18-05-2003 07:46									#1
	Why would anyone assume that there are not thousands of terrorists already in the US? Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I have been reading lately about loads of Mexicans coming accross our southern boarder in the trailers of trucks. The ones we know about involve tragic deaths of people who were abandoned in the desert when the trailer is disconected from the tractor. There must be thousands of people who come accross daily. Why would anyone assume that terrorists do not use these means and others to come into this country virtually at will? I think that we are an explosion waiting to happen. It is only a matter of time, in my opinion, before a tragedy overshadows 9/11. What do you think?

	18-05-2003 07:47									#2
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Right, there probably are that many terrorists here, thats why we must be vigilant.

	18-05-2003 07:56									#3
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It is always "just a matter of time", though of course, ti could be 1000 years.

9/11 was a brilliantly executed plan. without using the same props (large airliners into huge buildings), the likelyhood of terrorists causing anywhere near the same damage or death is low. More cotidian attacks, like the first WTC bombing, are infinately more likely, far more likely than all this "bio-terror' 'dirty bomb" bull.

And terrorist would be unlikely to chose amehotd of entry so fraught with peril as trying to cross the US-Mexico border illegally. It would make sense to get a few people in an try internal recruiting.

	18-05-2003 08:17									#4
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I don't think we're likely to have problems with Mexican terrorists, though God only knows why not. We treat them worse than Arabs.

	18-05-2003 08:42									#5
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It really depends on how many of them are willing to commit suicide. I don't think there will be anymore 9-11s though, just more of the usual type.

	18-05-2003 08:45									#6
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Suicide bombings are not even necessary: just make a bomb, put it in a garbage can in some mall, and there you go. The sort of panic a wave of such minor attacks would create would be high.

regular, old fashioned car bombs would also work (steal a car, park it somewhere full of explosives, walk away).

	18-05-2003 08:52									#7
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You don't need terrorists, there are enough wackos with automatic weapons.

	18-05-2003 18:14									#8
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Yea, that too. And enough pacifiers as well...

	18-05-2003 18:25									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Lincoln Yea, that too. And enough pacifiers as well...

God I know. Imagine all the damage being done to our children's teeth....anarchy and social collapse will surely result.

	18-05-2003 18:31									#10
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Yeah, that could be a serious problem, especially if one contains anthrax! I say, ban them all just in case...

	18-05-2003 18:36									#11
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We need to find a way to keep people like Timothy McVeigh out of the country.

	18-05-2003 18:38									#12
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Remember when the scariest thing we had to deal with was AIDS infected needles in bottles of pepsi? *sigh* lost innocent youth...

	18-05-2003 19:13									#13
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"Why would anyone assume that there are not thousands of terrorists already in the US? "

I don't like to be so much nasty , but aren't they in already? Well known terrorists, Bush, Powel, Rice,"****" C. , they are on pretty high post in the goverment. Few could do more damage than thousand.

Starchild, this was much bigger threat than some terrorist's attacks.
BTW If current medicine would use better designed needles and stuff, there wouldn't be such problem.

	18-05-2003 19:14									#14
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And if I'd write **** it will not be censored?

	18-05-2003 19:15									#15
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So we could try to write it this way di ck.

	18-05-2003 19:35									#16
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Thanks for your valuable insight into terrorism ragher. I didn't know that Bush flew the planes into the buidings. But he was a pilot and Republican so I guess it could have been him...

	18-05-2003 19:35									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Starchild Remember when the scariest thing we had to deal with was AIDS infected needles in bottles of pepsi? *sigh* lost innocent youth...

please, i was drinking pepsi so often in an effort to make ryan white look like the hitler of aids.

	18-05-2003 20:14									#18
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I think the immigration scare is just another boogey man that is an excuse for some to push an anti-immigration agenda. With the proper controls and system in place, the US could track immigration. The immigration "problem" isn't with the number of people coming in... it's with the government's ineptitude and lack of action to control and document the people. Proportionally, the number of immigrants coming in is much less than it was in the early 20th century. But yet now, it's a huge problem?? Back then, the US government was dedicated to controlling and documenting the endless flow of immigrants... but now, people are unwilling to spend the necessary money to get the job done. And that leaves us at risk to terrorism. That should have been the lesson of 9-11... 9-11 happened because the government and the airline industry didn't want to spend the money to keep us safe and do the job right. Frankly, I couldn't justify saving money if it put people's lives at risk, but unfortunately, that is what the fiscal culture of this nation has become. A trade-off... lives for dollars.

The solution isn't to shut off immigration. We are a nation of immigrants. It would be monumentally hypocritical to stop freedom-hungry people from entering this country. The terrorists are still going to find a way to get in. I thought the reason we wasted billions in Iraq was to liberate people. We can bring freedom to people for a lot less than the price tag of this recent war by offering freedom to those willing to leave their native lands for our greener-pastures.

