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skrobism
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Looks like I'll have to get myself some red wine. I just got the save and will play soon. Be patient. I just got the OCC save, too.
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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skrobism
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I passed the Gits save to Hueij. I am sorry but I will not have time to play until at least Sunday. I should have sent it sooner. Sorry. Hueij, if you want to send the save to me after you have played, or pass it on to the next person and I'll play next time around.
Sorry about the delay.
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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skrobism
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I got the save and will play asap.
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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skrobism
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Well I think Johnmcd is next, but since Johnmcd is the person that suggested that Marko_Polo get the next save I will assume that it is ok to pass the save to Marko_Polo.
Good luck. We are in desperate need of an army. The world is united against us except for the Babylonians. The world seems to think that we are not trust worthy and expansionist. Someone has been naughty and now Marko_Polo you are handed the reigns of the Celt Empire.
Here is my history:
0-1750ad Spanish and Germans sign pact to contain Celtic Aggression.
Souix and Spanish sign pact to contain Celtic Aggression.
1-1752ad Eiffle Tower started
2-1754ad cease fire with Carthaginians
3-1756ad
4-1758ad Germans build Eiffle tower; we start Adam Smith's
5-1760ad
6-1762ad
7-1764ad Germans and Carthaginians sign pact against Celtic Aggression
Souix and Carthagians sign pact against Celtic Aggression
Barbs capture Krotopkin 1 gold pillaged
8-1766ad Souix Completed Darwins Voyage
9-1768ad Carthagians Break our cease fire! We lose a trireme and 2 settlers. The Babylonians report they will come to our aide. We get gunpowder and troups are upgraded to Musketeers.
10-1770ad Barbs destroy a transport we lose 5 additional units.
11-1772AD OOPS I HIT ENTER but did not make a move. This is your first turn.
Happy Civ'ing
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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skrobism
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We have been playing for a while. Some poeple have left, the order has been changed, and Marko-Polo has joined us. Here are the players and the current order. Correct me if I am wrong. I hope that I didn't miss anyone.
Johnmcd 10 turns
ScouseGits 10 turns
Hueij 10 turns
Skrobism 10 turns
Marko-Polo 10 turns
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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johnmcd
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Edinburgh
Oct 1999
time: 05:12
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Well, I'm off on holiday for a week so you'd probably best leave me out for the time being. I'll be back next weekend.
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I have played my ten turns and will send the save game to SG, skipping John.
Here is my history:
1. 1772
Traded Physics to Feudalism with Sioux (not sure if it's a good bargain, but wanted to have Theo and Bach's!). They offered metallurgy and wanted Steam for it which I wasn't willing to trade and they scoffed to our sanitation  Addition: now that we are in war with Sioux we can steal the tech 
2. 1774
Carth's started with Suffrage.
3. 1776
Adam's completed  , started sewer at capitol. German sneak-attacked and sinked our caravel. Bloody Sioux crusader in turn sneak-attacked Wallace and killed the single musketeer. The next musketeer I had dispatched to Wallace killed the murderous crusader and Wallace was saved!
4. 1778
Next year is a ODEO one, so this is perfect time for REVOLUTION!
5. 1780
We are now a thriving democracy! Now getting our state ready for WLTxD!
6. 1782
Micromanaging our citizens for the best output..
7. 1784
Started celebrations with luxuries 60%, taxes 40% to rushbuy courts
8. 1786
People are populating like rabbits
9. 1788
Krotopkin back from barbarians for 78g, musketeer and legion as bonus gifts. Started university at Edinburgh, food caravans gathering in our capitol,
may the next leader in his great wisdom decide what's the next wonder gonna be!
10. 1790
Gold (d) from Glamis to Wallace 40g
We have now 4,7 million people (3 million ten turns ago). Capitol is now 14 and quite many cities are close to 8 and needing aqueduct. A couple celebrating turns more and then back to normal science rates will give us the corporation and the freights!
I have built a few musketeers, crusaders and diplos but I wouldn't go so far as to call our army strength as 'supreme'. Our navy consists of a single transport so it's kinda weak.. 
Btw, I built one new city (Paradize Island with silk and whale) to the island between us and Sioux. Thought that it should have strong defense and take the AI attacks before our mainland..
So, good luck SG! May our nation prosper in your command! Marko_Polo out.
[This message has been edited by Marko_Polo (edited February 17, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Marko_Polo (edited February 17, 2001).]
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skrobism
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Not bad Marko-polo. Looks like you started to lead us out of the mess that I left everyone.
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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Well SG, you anticipated a backlash and you got it! 
