14-05-2003 11:52									#1
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These're some known bugs I've discovered in various ToT scenarios. Some are easily fixed, some I have no idea how to fix.
These're only the bugs I've spotted. There may in fact be more.
I write these here in hopes the authors or some good samaritan will see them and make an effort to rectify them.

Final Days, by MagyarCrusader:
In the events file, there's a trigger when "Budapest" is captured. This is impossible, as there're the cities "Buda," and "Pest," but not one connected. The solution: change the trigger to be when "Buda" is captured. Another solution would be to try and use an @AND command so that it's triggered when "Buda" and "Pest" are captured, but I don't know how to do it.
Also, the wonder "STALIN" is buildable by the germans from the start, which is clearly supposed to be a wonder owned by the soviet union. This could be fixed by placing the wonder in a soviet city, but that entails messing with the scenario directly... something I'm hesitant to do.

Europe in Flames, by Michael Jeszenka:
There're certain conditions that need to be fulfilled before the game declares Germany has won the war. Unfortunately, it seems there is a problem with the flags, as "winning the war" is a simple matter of taking the "London" city. The game then announces that "britain and russia have been significantly smashed that no real threat remains to the Third Reich."
Clearly there were intended to be other objectives, but a bug prevents this. Unfortunately, I don't have a clue how to fiddle around with ToT flags and such, so I can't fix it myself. However, it probably could be easily rectified by anyone who knew how the flags worked.

Hispaniola, by Alex the Magnificent:
Quite a lot. Spain starts out with a horrible reputation, so holding a peace with any civ is impossible (although this may be intended). This involves messing with the scenario directly to fix it. It's also impossible to irrigate the "tobacco" terrain (I don't think this is intended, but you can argue it is). This can be fixed by going through the rules file. There are also some problems with the events. Your "king" collects money from you annually. This is represented by a changemoney command. However, the amount the events tells you it's taking and the amount it actually takes are different. It'll say: "Give me 100 gold." when in reality it takes 300 or more. This is easily rectified by going through the events.
Also, through the events, terrain is suppose to change from productive "gold" and "silver" terrain to more worthless terrain after time. I think this is workable, but there's also an event for when a new "silver" mine is discovered. However, the Change Terrain command doesn't work, and I'm not sure why. Because the "silver" terrain is not a normal terrain type, I think. I'm not really sure how to fix this problem, but it'd probably require extensive work.
Also, there's something really weird with the city screen. It's hard to explain, but anyone who looks at it can see the problem. I have no idea how to fix it.
Finally, the timescale... the game begins in 4000 BC, according to the date indicator. A minor problem.

Anyway, these are what I've observed, at least...

Last edited by Cal on 14-05-2003 at 12:24

	15-05-2003 03:49									#2
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Is Hispaniola a pretty good scenario? I can give it a debugging if:

1) You think it's worth it,
2) and you'll give it a test afterwards.

This assumes Alex remains long gone. I don't even know his email. What's the Civ etiquette here?

	15-05-2003 04:55									#3
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Boco Is Hispaniola a pretty good scenario? I can give it a debugging if: 1) You think it's worth it, 2) and you'll give it a test afterwards. This assumes Alex remains long gone. I don't even know his email. What's the Civ etiquette here?

It's a good scenario. To put it succinctly:

Playing as either Spain, portugal, france, england, or the dutch (the game is optimized for the Spanish), you start out with a few ships full of settlers and good units. With this, you must meet the natives, and begin colonizing the area. The scenario is not America, but only Hispaniola and Puerto Rico.

Read about it and download here: http://coc.apolyton.net/scenarios/scn-hispaniola.shtml

I think as long as you make it clear that the original was done by Alex and you only made modifications, then it would be okay. I think it'd be worth it. And I'd gladly playtest.

	15-05-2003 06:16									#4
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I dl'ed it. Most of the changes look as simple as you say. I'll check about the new silver mine at 44,30.

Give me a few days and I'll PM you the corrected files. If they pass, I'd suggest creating a HISPAN~2.txt file (it looks like he has neither HISPAN~2.txt nor a readme). It would contain Alex's byline, some of the text from the Cradle of Civ description (or is there a better description elsewhere?), and a single sentence mentioning that I corrected some minor bugs found by you. At that point we could zip it and send it to...Techumseh for CoC?

Tech, time to put on a mod hat. Does this sound fair?

This event's kinda slick. Looks like it keeps the Natives from ever learning anything.

quote: @IF RANDOMTURN denominator=1 @THEN TakeTechnology whom=Natives Collapse Technology=91 value=2 @ENDIF

	15-05-2003 06:29									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Boco It would contain Alex's byline, some of the text from the Cradle of Civ description (or is there a better description elsewhere?)

