19-05-2003 12:59									#1
	The Sea Awaits Us... Full PM-box? Change here!

With MapMaking so close, we should start to think of our naval plans.

CDG is in no position to build boats. We'll have MM faster than GCA and/or CFC.

There is a slight problem: on a computer generated map, the western part of the map is always covered with ocean. The continent that we're on is probably bordering that ocean on the east side (wrapping around the map slightly).

We therefore need to go west.

To do this, we need a city on the coast. Horsetown would be the number 1 choice, since Incensity is on the wrong side of the continent.

Let's build Horsetown and pre-build a galley there. We can complete it as soon as we discover MapMaking, and get an advantage in exploring over the other civs.

Remember: first contact with the civs on the other side of the world is priceless. They might even be coming our way as we speak, and we'll want to be the first to greet them.

Maybe there are islands with goody huts and resources...

A border treaty with CDG would complement this plan nicely - we could focus on building cities and send out some galleys safely.

	19-05-2003 14:48									#2
	Re: The Sea Awaits Us... Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by BigFurryMonster Remember: first contact with the civs on the other side of the world is priceless.

Yes, definitely. It is sometimes tought to take your mind off the "here and now" of our continent, but building a Galley instead of another Merc. could potentially be the best use of 30 Shields in the entire game.


Dominae

	19-05-2003 14:59									#3
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

This sounds like a good plan, Lets build HorceTown an start to prebuild an ship.
The "Princess of Apolyton" needs to be build.

	19-05-2003 16:09									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

We'll need to name the city "Horse-by-the-Sea", IMHO.

edit: "Seahorse" would also be appropriate, of course.

Last edited by BigFurryMonster on 19-05-2003 at 16:17

	19-05-2003 16:14									#5
	Put an end to popups!

"A" galley? Nono. You build two galleys. One to go THIS-a-way (points west) and one to go THAT-a-way (points east) around the continent. Even if you turn out to be right about the nature of the land mass and ocean, it might still be very useful to find out what is along our eastern shore... the ol' "I see Sea threading its way through the ocean into the distance" routine. It would also let the two nations south of us know we have naval ability, which might make their MoWs sleep that much less comfortably at night.

A question for the FAM boys: There any loophole or negotiation trick (or indeed just giving them the finger and doing it) we can arrange ahead of time to slip some boats past them to the south?

	20-05-2003 16:08									#6
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We'll have an opportunity to build a galley soon. Incensity, our coastal town, will have finished an Archer in 3 turns. Also, it will have grown to size two, possibly yielding a production of 4 shields per turn.

We'll discover MapMaking in 11 turns (maybe a little faster if there are some other pop expansions).

So -- we can have a galley in 12 turns, right? That would give us a head start in exploring. The only problem is that the galley should go round the northern tip of our continent, which will cost some time. On the other hand, maybe it'll find some islands on the way.

I'd like to hear our government's opinion on this one.

	20-05-2003 16:28									#7
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BFM, Incensity will be hopefully switching to Barracks before finishing that archer - unless Morris stubbornly remains sitting on that iron and we decide to take him out (in which case, we finish the archer).

Considering this, Incensity is not really the best place to build galley(s) - a galley instead of the archer/barracks would be "done" too soon, galley after barracks would be sort of wasting the effects of the barracks.

Maybe if we have to finish that archer, galley might be a reasonable option then.

Otherwise, I assume we shall build the galley in Stalliongrad (aka Seahorse, aka Horsetown).

I would like to hear MoI on the issue of galley builds - where does your plans show it/them being built, E_T? Any chance to have two of them without significantly compromising our land military?

	20-05-2003 17:58									#8
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* MrWhereItsAt would jump at the chance of an overseas trip...

I was actually thinking of this sort of thing myself, but just not coherently enough to do anything about...

I think this would be great, as it opens up new opportunities. All we need is one Galley and a warrior to go exploring and we have the potential for much gold and interesting citysites awaiting us.

I hope this can be worked in ASAP.

	20-05-2003 23:34									#9
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I'll leave the timing to the MOI. I feel we can allow Horse City to build 1 Galley to go west, but I feel that building another to go east (and uncover new land in 20+ turns after the Galley is built) would be more of an investment than we'll really want to make.

	20-05-2003 23:47									#10
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For once, I'm going to have to totally disagree, Trip. While the first 20 turns might reveal nothing new, for all we know turn 25 could reveal a new Civ. An investment is just that- something that pays off over time. Not building the second galley simply because it won't pay off "right away" is woefully shortsighted. If we wait until later, then one of the other civs could already have built a boat and headed down that way, to reap the rewards of whatever is to be found down there- contacts, huts, whatever.

I would argue that our FIRST boat should actually head EAST- that's the only place we can expect immediate 'exploration competition.' West, on the other hand, we'll have more time to get ready for. I'm eyeing Incensity and thinking that should get a boat built.... it's far more important to blow by CDG/GCA to the south, and explore beyond them first.

	20-05-2003 23:52									#11
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With my proposal that we attack CDG in ~40 turns, any shields we spend on Galleys are shields we could have spent on destroying CDG. That is why I disagree.

If we were planning on peace for another 100 turns, then I would agree. But I am not acting under such an assumption.