First of all, me either haven't played much in strict perfectionist style. My style is more like 'perfectionist ICS'. I really love to have a lot of cities because that gives me more flexibility. If I suddenly need some units and all my perfectionist cities are producing improvements.. well, that sucks! It's just fun to have many cities but NOT so close to each other than in purist ICS style.
So, prior to playing this game, I read the "Simpson II's perfectionist strategy" manual and tried to follow it's guidelines. Then follows my defence to SG's moaning:
quote:
Originally posted by Scouse Gits on 02-26-2001 07:50 AM
Playing in a representative form of government the objective is to grow your population with "We love … " days. To celebrate in a serious fashion you must have the following conditions:
a) Surplus food
b) Market Places to enhance the luxury rate - not Courthouses
c) Aqueducts/Sewer Systems where appropriate
d) Trade routes.
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I agree with 'a', 'c' and 'd' and with 'b' about MP's. However, in perfection game the courthouse is needed in order to an odd-population city to celebrate. Here is an explanation from the 'Simpson II'-guide:
quote:
"Everything you never knew you wanted to know about WLTxD
The cornerstone of this strategy is the use of celebrations to enhance growth. To recap the manual, a city will celebrate when it is at least size three, at least half of it's citizens are happy and it has no discontent citizens. If your government is a Republic or a Democracy, and there is a food surplus of at least one stalk, then the city will grow by one population point per turn. Simple, and I'm sure you knew that.
But did you know there is a cap to the amount of luxuries a city can use? If it produces more than 2 times it's population level then any surplus is wasted. It takes precisely two luxuries to change an unhappy person to a content one, and another two to change the content citizen to a happy one. With one citizen 'naturally' content, it's easily worked out that you can always generate sufficient happy citizens for a celebration.
However, if your first citizen is unhappy then things change. If your population level is an even number then you are still OK, though you loose a content citizen. On the other hand, if your population level is an odd number, then you can only generate one too few happy people for a celebration! This can happen thanks to the aforementioned unhappiness due to civ size, and it also happens if you have any specialists, including entertainers. A city which can't celebrate is almost completely useless for this strategy, so we will be trying to prevent that from happening, and curtailing our early expansion at these numbers.
There are ways around these limits. The reliable one is to go to Democracy and build courthouses, which give an extra happy citizen - reliable but slow, we want to do our celebrating early or there is little point. The other is to build The Hanging Gardens. If you do build them then that is great, but it's not something that you can genuinely guarantee, especially against human opponents, so I'll leave the effect of the HG as an exercise for the reader.
In general you will need a marketplace to increase luxury output if you want to celebrate in a Republic, though a harbor and putting everyone onto ocean squares can be equally good. Certainly you need roads or rivers if you are going to work the land. Add at least one happiness improvement, and you should be in a fine position to celebrate."
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So because we don't have HG the only option for WLTxD's was the court.
quote:
It is very wasteful having luxuries set at 60% when only a few cities will benefit. The trick is to have as many cities celebrating at one time so the loss of science/taxes to luxuries is only a short number of turns.
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I again agree with this main principal. However, when I got the game I found out that the cities were quite small and gave a high priority to growing. That was my decision and is open to debate
Year 1790 was the 4. year with luxuries 60% and there was 3 effective 'WLTxD growing years' prior it when almost all the cities had grown thanks to those courts and trade routes. (My predecessors had established so many trade routes so that the cities were able to celebrate even without MP's.) I deliberately left the lux rate to 60% with celebrations going on so that the new leader would have had the option of continuing or stopping them up to his preference.
quote:
a) Half the world is black - it's 1790.
b) When first to Railroad - Darwin is always useful. So are railway tracks!
c) Wonders should be built with caravans after discovering trade.
d) Trade is essential under any government, not only for the routes but also for the bonus to science and gold. The money from initial trade allows further caravans to be rushed along, so more wealth/beakers can be created. It is a multiplier effect.
e) On a large world one transport is not enough.
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I agree with all the above. For the transport part I must add that me and my predecessor had very bad luck with our navy due to barb & AI attacks which sunk almost all our navy. And given the status of our nation defence I simply had to build defencive units to protect our cities. I think that we don't necessarily have enough of them yet.
In conclusion, I'm not trying to say that my contribution to the game was the best possible. There are many players around here that are much more skillful and experienced players than I am. I have only played under ten games at deity level. Still I want to learn more of this wonderful game by playing, making mistakes and learning from them.
Given that, I couldn't get away without trying to to justify why I played my 10 turns as I did.. especially when this was my very first succession game ever! Ok, enough of this, let's see what's happening next! 
[This message has been edited by Marko_Polo (edited February 26, 2001).]
