17-05-2003 18:49									#31
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I agree with mark13.

The password is the major stumbling block (although passing on a knowledge of strategy and tactics is in itself quite major)

But say, for example, a faction A member defects to faction B. Faction A has the HSA, and was not infiltrated before building it, and is now at war with faction B - and winning. The defecting player in faction B - even if 100 turns have passed since the defection, can open faction A's next turn, and see all displayed as if he had full infiltration

I'd say, remove that temptation by banning defections.

And to deal with the Tassadar5000 defection from the UoP to the Hive that's already happened, I'd suggest we restart with newly assigned passwords - after all, it should only take a couple of hours for the turn to circulate through to where it's at now, as moves will be identical.

And further "kill 2 birds with 1 stone" by waiting for the restart until GT is removed as co-Moderator from the private forums - where he has access to all the faction passwords (except for the Drones, who are set up over at CGN, where GT isn't accredited)

That would be my suggestion

G.

Last edited by Googlie on 17-05-2003 at 19:20

	17-05-2003 19:05									#32
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Sadly it is. See Faction sign up thread (12) onwards

	17-05-2003 19:13									#33
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: "kill 2 birds with 1 stone"

It would now kill 3 birds with one stone on account of UoP whoopsie.

	17-05-2003 22:49									#34
	Put an end to popups!

Restart is underway.

Passwords have been changed and sent to all turnplayers

The restarted Hive, 2102 has been hung on the turn reporting thread for Voltaire to download and replay
I've suggetsed to turnplayers that the passwords not be shared in the forums until we have confirmation from MarkG that GeneralTacitus of the Uni is blocked from all but his own faction's threads

I also tidied up the loose ends on the preferences tables

Googlie

	18-05-2003 00:43									#35
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Googlie But say, for example, a faction A member defects to faction B. Faction A has the HSA, and was not infiltrated before building it, and is now at war with faction B - and winning. The defecting player in faction B - even if 100 turns have passed since the defection, can open faction A's next turn, and see all displayed as if he had full infiltration

Or he can just PM the password to the place he wants to defect to

I suggest you just dont post the password. I also suggest that everybody in this forum take one full Xanax as it is all too obvious this forum is suffering from Panic Disorder

Defections add an interesting element to the game. Because in the real world, defections DO happen. So its a matter of creating a government structure, keeping your populace happy, and DEALING WITH A DEFECTION IF IT HAPPENS and if the person is not kind enough to keep it to themselves.

	18-05-2003 00:54									#36
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 I suggest you just dont post the password.

But then there would just be one password-holder, or, even worse, a "ruling clique" who knew the password and could examine and comment on the turn as it was being played, and a "peasant class" who were kept ignorant except for what their "betters' chose to share.

quote: Defections add an interesting element to the game. Because in the real world, defections DO happen. So its a matter of creating a government structure, keeping your populace happy, and DEALING WITH A DEFECTION IF IT HAPPENS and if the person is not kind enough to keep it to themselves.

Yes, but defectors take a "snapshot" with them when they go. If they continue to get information from embedded sources, then there is an in-game protocol for this - it's called "infiltration"

What we're trying to protect is the post-defection scenario where the defector uses the knowledge of the password (or shares it with his new faction) to open a turn many years later, especially if that faction has the HSA and has not been infiltrated. That doesn't reflect real life

G.

	18-05-2003 01:07									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Trusting to play fair has always been a great issue in PTW. So far its been working grat cause guys at poly are

	18-05-2003 01:19									#38
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

It's always been a part of SMAC PBEM as well, as there are innumerable bugs in the game that can easily be exploited. The difference is that we need to do that to play the game. Making defection a part of the game is not necessary, and also differs in the respect that a defecting player may inadvertantly leak info they weren't supposed to have. This creates a minefield for all involved - not least Googlie, who will have to trawl through all communication looking for discrepancies. A tireless and thankless task if ever I saw one, and I certainly wouldn't wish that on him. I know how hard CMNing a normal game is, and taking into account the work he already has to do to get this one on the road....well, it's getting a bit ridiculous.

I don't think defections would add a great deal to the game-playing experience, anyway. If anything, having closely-knit nations might add a sense of pride more than anything, and having defections may take some of that away.

I'm not trying to say that certain members are untrustworthy, or whatever. It's just that legalizing defections sets something of a precedent, where all and sundry may defect whenever and to whomever they so desire. It's much less of a game, and while we're all here to have fun, this fun will be lessened if there are suspicions aroused by an individual's actions. Certainly I would not like to be on the receiving end.

	18-05-2003 14:21									#39
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Well, lets have a poll, one and for all...
Here is the poll

-Jam