I'm pretty sure that was taken directly from Alex's download site, but that page has disappeared now. It might be good to fix any grammar or spelling errors.

The main one is here: http://www.aha.ru/~mor/

	15-05-2003 06:54									#6
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That link timed out on me.

I've fixed the incorrect gold texts. I'll play with the ChangeTerrains next.

quote: Also, there's something really weird with the city screen. It's hard to explain, but anyone who looks at it can see the problem. I have no idea how to fix it.

That's the most serious bug! It look's as if the Labels.txt has been corrupted. My Norton Crashguard doesn't like it at all, and kills ToT when you try to get details on the info in the upper left. It could take a little time to pinpoint the cause.

	15-05-2003 07:12									#7
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Some of his ChangeTerrain events specify map 1, when only map 0 exists. That includes the new mine.

Looks like 44,30 can create a silver square now. I tested the ChangeTerrain event by changing the trigger to Turn=Every. Oddly setting the trigger to Turn=1 or Turn=2 didn't work.

Last edited by Boco on 15-05-2003 at 07:51

	15-05-2003 07:55									#8
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What do you think he's after here? Each turn is a day? I'm not sure how he wanted to use 'Age of Discovery'. Does this scenario really last 500 turns?

	15-05-2003 07:57									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Boco What do you think he's after here? Each turn is a day? I'm not sure how he wanted to use 'Age of Discovery'.

I'm not sure... I think he was trying to represent the "age of discovery". You might just want to call the first turn "Day 1," then "Day 2," etc.

The events indicate he wanted the game to be 500 turns long.

	15-05-2003 11:54									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Boco Looks like 44,30 can create a silver square now. I tested the ChangeTerrain event by changing the trigger to Turn=Every. Oddly setting the trigger to Turn=1 or Turn=2 didn't work.

I think that may be because the game doesn't begin on turn 1. Turn 1 in normal civ is 4000 BC, but if I remember correctly, Hispaniola begins when the date says 3850 or so.

	16-05-2003 01:46									#11
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After taking a look at the events in Europe in Flames, and better acquainting myself with the ToT Events language, I believe I've located the cause of the bug.

There are two triggers that check for when Germany has won the war, they both have this command:

mask=0b0000000000000000000000000001111

Change this line so it looks like this:

mask=0b1111000000000000000000000000000

If you do this for the two triggers, I believe it should work properly. Will test it myself...

edit: Doesn't work. I'm now not sure if this is fixable.

Last edited by Cal on 16-05-2003 at 04:06

	16-05-2003 03:36									#12
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Sounds like you've found the guilty event code.

What's the complete event? Does it look for threshold, which IIRC doesn't work right, or count? Looks like you've change the mask from flags 0-3 to 28-31. Are the flags associated with CityTaken London and that Soviet city in the 28-31 range?

	16-05-2003 03:38									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Boco That's the most serious bug! It look's as if the Labels.txt has been corrupted. My Norton Crashguard doesn't like it at all, and kills ToT when you try to get details on the info in the upper left. It could take a little time to pinpoint the cause.

Hispaniola:
I remember this scenario: a Tot scenario about my favourite historical period by the great Alex Mor, i was excited...
Unfortunately after playing it i was really disappointed and it was a pity since the scenario is well done, but it suffers of the "beta syndrome".

The bug you're talking about is a typical example, at that time i also wrote a mail to Alex but never received an answer:

Alex wanted to use days for Civ turns instead of years or months, Tot (and Civ i believe), allows designers to use months (and in the labels.txt at row 437 & followings you'll find month names), Alex though that he could replace month names with a pair of weeks (instead of Jan, Feb, ... he placed Sun, Mon, ..., and again Sun, Mon,...) the only problem was that Months are 12 while 2 weeks have 14 days so he inserted too much lines (2 for precision) in his labels.txt, and this fools Tot.
Remove two rows from labels.txt (between 437-450 line) and the city screen will come back to normality, now how you can change his scenario to make it work is a mistery for me ( maybe reverting back to months is a solution but then the scenario became too long historically, or you could simply cut two days from the turn sequence but it will be odd to have a week every two without two days...), anyway removing the offending lines you should be able to read a correct city screen without crashes.

Anyway if you want a beta tester for it sign me in!

	16-05-2003 03:55									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Boco Sounds like you've found the guilty event code. What's the complete event? Does it look for threshold, which IIRC doesn't work right, or count? Looks like you've change the mask from flags 0-3 to 28-31. Are the flags associated with CityTaken London and that Soviet city in the 28-31 range?