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johnmcd
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Edinburgh
Oct 1999
time: 05:12
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I think that while this game is a mess and we are undeniably behind where we should/ could be we should not tell each other how to play. It’s a succession game and as such when you are not the king your lips should be sealed. Everyone gets their ten turns and we win or lose by our collective wisdom. I expect everyone of us can whip the computer at Diety on our own, the challenge here is to see whether we can do it together.
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johnmcd
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Edinburgh
Oct 1999
time: 05:12
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Hooray! I vote for the Gits to drink red wine! Except the little one.
I'd be up for a big moan one, so long as only negatives are pointed out and no advice on how to do it better is actually given.
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johnmcd
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Edinburgh
Oct 1999
time: 05:12
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Well, I've played and passed to Hueij. We are doing better though my turn was not without its upsets. A number of carvans were ambushed by Germans and Spanish, though thankfully no boats were sunk. Most navys seem to have taken a severe sinking from some Barbarian Galleons so our deffiency in that area seems to have been balanced somewhat. Other than that the only major development is a series of landings up our coast by the Spanish, most recently with riflemen....
We still don't have consctiption as all my spies keep getting nailed, though there is a vet on the mainland that looks like she has sea legs...
We discovered many things, first of all explosives which led to espionage which led to theocracy which led to chivalry (don't blame me for all of these choices, the options were limited to chivalry at one point at least...)
We are at least staying alive for the time being.
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Hueij
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Kokonino Kounty
May 1999
time: 06:12
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Game sent to Skrobism...
The Hueij Years: 1826-1846
When Hueij was elected President of the Celts he knew it was going to be a difficult term. With a horrible reputation among the other nations there was no chance of getting new allies, keeping the Babylonians as allies would be hard enough. The war with Spain was a major concern, a navy was needed to heed off a Spanish invasion and eventually to conquer Spain. So it was decided to turn scientific research towards naval technologies and to grow the city of Edinburgh...
1826: exchanged Steam Engine for Metallurgy with the Babylonians and gave them Explosives.
1828: Lost a Transport with two Freights, we need a navy! Bribed a Spanish Cannon.
1830: Discovered Chivalry, Horseman updated to Knights. Going for Leadership. Our Spy discovered a Spanish city on our continent, Cadiz...
1832: A Spanish Spy steals the Corporation, in retalliation we bribe Cadiz for 175 gold, getting 39 gold and Conscription. The Spy didn't survive... All our Musketeers are Riflemen now. In other news: Edinburgh builds the UN... Peace with the Carthagians and the Sioux for Athomic Theory and the Corporation.
1836: Leadership, all Knights turned into Dragoons Discovered another Spanish city, Saragossa.
1838: Bank in Edinburgh, WLTPD!
1840: F*****g Senate gets a cease-fire with Spain, so I had to spend twice the money to bribe Saragossa. 800 gold and the loss of another Spy
1842: Electricity
1846: Peace with Germans and Chinese, 675 gold for a Coal Freight to Beijing. Discovered Steel.
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Hueij
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Kokonino Kounty
May 1999
time: 06:12
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Game sent to Skrobism...
The Hueij Years: 1826-1846
When Hueij was elected President of the Celts he knew it was going to be a difficult term. With a horrible reputation among the other nations there was no chance of getting new allies, keeping the Babylonians as allies would be hard enough. The war with Spain was a major concern, a navy was needed to heed off a Spanish invasion and eventually to conquer Spain. So it was decided to turn scientific research towards naval technologies and to grow the city of Edinburgh...
1826: exchanged Steam Engine for Metallurgy with the Babylonians and gave them Explosives.
1828: Lost a Transport with two Freights, we need a navy! Bribed a Spanish Cannon.
1830: Discovered Chivalry, Horseman updated to Knights. Going for Leadership. Our Spy discovered a Spanish city on our continent, Cadiz...
1832: A Spanish Spy steals the Corporation, in retalliation we bribe Cadiz for 175 gold, getting 39 gold and Conscription. The Spy didn't survive... All our Musketeers are Riflemen now. In other news: Edinburgh builds the UN... Peace with the Carthagians and the Sioux for Athomic Theory and the Corporation.
1836: Leadership, all Knights turned into Dragoons Discovered another Spanish city, Saragossa.
1838: Bank in Edinburgh, WLTPD!
1840: F*****g Senate gets a cease-fire with Spain, so I had to spend twice the money to bribe Saragossa. 800 gold and the loss of another Spy
1842: Electricity
1846: Peace with Germans and Chinese, 675 gold for a Coal Freight to Beijing. Discovered Steel.
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29-01-2001 04:36
, but now, who cares?? Maybe I'm a little bit touchy?? 
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