28-05-2003 12:12									#1
	My first scenario - help needed! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Hi,

I'm working on my first Civ3 scenario and before I'm finished I have a few questions.

1. How do I make a portion of the map visible to a certain civ/player, without posting lots of units and/or cities in the relevant places? It is important, but not vital to the scenario.

2. What exactly does a victory point does? How does it affect winning the game? I have placed several of them in the area that the human player must reach. This is why I needed to reveal some parts of the map.

3. This scenario is based on Marla Singer's world map. If I'm breaking some copyrights or something, someone please let me know.

	28-05-2003 13:11									#2
	Inflate your Upload Space

1. Can't be done.... Maybe by placing outposts.

2. Victory Points are gaind from holding Victory Locations, or capturing princesses. You gate 25 VP/turn from a location helb by a unit with defense and 1000 VP from capturing a unit.
Normally you win when you reach 10000 VP.

	28-05-2003 13:58									#3
	Put an end to popups!

Thanks.

An outpost might do the trick. I don't care if it's destroyed later, as long as the map they reveal stay that way, even with fog of war.

I thought Victory Locations worked similar to the Objective City flag from Civ2. So it might not be such a good idea to put 5 of these in cities held by the AI if I won't be able to capture them quickly.

Also, another thing: can I set relationships between civs from the editor? "My" civ starts far away from everyone else, but I want it to already be at war with 2 others that currently hold the 5 cities mentioned above.

The idea behind my scenario is that the Babylonians have been driven away from Mesopotamia by the Indians and the Egyptians and are only left with a small town in Central America. The purpose is to reclaim the 5 lost cities. The scenario begins in 1500 BC with Babylon holding only the town in Central America (no American, Iroquois or Aztec civs) and the map revealed all the way to Mesopotamia. The only advantages I gave Babylon is a slight tech lead and a lot of goody huts nearby.

This comes from one of my first king/emperor games of Civ1, where I used the exploit of sending a trireme along the southern edge of the map to get to Cantral America, and the first goody hut I walked into revealed a town. I always wondered if it is possible to recover from such a loss. I abandoned that game when Egypt started landing Knights from triremes in South America shortly before 1 AD.

	28-05-2003 19:20									#4
	Put an end to popups!

The editor doesn't allow initial diplomacy to be set up.

	29-05-2003 02:03									#5
	Re: My first scenario - help needed! Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Dr. A. Cula Hi, I'm working on my first Civ3 scenario and before I'm finished I have a few questions.

You're never finished, there will always be something you want to change.

	29-05-2003 11:53									#6
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Gramphos: Too bad about diplomacy. I guess then Babylon will be isolated at least until Astronomy.

Willem: I guess you're right.

Well, the good news is I have a playable version, but the bad news is I can only post from work and I forgot the file at home.

The idea to use outposts to reveal the map worked, the problem is, without the posibility of setting up diplomatic relations in the editor, I ended up trading techs with my arch-enemies, which should not happen in this scneario. Also, I found out that if the outposts survive the first turn, their presence near enemy territory counts as making contact. I corrected this by placing barbarians next to the outposts. If they get destroyed before my second turn is up, I don't make contact with anyone.

After playing a few turns, I decided to give Babylon a few more bonuses. After all, they start with a size 1 town on a hill, surrounded by jungle, while everyone else has a lot of cities and some infrastructure. The tech lead was just not enough, so I also gave them 1 spearman, 2 workers and 2 scouts, as "refugees" from the old empire. I also added a lot more goody huts around them, "rumours" of other refugess that made it on their own. Babylon is about to exit from the ancient era, missing only Construction, Monarchy and Republic, while everybody else is at least 2 techs away from getting any of these. Also, I gave them a lot o gold, to maintain the units they start with until they develop their country a bit more.

I don't know if it's a good idea, but I lowered corruption for all difficulty levels except Deity, which runs at normal corruption.

Also, I have noticed that Marla Singer's map doesn't have horses in America, a detail I had missed so far. This will make it harder to build a decent invasion force before tanks, so I allowed for a new end to the scenario: instead of invading Mesopotamia to claim what is yours, you can also just build a better civilisation in the New World and go for a cultural or space race victory. Partly, I did this because I didn't know how to include a new victory condition: end scenario in victory for the human if it captures some cities.

I'm sorry if my post is a little long.

	29-05-2003 12:24									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Dr. A. Cula ... the problem is, without the posibility of setting up diplomatic relations in the editor, I ended up trading techs with my arch-enemies, which should not happen in this scneario.

Be patient, it sounds like the next expansion will allow for diplomatic control in a scenario.

Sadly, another expansion will mean me having to redo my mod all over again. It's getting quite involved too, it will take a long time.

	30-05-2003 11:17									#8
	Increase Your PM Length

Ok, here it is. It's a huge map, so it takes quite some time to load.

A few notes: the outposts scattered across the map are there to reveal it. The nearby barbarians will destroy them in turn 1, to prevent contact with the AI before the possibility of a real invasion capaign.

Also, I have reduced corruption levels for the lower dificulty levels:

chieftain: 10%
warlord: 25%
regent: 45%
monarch: 60%
emperor: 80%
deity: 100%

100% being the normal corruption level experienced in PTW.

I played with it a bit and, for my skills, all the advanteges I mentioned just about even the playing field. If someone else could also play it and offer suggestions, please do.

Attachment: we shall return.1.0.zip
This has been downloaded 2 time(s).

	01-06-2003 02:42									#9
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

You might want to take a look at CDT.

Oh, and I suggest you post a new thread with the scenario if you want it moved to the files forum. It sohould be the first post...

However, if you still want it to be a in-development project yuo can keep it in this thread and keep the thread in creation.

	02-06-2003 12:09									#10
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Gramphos You might want to take a look at CDT. Oh, and I suggest you post a new thread with the scenario if you want it moved to the files forum. It sohould be the first post... However, if you still want it to be a in-development project yuo can keep it in this thread and keep the thread in creation.

Thanks, I'll look at it. It sounds interesting.

I'll keep working on that for a while, and see if I can set up any diplomatic relationships, though probably not this week.