If I've read the events right, Germany is considered to have won the war when it has taken London, El Iskandariya, Magnitogorsk, and Perm.

Whenever you take one of those cities, a flag is set. (0-3) When all four are set, the events announces you've won, and declares Germany the victor of the war. The bug came from that the game sets flags 0-3, but that mask checks for flags 28-31. By changing it back to 0-3, it should now work. To my knowledge, there are no other flags set for Germany, so there was a bug that whenever you got one flag, the "win" command was activated anyway.

....wait, I changed it to 28-31? Are you sure that's right? I thought I changed it from 28-31 to 0-3... hold on, I'll check.

...you're right. Now the event doesn't work at all.

The original events don't use threshold or count. I tried it with count, and the event stopped working altogether. Will try threshold later.

	16-05-2003 04:57									#15
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@Angelo. Thanks, you saved me a lot of time. The easiest fix is to 'take weekends off'. I'll play with it a little to see if I can come up with an alternative.

@Cal. Maybe try Count =x (where x=1-4). If you put in 4, then all four cities must be captured.

Thanks for the heads up on the turn=4 at start.

I couldn't get a colonist to irrigate either Tobacco or Tobacco Plantation. That's consistent with the Rules.txt as I read it. Can you get a little more specific about that bug?

I'll look at what Alex used for Civ reputations, etc., but I'm hesitant to change Spain's reputation from rotten unless that's historically appropriate. What do you guys think?

Last edited by Boco on 16-05-2003 at 05:13

	16-05-2003 05:21									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Boco @Cal. Maybe try Count =x (where x=1-4). If you put in 4, then all four cities must be captured. If you want them to be held simultaneously on the turn of victory, then each CityTaken trigger must not have 'Continuous' in the associated action.

That might be it. I'll try it a few more times.
If a city is recaptured, the flag is removed, so I think the intent is for the four cities to be held simultaneously. Not necessarily all be taken on the same turn, just held.

quote: I couldn't get a colonist to irrigate either Tobacco or Tobacco Plantation. That's consistent with the Rules.txt as I read it. Can you get a little more specific about that bug?

I saw sample pictures of Hispaniola, and in them, the tobacco terrains were both irrigated. But in the game, you can't do it. I'm not sure if Alex intended it or if it's a mistake. Why shouldn't tobacco be irrigatable? The only reason I can think of is that it encourages you to build your cities there.

quote: I'll look at what Alex used for Civ reputations, etc., but I'm hesitant to change Spain's reputation from rotten unless that's historically appropriate. What do you guys think?

Even if a bad reputation is historically accurate, it's still a pain. The civ you're allied with will break off the alliance whenever they can speak with you, the other civs demand money and any tech you have if you want to maintain peace... it's impossible to avoid total war.
I know some other civs don't have their reputation so low, so I think it's a mistake. At least change it to "questionable" if you think it's historically accurate that the Spanish have a bad reputation.

edit: More on Europe in Flames:
With the count=4 tag, if the cities are captured in the same turn, then victory is declared, but not if you capture some on one turn, and some on another. All of the "citytaken" tags have the "continuous" tag. It should work, if I'm reading it right... will try it without the continuous flag.

edit2: removing the "continuous" tag had no effect. Now I don't know what to do.

	16-05-2003 06:14									#17
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I'm pretty sure the Continuous modifiers should be in. If the cities are captured on different turns and if Count=4, is victory declared the turn after the last city is taken?

I suspect that these events should not have JustOnce modifiers. They're probably not there, but just in case...

	16-05-2003 06:21									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Boco I'm pretty sure the Continuous modifiers should be in. If the cities are captured on different turns and if Count=4, is victory declared the turn after the last city is taken?

Victory isn't declared unless you capture all four of the cities on the same turn. That's with the addition of the "count=4" tag. If you don't add that in, then victory is declared if you capture any of the cities. All four cities have the "continuous" tags, and not "justonce".

Here's the original unmodified events. I suspected the problem was one of the flags forgot a "who=" tag, but I don't think that's it...

	16-05-2003 07:08									#19
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Okay, I'm getting desperate. Maybe it's the position of Continuous. What happens if you put the Continuous line immediately after the Flag line?

I've found that the exact positions of Delay and JustOnce are critical. If they don't follow @THEN or each other, they don't work.

Also, on p212 of the ToT manual, they mention putting Continuous in the trigger of CityTaken events. Never done it, but maybe it could help here.

