23-05-2003 18:59									#1
	Is this demo game dead? Got spare money?

The computer didn't kill us.
Lack of participation did.

We have only two people running officially for positions in the government, and two more who have expressed interest.

There have been 3 posts in the last 20 hours or so, two of which are by me.

There has been only one chat in the last 10 days. No new chats are scheduled.

So, vote what you think. Is this game dead? If so, does it have a chance of being resurected?

Post your thoughts and comments.

	23-05-2003 19:41									#2
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Yes, but step aside while I attached these nodes...CLEAR! ZAP!

With the plethora of Demo Games now, there is stiff competition for participation. I believe this game presents us with a great challenge though, I and would like to see it continue. Don't we want the recognition of being the only site to win a Diety level DG?

	23-05-2003 19:52									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

The game was intended IIRC to bring new people into the world of demo games as most of the big players had passed into the ptw demo games.

I think the deity level has probably put off new demo gamers as it requires such elitism and seriousness.

Perhaps if the game had been on king level more new people would be involved as it would mean more role play etc and generally more fun.

The SPDG can only survive with a large turnover of players more fun and less seriousness is needed.

	23-05-2003 20:06									#4
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I mean there is alot of joking around but not concerning the actual game.

We couldn't decide to go and destroy the otts for attacking us, to teach them a lesson as we'd get screwed. Deity doesn't give us any freedom to do what we'd like.

	23-05-2003 20:11									#5
	Put an end to popups!

I agree with OPD. Deity level killed it.

	23-05-2003 20:14									#6
	Got spare money?

Here's what's going on:

1. Spring classes at Universitys ended during the past three weeks.

2. This monday is Memorial Day in the US, the unoffical begining of summer here. Some people may have decided to start their Memoiral Day vacation early. Others may stay late. Still others may be planning trips in June.

	23-05-2003 21:50									#7
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

hi ,

maybe we could make a poll ' restart or not ' , .....

have a nice day

	23-05-2003 23:26									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I can only speak for myself.

Connection problems at home, unexpected forced move at work (does the AF ever plan ahead?), and family problems have led to my absense.

I think RoN, school getting out, and the PTW games have something to do with the larger picture right now too.

	24-05-2003 00:27									#9
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

RoN + RL issues. sorry guys

	24-05-2003 01:49									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

My intent was to hold one more chat this week, but it looks like that won't be all that possible. I've had midterms this week and next week, plus this memorial day weekend where quite a few of us people in the US will be on small vacations.

I also have a geology field camp next weekend as well, so this has really killed my ability to hold a turn chat this next week! :-/

I believe MrWIA will soon be "out of the office" for awhile as well. So turnchat wise, this next week is definitely going to be dead.

The thing is, despite being Deity, it's a challenge and a lot of us "noobs" can learn strategies to play, that's what is so great. I learned a lot from the first Demo game and I'm unbelievably surprised that we've survived.

Anyways, it sounds like a lack of interest in general and I personally don't know how to explain it. It can't be RoN, because, well after having bought it (and realizing it's pretty much just like every other RTS already out there), I've concluded that Empire Earth is better :-P

Ah hem. Anyways... I wouldn't want this game to die, but certain aspects of this game are also time consuming and I know a lot of people aren't willing to put that much into it which is understandable.

	24-05-2003 03:00									#11
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I want to participate as a poster, but I've been waiting for more info on the game. The PTW games are about who's backstabbing whom, I don't enjoy it as much as this.

We can have a good demo game with fewer participants.

	24-05-2003 03:04									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

DP

	24-05-2003 03:06									#13
	Remove this text

I want to participate as a poster, but I've been waiting for more info on the game. The PTW games are about who's backstabbing whom, I don't enjoy it as much as this.

	24-05-2003 06:49									#14
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I think that's the first time I've seen a triple post.

Seriously, thought, my experience with multimple other Democracy games suggest taht participation drops off in the second game. Just keep on perservering, advertising, etc. A nihilistic attitude by the players will SURELY kill this game.

	24-05-2003 07:21									#15
	Tired of ads?

I don't know what it is. I'm not sure if I would expect more at this stage, though; our strategy for the moment is pretty set: we're going for the Ottomans, and probably with more support than any SPDG I war ever had. So, no debate over what to do, for we're set on a specific war; but no action to draw people to chats or to the forum, either. Considering there's pretty much nothing to debate, I wouldn't be too surprised. The lack of candidates is odd, though.