The solution is to channel immigration into efficient ports-of-entry that control and document the flow of immigration. We had such a system once. It was able to do more with much less than we have now. But our government seems unwilling to spend the money necessary to ensure that the citizens of the US and those yearning to be free are kept safe. If 9-11 didn't wake people up, I shudder to think what it's going to take for people to realize the problem and how to solve it. As I said before, shutting off immigration and closing our borders isn't an option. It goes against the foundations that this Democracy was founded on. I find it odd that the courageous people in our Armed Forces are willing to die to protect freedom, but yet government officials and taxpayers are unwilling to spend money to protect the very thing that so many are willing to die for.

	18-05-2003 20:19									#19
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Good post Sava!

	18-05-2003 20:24									#20
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I wouldn't assume anything Lincoln. That's just a route to make an arse out of u and me.

	18-05-2003 20:32									#21
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Lincoln: if your being serious... and thank you...

Cruddy: if my perception of what your post is insinuating is correct... then

	18-05-2003 20:35									#22
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quote: I think the immigration scare is just another boogey man that is an excuse for some to push an anti-immigration agenda.

Personally, I feel that the US should close its borders at least for awhile to deal with its many problems at home.

Now with this terrorist thing, we are faced with an even bigger threat and an even bigger reason of why they should be closed.

	18-05-2003 20:36									#23
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ok michael savage

	18-05-2003 20:36									#24
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Yes, I am serious Sava. I am trying to get my Thai girlfriend over here and I am tired of jumping through hoops. I think that immigration should be encouraged but while maintaining some common sense.

	18-05-2003 20:36									#25
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DL!

CaptainObvious: your opinion is noted... wrong... but noted nonetheless

Lincoln: I wish more people had an intelligent approach to this issue like yourself.

	18-05-2003 20:53									#26
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I believe terrorists can come easily to country if they want. The dangerous ones are smart, so I don't think it's even possible to screen them out, majority will get in. It's easy to come to the US. Border control measures only makes things harder for normal people, but I'm sure some terrorists will get caught there too. I mean, just fly to Canada and drive to the US or something, or take a direct flight. No problem. These guys can get real (not forfeit) passports of other countries and if they just fly with few connection flights... or south-america, and then drive through Mexico. It's impossible to stop these guys from entering the country unnoticed. Effort should be made to do it of course and is done. But .... it's tough, if not impossible.

	18-05-2003 20:55									#27
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But border control has other important uses, so I'm not saying they should stop it.

	18-05-2003 22:07									#28
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quote: The dangerous ones are smart, so I don't think it's even possible to screen them out, majority will get in

True.....but dont you agree that if we shut down the borders and it stops just 1 terrorist from coming in, it will be worth it???

	18-05-2003 22:27									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Sava I think the immigration scare is just another boogey man that is an excuse for some to push an anti-immigration agenda. With the proper controls and system in place, the US could track immigration. The immigration "problem" isn't with the number of people coming in... it's with the government's ineptitude and lack of action to control and document the people. Proportionally, the number of immigrants coming in is much less than it was in the early 20th century. But yet now, it's a huge problem?? Back then, the US government was dedicated to controlling and documenting the endless flow of immigrants... but now, people are unwilling to spend the necessary money to get the job done. And that leaves us at risk to terrorism. That should have been the lesson of 9-11... 9-11 happened because the government and the airline industry didn't want to spend the money to keep us safe and do the job right. Frankly, I couldn't justify saving money if it put people's lives at risk, but unfortunately, that is what the fiscal culture of this nation has become. A trade-off... lives for dollars. The solution is to channel immigration into efficient ports-of-entry that control and document the flow of immigration. We had such a system once. It was able to do more with much less than we have now. But our government seems unwilling to spend the money necessary to ensure that the citizens of the US and those yearning to be free are kept safe. If 9-11 didn't wake people up, I shudder to think what it's going to take for people to realize the problem and how to solve it. As I said before, shutting off immigration and closing our borders isn't an option. It goes against the foundations that this Democracy was founded on. I find it odd that the courageous people in our Armed Forces are willing to die to protect freedom, but yet government officials and taxpayers are unwilling to spend money to protect the very thing that so many are willing to die for.

It was easier to control back when most immigrants required trans-oceanic liners to get here. Making a profit out of transporting them required a large ship, and there were only so many ports capable of handling these vessels. Good old fashioned racism kept the flow of immigrants from Mexico to a minimum. Air travel poses a problem too, because huge numbers of people arrive on a daily basis. The journey no longer takes a week to ten days. Also consider that some of the control measures used at the turn of the century would be illegal or impractical now. Back then you could keep the hordes of second class passengers detained on a small island for as many days as it took to process them, while allowing first calss passengers to waltz on through to the main land. Today you coudn't do that.

Anyway, I truly doubt that the US would ever be willing to set its quota as high as latin Americans would like, so there would still be some border jumpers no matter what.

	18-05-2003 22:55									#30
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With Mexicans there's the additional, usually ignored, problem of the southern shadow economy. A lot of business is dependent on taking advantage of illegal immigrants, and taking them away would cause serious trouble.