07-05-2003 04:14									#1
	PTWDGII: Custom Map Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Would you support a custom map made by Thrumble/redstar1?

Yes/No. If people want it, then we need to get the guys cracking on the map soon, so this one is official. 5 days.

	07-05-2003 04:46									#2
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Sure

Anyways, I'd like to be in on it too... even if it is just to watch.

	07-05-2003 04:53									#3
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I want to be in just to watch too... of course.

	07-05-2003 05:00									#4
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no. because people are morons who make stupid maps that aren't what people vote for.

	07-05-2003 05:17									#5
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX no. because people are morons who make stupid maps that aren't what people vote for.

	07-05-2003 06:04									#6
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX no. because people are morons who make stupid maps that aren't what people vote for.

Uber - give it a rest. Please.

	07-05-2003 06:51									#7
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I would rather use a completely random computer generated map.

Once generated, get a non player to review it, to ensure there are no really bad starting positions.

An interesting human made map can never give each team an equal chance. So lets not try, and just use a random one.

	07-05-2003 06:51									#8
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When did redstar get involved? I saw that Thrumble and Panzer32 vounteered first but when did redstar replace them?

	07-05-2003 06:54									#9
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Panzer too. They can all work together, they're just the ones who have expressed interest in helping out... no one is replacing anyone in the task.

	07-05-2003 10:21									#10
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Not that I wouldn’t trust in the craftsmanship of the named persons, but I’d prefer a random generated map, that someone checks before we start that the Monty Python team has the best place to start from.

Without joke I just like the random map's better they are somehow less predictable and if someone have an eye on the starting locations that no one will end up on a place that is significant worse than some others it would be the way I wanted it to be.

Last edited by Darekill on 07-05-2003 at 10:37

	07-05-2003 10:27									#11
	Put an end to popups!

I'd rather not. It's rather discomforting when you know there's an all-knowing person out there. Besides, the Monty Python team wants all teams to have good starting positions.

	07-05-2003 10:59									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Octavian X I'd rather not. It's rather discomforting when you know there's an all-knowing person out there.

Good thing you're not in the first game then.

	07-05-2003 11:34									#13
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX no. because people are morons who make stupid maps that aren't what people vote for.

My belief is that Morons make replies like this....

	07-05-2003 11:42									#14
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX no. because people are morons who make stupid maps that aren't what people vote for.

Considering all the time Togas and BFM spent making that map I think a little bit of friggin courtesy should be in order.

Now, if we think we are SOOO good at Civ3 then we should be able to win it no matter what map we have. Why did we choose deity in the first place? So that the mapmakers would give us so many advantages that it would be just as easy as an emperor game? Now, what's the point in playing deity if you play it the only way you think you can win? To me, "winning at deity" means you can win it no matter what map you have...

So, if you are pissed off about the map, deal with it, if you are pissed off that we're going to get our butts kicked in the SPDG then it's not the map's fault but our own.

	07-05-2003 11:44									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Hot_Enamel I would rather use a completely random computer generated map. Once generated, get a non player to review it, to ensure there are no really bad starting positions. An interesting human made map can never give each team an equal chance. So lets not try, and just use a random one.

I like this idea in any case they could do just some minor tweaking.

	07-05-2003 11:51									#16
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A map made by humans can have a little fun added to it; the whole reson for this second game. I say go for the custom map; I'm sure all starting locations will be equally good/bad.

	07-05-2003 14:47									#17
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hi ,

random generated , .... huge , mixed , we should generate one that is good , some cont with some islands , .....


, why dont we play on a world map $

have a nice day

	07-05-2003 15:17									#18
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quote: Originally posted by panag , why dont we play on a world map $

Because then all the teams would know the general shape of the world and where the other continents are even before they've explored the map themselves. That would remove one of the elements of surprise and fun in the game, IMHO.
Also, huge is just too big. The game would move on a lot slower, which is not ideal for a team-PBEM. Besides, IIRC the map size was already decided (standard) so it doesn't matter anymore.

	07-05-2003 15:35									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Because then all the teams would know the general shape of the world and where the other continents are even before they've explored the map themselves. That would remove one of the elements of surprise and fun in the game, IMHO. Also, huge is just too big. The game would move on a lot slower, which is not ideal for a team-PBEM. Besides, IIRC the map size was already decided (standard) so it doesn't matter anymore.

hi ,

slower , ....

the bigger the map is the more starting locations there are on it , ..... way more fun , way bigger empires , ...

have a nice day

	07-05-2003 17:35									#20
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Did Aeson join the PtWDG II game? If not, he may be the perfect candidate to check/review the generated map. Of course, there a certain risk that he will color it in orange, but hey, you can't get both quality and cheap price in the same time! The solution is of course to bribe him with an expensive orangesoda

	07-05-2003 18:21									#21
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Of course (I think), the human map would be largely based off a generated map. Then we make small changes we deem necessary.

	07-05-2003 19:20									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Tiberius Did Aeson join the PtWDG II game? If not, he may be the perfect candidate to check/review the generated map. Of course, there a certain risk that he will color it in orange, but hey, you can't get both quality and cheap price in the same time! The solution is of course to bribe him with an expensive orangesoda

Aeson has "joined" the game, but he belongs to no team right now.

	07-05-2003 20:35									#23
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I like the idea of humans tweaking a random map.

The creator(s) can have the map generator spit out maps until it produces one with promise, and then changes can be made as needed to make sure nobody is totally screwed.

Note that making sure that nobody is totally screwed is not the same thing as balance. I don't particularly want perfect balance (and am unsure there is such a thing anyway, because there are so many variables). I'd just rather not have anyone get stuck with a "So Very Cold..." type start spot.

-Arrian

	07-05-2003 20:56									#24
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hi ,

something that came across a chat with some players , why we dont ask people from an other site to make us a map , ...

have a nice day

	07-05-2003 22:27									#25
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quote: Originally posted by panag hi , slower , .... the bigger the map is the more starting locations there are on it , ..... way more fun , way bigger empires , ... have a nice day

Yes and much much slower too

we want the game to be over one day

	07-05-2003 22:38									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen Yes and much much slower too we want the game to be over one day

hi ,

slower , some people talk as if it takes a full day in between turns , .....

how many turns are we going to be doing a week , a day , a month , .... so it does not matter a lot , .....

have a nice day

	07-05-2003 23:05									#27
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the time it takes to play the turns is not the issue, it's how long it will take to finish the game. One larger maps empires become bigger and thus more difficult to finish off.

	07-05-2003 23:07									#28
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quote: Originally posted by panag the bigger the map is the more starting locations there are on it , ..... way more fun , way bigger empires , ...

That's exactly why a game played on a huge map will be slower.
First of all, there'll be more micromanagement to be done each turn. Second of all, teams will meet up later rather than sooner, which means that the aggressive tech trading will start a lot later.

quote: Originally posted by panag slower , some people talk as if it takes a full day in between turns , .....

Yes, we are. That happened all the time in the current-running PTWDG. Sometimes a single turn it took even more than two full days... mainly GS and Vox's fault, I admit. Okay, mostly just GS's.

	07-05-2003 23:17									#29
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I voted Yes...

Just make sure there is a really sunshiny place for us in Team Sunshine

	07-05-2003 23:26									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Thirgaral I voted Yes... Just make sure there is a really sunshiny place for us in Team Sunshine

Would you like a desert start? There's lots of sun there.