Also, I've seen a far greater variety of turnchatters than forum posters in the SPDG. A lot of them are in the PTWDG; so, that may be killing SPDG participation too.

Whatever it is, we shouldn't declare the SPDG dead yet, not by a longshot. We now have one candidate for each position, and there's still time for more to sign up and make this an actual election; what's more, we had ~40 voters in the Otto poll; hopefully, they'll post and be more active once things heat up. Until then, we need to get through to the war; once that happens, I think we should see some more life around here. War always raised participation in the SPDG I, and I bet it'll be a similiar story here.

	24-05-2003 10:47									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

There are a couple of reasons for the drop off in participation, IMO:

It's Finals/Midterms.

Its Summer.

It's RoN/Gal Civ.

It's ISDG.

It's PTWDG I

It's PTWDG II

Finally:
It's almost hopless that we will win; we may survive, but that is not winning, is it?

	24-05-2003 10:59									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I'm a little lazy this days... But I'll be more active in one week or two.

	24-05-2003 15:44									#18
	Suffering from ads?

From the start it has been made clear that the pure gamers did not want to be bothered by the democracy, and that they wanted a big challenge. They have the public attracted by this definition.

	24-05-2003 17:48									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by BigFree There are a couple of reasons for the drop off in participation, IMO: ................................................... Finally: It's almost hopless that we will win; we may survive, but that is not winning, is it?

We can win... But only with (almost) permanent war, say our experts.

Perfectly adequate for Vikings...

	24-05-2003 20:12									#20
	Suffering from ads?

The game has hardly started! Give it a little time.

Most of bigfree's reasons are right on the mark

	24-05-2003 21:03									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by realpolitic I want to participate as a poster, but I've been waiting for more info on the game. The PTW games are about who's backstabbing whom, I don't enjoy it as much as this. We can have a good demo game with fewer participants.

hi ,

it aint the number of people , its the way some people act with others , when some elected people completely ignore a pm or an email , ......

when some people run of to an other site and talk and spread whatever comes to mind , the liitle clans that form , .....

that and a whole bunch of other things that make some people forget in the end what its all about , ... a game , and what you do with a game , you are supposed to have fun , .....

have a nice day

	24-05-2003 21:35									#22
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I'm back guys! (as RP guys would already know)

My thought on it is RoN + RL + Diety + Other DGs.

	24-05-2003 22:58									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Dead as Dillinger

j/k, I think we can win it... or get a little dignity as we go out. But maybe some do have a point about the difficulty level and the seriousness at such a level dissuading involvement.

But, also, I know my Deity level attempts have rarely been very successful. A win here could be a great learning experience, no matter how dogged it might be.

	25-05-2003 01:43									#24
	Get a bigger avatar today!

I don't think we are dead, either as the Vikings, or as a DG.

I am hopeful that things will pick up soon,

	25-05-2003 03:23									#25
	Tired of ads?

hi ,

twenty versus ten , ....

what would happen if someone where to ask ' restart ' , ....

have a nice day

	25-05-2003 04:54									#26
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I voted for Yeats - one of my favorite poets.

It ain't dead. There is a lot of competition - from both other games and RL stuff. The start was/is very interesting.

Play on!

I will sign up for a position.

	25-05-2003 19:24									#27
	Remove this text

I'm very concerned with the team DG in which I am Pope and thus have a time-eating job.
The ISDG has, thanks to ET, attracted me again and I'm planning to participate more in it.

I have too little lime to participate in three games with an important position in at least one of them.

I'll look from the sideline to this one and perhaps post now and then, but not very often.

Perhaps it also counts for this game: heavy debates between political parties and al lot of roleplay help us to regain participation.

I encourage the existing members to refound the DIA and battle with the warmongers.

Aidun

	27-05-2003 04:42									#28
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Two words =

School's over!!!!!!!!!!

Instead of being busy with work to do, I'm swamped with plans for summer (summer jobs, road trips, making sure I hang out with H.S friends at leats once to at least make it seem we're still friends... ) I'm sure other college students are having the same issues too, which is why you probably saw participation dropping. But Im sure it will pick up eventually. Just hang in there.

	27-05-2003 06:02									#29
	Increase Your PM Length

From my experience not in demo games but in real life, as long as you have a small core of dedicated people, that's all that counts. There's a saying, "things are best resolved in a committe of three people, two of which are always absent".

If other people don't participate perhaps they should say precisely why they don't want to. Like Aidun said, it's impossible for most people to have important jobs in every DG. That's why I just lurk here!