24-04-2003 09:46									#1
	Newt Gingrich Says Colin Powell is a Dork Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Well he didn't actually say that of course, but:

quote: Former House Speaker Newt Gingrich accused the State Department of undermining President Bush's foreign policy and denounced Secretary of State Colin Powell's plan to go to Syria as ludicrous.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003...ain550629.shtml


What the hell is Newt Gingrich up to anyway? Is he taking lessons from Schroeder?

	24-04-2003 09:47									#2
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Newt Gingrich = Adulterous(sp?) Dork

	24-04-2003 09:49									#3
	Put an end to popups!

Gingrich makes some good points. We should pressure Syria instead of coddling them. There may be something there.

	24-04-2003 09:50									#4
	Remove this text

It seems he wants to climb out of history's dustbin.

	24-04-2003 09:51									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Do you think there is an ulterior motive for what he is saying though? I mean he's undermining his own party though...

	24-04-2003 09:52									#6
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Cross post with Lord Merciless.

That's what I think too. He's like the kid in the corner screaming for attention.

	24-04-2003 09:54									#7
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Do you think there is an ulterior motive for what he is saying though? I mean he's undermining his own party though...

He actually believes in things. He did when he was in power, he does now. He was actually one of my favorite pols back in the day, and I still have fond memories of him now.

	24-04-2003 09:55									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

What has Slimey Salamander been doing for a living since being thrown out on his ass after losing his position as SotH?



And why do we care what he thinks?

	24-04-2003 09:55									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I miss Bob Dole (frown)

	24-04-2003 09:57									#10
	Suffering from ads?

Oh, btw... just because Newt hasn't been in the public eye, doesn't mean he has been gone.

	24-04-2003 09:58									#11
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Oh, btw... just because Newt hasn't been in the public eye, doesn't mean he has been gone.

Ok, you've 'responded' to my question.

Now 'answer' it...

; ) : p

	24-04-2003 10:01									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

He's been involved in the RNC. Was a big guy during the 2000 election fiasco. Been going around to these private agencies, speaking, helping out candidates, etc.

Oh, and of course, lobbying .

	24-04-2003 10:02									#13
	Inflate your Upload Space

I wonder what Bush thinks of this. Powell did not succeed in diplomacy. Was it State's fault?

	24-04-2003 10:04									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui He's been involved in the RNC. Was a big guy during the 2000 election fiasco. Been going around to these private agencies, speaking, helping out candidates, etc. Oh, and of course, lobbying .

God, give him back his position as SotH!! At least that way we can keep a more scrutinous eye on him...


; )

	24-04-2003 10:11									#15
	Tired of ads?

Hey, I'd rather have him there than Hastert .

But his reputation isn't that great... so being behind the scenes is the best for him.

	24-04-2003 10:13									#16
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Ned I wonder what Bush thinks of this. Powell did not succeed in diplomacy. Was it State's fault?

You can only succeed in diplomacy if the other side perceives that they, too have something to gain in the process, and if you don't act like you're giving orders. The US made clear it's expectation that with only minor posturing to put up a pretense of independence, the rest of the world was to fall into line and endorse the US' policy. Kind of hard to "succeed" with that as your mandate.

I think Gingrich is Bush's (or at least the chickenhawk cabal's) attack dog, the same way Carville worked for Clinton. Bush doesn't have to take much of a position, he just doesn't tell Newt what to do with himself. Meanwhile, Powell gets undermined in a very public way, and influence shifts further to the chickenhawks.

	24-04-2003 10:16									#17
	Increase Your PM Length

Here is my wild conspiracy theory:

Either someone in the Administration or in the party is tired of Powell. Now, Powell being the most popular and respected politician in the world, even daring to criticize him is political suicide. So nobody can risk saying anything bad about him, as the backlash is too much.

So, they need someone whose words

a) Carry alot of weight
b) Can't be harmed by the criticism

So, somebody goes to Gingrich on the down low and asks him to speak out.

Or maybe Gingrich is just a dork.

	24-04-2003 10:16									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Just curious, who else here really wishes Colin Powell HAD run in the 2000 Presidential season?

Him I would have trusted to do the right things for the right reasons, and in the right ways.

	24-04-2003 10:17									#19
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I see MTG had a similar idea.

	24-04-2003 10:57									#20
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Not that wild of a theory - back when Powell was first rumored to be running, as a replacement for Quayle in '92, an anonymous member of the RNC on the conservative side of the party was quoted as describing Powell as "an ideological neuter, at best." Pretty nasty stuff.

Powell has been the only one in the administration with enough clout to somewhat limit the neocon agenda, so I'd expect they hate his guts, but you're right, it's political suicide to say or do anything to Powell from an official angle.

The fact that Bush hasn't publicly jumped all over Gingrich, the way he was willing to join in Lott's little necktie party, smells like something's cooking, and it ain't BBQ.

	24-04-2003 11:00									#21
	Tired of ads?

MtG, of course it's a BBQ! Bush is from Texas for God's sake.

And we know what's on the menu...