	20-05-2003 23:55									#12
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Just saw that thread. If we ARE going to war, then yes, I withdraw my objection. Going to post thoughts there shortly.

	21-05-2003 00:02									#13
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Trip With my proposal that we attack CDG in ~40 turns, any shields we spend on Galleys are shields we could have spent on destroying CDG. That is why I disagree. If we were planning on peace for another 100 turns, then I would agree. But I am not acting under such an assumption.

Check out the Consuls' "long-term plan"; we are planning to remain at peace with CDG as long as possible (until the Medieval age).

We need to work together here. If you think we should attack, please post try to convince the team otherwise and post a poll. It will do no good if the MoW is planning to go to war while the Consuls are expecting peace.


Dominae

	21-05-2003 05:52									#14
	Put an end to popups!

Sorry for a somewhat superfluous post, but D*MN it is hard to catch up around here.

	25-05-2003 03:28									#15
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This issue is becoming relevant again, since we will not need an Archer in Incensity now.

I suggest to build a Barracks in Tripoli, and use Incensity for a Galley and some regular units.

	25-05-2003 03:34									#16
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Sorry BFM, but I think the Barracks in Incensity makes more "cense" ( )

The Galley should be built in HorseTown, IMO.

	26-05-2003 12:58									#17
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

There's even 3 possibilities now for the build in Incensity:

Galley, NM, or Barracks.


I still think we should have a Galley shortly after we have discovered MM. We haven't even founded Horse-by-the-Sea yet...

	26-05-2003 13:33									#18
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I am currently thinking a merc in Incensity, followed by a galley, with another galley in HorseCity would be best for our overall prospects.

	26-05-2003 14:28									#19
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hi ,

so when are we going to send out a galley with a settler and a NM , ......

any plans for that yet

have a nice day

	26-05-2003 14:31									#20
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I doubt sending out a settler would be a good idea. I think founding cities close to our capital will have priority. Maybe we shouldn't even take a warrior with us (or maybe we can pick up BFW on the way west).

	26-05-2003 14:53									#21
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by BigFurryMonster I doubt sending out a settler would be a good idea. I think founding cities close to our capital will have priority. Maybe we shouldn't even take a warrior with us (or maybe we can pick up BFW on the way west).

hi ,

, untill a nm can be send there it seems a good idea , .....

have a nice day

	26-05-2003 14:56									#22
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A merc on each boat is awefully tempting... Think of the huts. Think of tipping one for a free Philosophy or Literature... hmmm

What the heck would we do with a free settler?

	26-05-2003 15:25									#23
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither A merc on each boat is awefully tempting... Think of the huts. Think of tipping one for a free Philosophy or Literature... hmmm What the heck would we do with a free settler?

hi ,

, we should see what we can get with this , map , good places , who knows , maybe we find an "uber isle" on our shores , ....

we should send out a couple ships with settlers and nm's , ....

who knows what goodie huts lay on foreign shores , ....

NYE , would you want to work out a plan ?

have a nice day

	26-05-2003 15:59									#24
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I don't care if we found the Dancing Buddha, the Golden Fleece, and seven virgins on an island, we wouldn't be able to get a thing from any island city because of corruption. Wasting a settler like that would be silly. We don't need any resources at the moment either. A BIG for a very pointless waste of a settler.

	26-05-2003 17:58									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Fried-Psitalon I don't care if we found the Dancing Buddha, the Golden Fleece, and seven virgins on an island, we wouldn't be able to get a thing from any island city because of corruption. Wasting a settler like that would be silly. We don't need any resources at the moment either. A BIG for a very pointless waste of a settler.

hi ,

the same was said a long time ago for uber isle , ....

as for rescoures , you never have to many , .....

as for waste , thats why there are courthouse , policestations and factories to produce more , ....

it would be a waste to leave a goodie hut , ....

have a nice day

	26-05-2003 22:44									#26
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quote: Originally posted by panag hi , the same was said a long time ago for uber isle , .... as for rescoures , you never have to many , ..... as for waste , thats why there are courthouse , policestations and factories to produce more , .... it would be a waste to leave a goodie hut , .... have a nice day

Irrefutable proof that Darwin was wrong.

	26-05-2003 22:56									#27
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by notyoueither What the heck would we do with a free settler?

Carry him on an around the world trip....

E_T

	27-05-2003 01:40									#28
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Although I disagree with the whole Courthouse, Police Station, etc. idea, panag is on to something concerning resources...specifically Luxury resources. If an island is within coastal distance from our main continent, it would well be worth the cost of a rushed Harbor and a little defense to set up a Luxury "colony" there. Since we currently see 2 Luxury resources (do we see Furs, too?), and since warmongering is not going to happen that soon, we're going to feel the unhappiness pinch pretty soon.


Dominae

	27-05-2003 02:05									#29
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Fried-Psitalon Irrefutable proof that Darwin was wrong.

hi ,

no , its proof that some people want to know everything better while they are actually wrong , ....

its intresting to see that till this very day we have people in the demo game who still dont know a thing or two about the game , ....

there are even some who have no idea what a lux resource does , there are those who believe that all you need is one ( proof in a pm ) , there are those who believe that battleships can see subs , there are those who believe a settler can be split up in two workers , ....

etc , .....



this is a game without any personal remarks or insults or speculations for that matter , .... but some people seem to forget that , .....

have a nice day