Six year olds are dangerous. I got a 'need to clean your glasses' cough in the face yesterday, and today I'm hurting. Time to go collapse.

	16-05-2003 07:13									#20
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I think that might be the problem! I'll go back, change all of the continuous lines, put the count=4 tag in there, and then if it doesn't work, I will cry.

Well, not really, I'm just tired of hearing the Hitler: "Sieg Heil!" scream whenever you take a key city.

Take care of yourself.

	16-05-2003 07:58									#21
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It works.

Anyone who wants to play a debugged version of Europe in Flames should download these edited events.

Attachment: events.txt
This has been downloaded 8 time(s).

	16-05-2003 09:38									#22
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I just wanted to post here and say that I have always found the idea of a "debugger" hilariously amusing.

Also, where can I get one of these debugging programs? I need one for my ToT scenario. I think I've made an error in the tech tree somewhere.

	17-05-2003 21:05									#23
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The only civ2 debugger there is, is the @DEBUG thing for events...

Well, the other debugger is of course this forum. Post your tech tree and you're bound to get a fixed one back.

A bug in the tech tree is probably one of two things:
(1) You either made a typo somewhere, missed a comma or something. The only way to find that is to carefully look through it again line by line.
(2) There's a loop in the tech tree. That's probably easiest to locate by writing down your tech tree on paper.

(or something)

	17-05-2003 23:10									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Boco I'll look at what Alex used for Civ reputations, etc., but I'm hesitant to change Spain's reputation from rotten unless that's historically appropriate. What do you guys think?

I think that Spanish reputation should be raised:

The scenario starts with 3 ships for Spain and no colony so one could assume it depicts the first Columbus voyage, but probably, since the ships are loaded with artillery and settlers, it is the second Columbus voyage, anyway it can't be after 1494 and Spain reputation went down long after this year:
The main source of the infamous "black legend" is the "Short Account of the Destruction of West Indies" written by Bartolome de Las Casas and published only in 1552.

So, IMHO, if you want to raise Spanish reputation you're going to make the scenario more historically accurate, not less.

	17-05-2003 23:39									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Alinestra Covelia I just wanted to post here and say that I have always found the idea of a "debugger" hilariously amusing. Also, where can I get one of these debugging programs? I need one for my ToT scenario. I think I've made an error in the tech tree somewhere.

He has a French accent.

As far as I'm aware, you have to debug a tech tree manually.

In ToT you can debug your events by simply typing @DEBUG at the start of your events file. When you load your scenario, it gererates a seperate 'Report Txt.' file. If there is an error, it will be at the end of that. Note that many errors involving flags and masks do not appear in this parser, they simply don't work in the scenario.

	19-05-2003 06:16									#26
	Hispaniola Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Thanks for the input on reputation. Looks like I'll raise it. Sorry for the delay, but I'll get back on it shortly. As for the turns, what about "x days after landfall"?

I found the US-censored-for-TV-version of "Four Weddings and a Funeral" amusing, too. In the opening scene Hugh Grant yells 'Bugger' every 2 seconds instead of 'Fire Truck'. Really tones it down, don't you think.

	19-05-2003 08:51									#27
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"land spotted" might be good too. Though that may be too many words.

	23-05-2003 07:50									#28
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Okay, here's the Hispaniola checklist

Fixed the text for the King's petty larceny
Fixed city screen bug (removed Saturdays from Labels.txt)
Removed the incorrect map references from many ChangeTerrain actions
Changed Spain's rep from 80 to 0.
Changed time scheme to "Days since 'Land Ho': 1-500"
Edited @Terrain to allow irrigation of Tobacco terrains

Cal, do you still have the same email that you had when you tested my scoresheet for Case's Cruel Sea back in 9/2001?

	23-05-2003 07:59									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Boco Cal, do you still have the same email that you had when you tested my scoresheet for Case's Cruel Sea back in 9/2001?

Yep, CalvinAdam@aol.com

	24-05-2003 03:51									#30
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Final Days, by MagyarCrusader:
In the events file, there's a trigger when "Budapest" is captured. This is impossible, as there're the cities "Buda," and "Pest," but not one connected. The solution: change the trigger to be when "Buda" is captured. Another solution would be to try and use an @AND command so that it's triggered when "Buda" and "Pest" are captured, but I don't know how to do it.


There's a way with continuous flags

If buda (anyone) taken by (one country) --> Flag x=1
If Pest (anyone) taken (one country) --> Flag y=1

If buda (one country) taken by (anyone) --> Flag x=0
If Pest (one country) taken (anyone) --> Flag y=0

If flag x=1 AND flag y=1 ---> event !