Last edited by DRoseDARs on 24-04-2003 at 13:16

	24-04-2003 11:07									#22
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Powell always was my number one choice for president. However, I must say, that Bush has exceeded my expectations. Bush has been very successful at everyting except diplomacy. I doubt that Powell would have been as successful where Bush has succeeded, getting rid of the Taliban and Saddam, but certainly Powell would have been much more deft diplomatically.

	24-04-2003 11:19									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Hmm, Bush II's military experiance and expertise vs. Colin Powell's?

quote: Secretary Powell was a professional soldier for 35 years, during which time he held myriad command and staff positions and rose to the rank of 4-star General. His last assignment, from October 1, 1989 to September 30, 1993, was as the 12th Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the highest military position in the Department of Defense. During this time, he oversaw 28 crises, including Operation Desert Storm in the victorious 1991 Persian Gulf war.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/government/powell-bio.html

Something to ponder, anyway. :cu te:

	24-04-2003 11:22									#24
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Ned Powell always was my number one choice for president. However, I must say, that Bush has exceeded my expectations. Bush has been very successful at everyting except diplomacy. I doubt that Powell would have been as successful where Bush has succeeded, getting rid of the Taliban and Saddam, but certainly Powell would have been much more deft diplomatically.

especially the economy!

	24-04-2003 11:51									#25
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

If Powell were president, we'd still have pounded the bejeezus out of the Taliban and Iraq. We just would have been more diplomatically suave about it.

Gatekeeper

	25-04-2003 00:40									#26
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker Here is my wild conspiracy theory: Either someone in the Administration or in the party is tired of Powell.

It's an open secret it's Rummy who put Newt up to this.

	25-04-2003 00:49									#27
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Che, do you have any basis for that assertion?

quote: If Powell were president, we'd still have pounded the bejeezus out of the Taliban and Iraq. We just would have been more diplomatically suave about it. Gatekeeper

Yeah, and that would have been better.

-Arrian

	25-04-2003 01:09									#28
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Arrian Che, do you have any basis for that assertion? Yeah, and that would have been better. -Arrian

Just a couple of stories on Salon.com.

quote: Colin Powell, neocon target The loyal soldier Colin Powell is a marked man. For his adversaries on the neoconservative right, it wasn't enough that the secretary of state went to the U.N. and said things he didn't fully believe about Iraq, in order to advance the White House war agenda. Although he won plaudits for his show-and-tell at the Security Council, the brief truce between Powell and his rightist critics could not outlast the hostilities in Iraq. Still regarded as an "appeaser" in neocon circles because he insists on recognizing the existence of the rest of the world, he is now once again their target. And to add further indignity to the right-wing insults, the designated assassin is none other than Newt Gingrich. Gingrich, like Richard Perle a member of the Defense Policy Board, is taking the occasion of a speech today at the American Enterprise Institute to launch the latest attack on Powell. The former speaker is a longtime advisor to Donald Rumsfeld, the secretary of defense whose obvious desire is to seize complete control of the administration's foreign policy. Who needs a State Department or a Secretary of State if all diplomacy is to be conducted by gunboat? It says something rather unflattering about the neocons that they have dispatched the unsavory Gingrich to carry their public agenda. After all, he is among the most renowned chicken hawks, and an Army brat to boot, who managed to avoid Vietnam while Powell served. His remarks today eerily echo Joe McCarthy's jihad against the State Department -- just substitute "commies" for "appeasers" -- and he even bears a disturbing physical resemblance to the Wisconsin demagogue. But then he always resembled McCarthy, going back to the "lexicon" he used to hand out to GOP congressional candidates, which urged them to accuse Democrats of "treason." When the former speaker isn't blathering on Fox News or hustling to annul his second marriage, he spends his days running the Gingrich Group -- a "communications" firm in Washington that depends heavily on his access to Rumsfeld and other administration figures. His perch on the Defense Policy Board, where he receives classified briefings and hobnobs with defense industry executives and Pentagon officials, is too important to Gingrich for him to risk Rumsfeld's displeasure. (While he refuses to publicly release the names of his clients, Gingrich is known to represent the nanotech industry, which requires large infusions of public investment from the Pentagon and other government agencies.) Today's speech, which reportedly demands a congressional investigation of the State Department and disparages American diplomats as ideological enemies of the president, is a direct act of aggression by the Defense Department. What will the president say? Probably nothing, as usual. Bush often looks like an insignificant cipher in these struggles. For the moment, Powell seems to be winning bureaucratic battles on Syria and North Korea. But unless the president's spokesman repudiates Rumsfeld's surrogate attack on the secretary of state, Powell should consider preparing his resignation letter. He has sacrificed more than enough for his callow boss. [10:25 a.m. PDT, April 22, 2003]

	25-04-2003 01:17									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Not much of a basis.

I don't even see a "sources say..." or a "an administration official, who asked not to be named..."

Hey, maybe that article is right, but excuse me if I don't accept it as given.

-Arrian

	25-04-2003 01:27									#30
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Hey, maybe that article is right, but excuse me if I don't accept it as given.

Especially when the source is Salon...