about China's history, or precolombian history, but it makes littke doubt these countries were riled by war in the past. My point is : all cultures in the past were more or less warlike, and it is absurd to think it means they'll be warlike for all eternity.
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Vesayen
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quote:
Originally posted by Ned
I have asked this here before, but have never received an answer: When did Islam become peaceful?
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Thank you for asking the question I was afraid to ask....I dont have a suit capable of surviving temperatures of 4,000 degrees centegrade heh.
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gsmoove23
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Dude what schoolbooks are you reading, where do you live? My schoolbooks made it seem like all Islam was was a warlike empire that gave the good christians heart palpatations and that was public school.
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Bereta_Eder
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It is a bit ironic that people talk about Islam being "aggresive" when the latest wars are all being conducted by a christian country.
Just saying.
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Vesayen
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quote:
Originally posted by gsmoove23
Dude what schoolbooks are you reading, where do you live? My schoolbooks made it seem like all Islam was was a warlike empire that gave the good christians heart palpatations and that was public school. |
It told about how a "peacefull" theological idea came about, briefly talked about how it spread(never mentioning warfare then the chapter ended........
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17-04-2003 03:10
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