27-05-2003 20:56									#1
	The Great Terraforming Plan Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I was playtesting an idea the other day, and it worked fantastically, it get's the moet mins, nuts and energy of any plan I know of, although it is former intensive.

The idea is to get as many boreholes as possible, which are worked, giving massive energy and minerals, and then farm/condense much of the rest, which is crawled, giving much nuts. It is terraforming intensive, but with the WP, and 2 formers per base, shouldn't be that bad. In any case, until we get the WP, I tried playing where squares to be farm/condensed are farmed (and sometimes solared) and squares to be boreholed are forested. This gives nuts, mins and energy early on, while making the later, better terraforming quicker (farms already built).

The most boreholes inside base areas we can get, while getting all Mineral and as many Energy resources as possible, and not boreholing Nutrients (needed for farm/condenser) is 14. 5 near each base, with one between AP and PS overlapping. This gives plenty of room for farm/condensers, mines or anything else you may want. It requires some, although not too much lowering of gterrain, but with boreholes giving 6 energy on a normal square, we don't need solars for an energy park (need many echelon mirrors to get 6 per square). Here is a screenshot to show you what I mean.



The blue Bs are either one of the other, depending on what's in the pod.

I have playtested this many times, along with others, and have found that nothing can beat it. It is former intensive, but we can start with forests and farms as per usual, and when we get the WP (would be really useful, although Eco Eng would also do it) we can start to create this. Any thoughts on it? DO you think it is good? Anything you would change? I can really attest to it's power. It is also one of the reasons why Archaic wins a lot, as he uses a similar system.

	27-05-2003 21:00									#2
	Inflate your Upload Space

BTW: This poll is not taking the place of other later polls, just whether to endorse it as an idea, incase we have no other poll, or just as a general plan.

Does not timeout, since new members can view and vote on it.

	27-05-2003 21:20									#3
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* Cedayon applauds.

Delightful exploitation, I must say.

The ED from all those boreholes and condensors will need to be countered by TFs/HFs (which do give nice econ/psych bonuses apart from forest bonuses, so probably worth building even without any forest).

One thing of importance: if we're going to get the WP, we're really going to need to pull out the stops, I think just about every other faction is at least going to try for it (keep an eye on those Drones, +2 industry can be amazing).

	27-05-2003 23:15									#4
	Inflate your Upload Space

Yes, I will poll for that, but IMHO, we need it. And dammit, if we need it, we will get it If only the mins nr Omega Terminus (Logic Loop from next turn) was on rocks, those 7 mins could be great. I think let's build it straight after formers in AP, and get Ind Auto ASAP, and crawler it.

	27-05-2003 23:47									#5
	Got spare money?

I like your enthusiasm, and I have nothing against boreholes in general, but isn't it a bit early to be planning this? After all you're not even sure at all we can get the Weather Paradigm. Just look at the Drones who are already constructing their first SP and may soon switch to the WP. Personally I think we should aim for the HGP.
Also I don't like that borehole on that rainy mineral bonus, and neither that borehole on the river source near Logic Loop. If that river dries up, we might actually lose energy.

	28-05-2003 00:16									#6
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Maniac: With about 6 or 7 condensers per base, it won't dry up. I have never had a river dry up doing this, since there are always more condensers than boreholes, I generally find the whole place turns rainy. And it isn't too early, I generally do this right at the begining of any game, so I know where to farm/forest early on. I think the WP is far more important than the HGP personally, as with this and FM, we can have GAs everywhere, with inordinate amounts of energy. If the drones make the WP, we should steal IMHO.

	28-05-2003 01:06									#7
	Increase Your PM Length

I guess I'll trust your judgement then. Though I think it will be impossible to pop-boom without the extra talent from the HGP.

What's your plan for getting the WP btw? We'll need start on it pretty soon if we want to have a decent shot at it.

	28-05-2003 01:13									#8
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I was thinking starting it after a former in AP (maybe two), going all out for minerals and trying to get Ind Auto ASAP, thus meaning we can set other bases to crawl to get it. Are we allowed crawler upgrades? Can't remember what we voted for

	28-05-2003 01:55									#9
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yes - crawler upgrades are acceptable

(I gave the AI a few each - fusion, drop, trance, silksteel - lurking till 2250 to help them rush some SP's)

just kidding

GG.

	28-05-2003 02:04									#10
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That scared me for a second

There we have it, crawler upgrades, so money and Ind Auto, si the way to go. And Planned, for the +1 industry.

	28-05-2003 03:25									#11
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quote: (I gave the AI a few each - fusion, drop, trance, silksteel - lurking till 2250 to help them rush some SP's)

My jaw was already on the floor before I read "just kidding".

	28-05-2003 05:04									#12
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I've never played a borehole-intensive game... do the TF/HF really counteract the effects of so many boreholes!?

	28-05-2003 05:34									#13
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yes they do. have you read the revised eco damage formula? ( i don't have time to look for it right now, maybe later)

BTW, thanks for doing this for me drug, as i said somewhere else, i've been having connection problems

	29-05-2003 03:10									#14
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Corellion: Hybrid forests wipe out completely ED from terraforming, and you only get it from minerals and population. Also, with a few early pops (without worms) the clean mineral levelm is raised enough. I will post a game I've been playing soon (transcend, solo) to show you how it works. I have 12 bases, about about 40 boreholes, and that's with them close together, on an island (so much sea squares). I have 5 or 6 bases that can produce a large SP in less than 20 turns, and 2 can do it in less than 10. This is only about 120 yrs into it

	29-05-2003 06:38									#15
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Wow! Impressive! I may have to adopt this strategy myself.

	28-07-2003 01:43									#16
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May I suggest as a general terraforming rule that we won't plant forest on a rainy square as long as there are also moisty or arid unforested squares in the neighbourhood? It seems a bit "inefficient" to me to first forest eg an already relatively productive rolling & rainy before anything else, especially since the rainy squares will probably be among the first to be condensed later on.

	28-07-2003 05:12									#17
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Seems to make sense, special circumstances should always be taken into consideration.

	28-07-2003 23:22									#18
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Sounds fine. Though if a Tree Farm is built, it might be a good idea. But yes, a general rule as such seems sensible.