29-05-2003 06:55									#1
	What's wrong with community policing? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I don't know how the cops are in the suburbs but here in philly, they are hardly great...

They never seem to be around when something serious is going on but they suddenly show up to harass people about minor crimes...

Sometimes i swear the true violent criminals never get arrested while the cops just go and mess with teenagers who smoke on the corner or be selling dimes... they get arrested, go to juvenile, then come right back out and do the same nonsense cause now they can't get a job with their records...

so while the cops are all doing that, somebody gets shot and nothing comes of it...

add in allegations of profiling and brutality and the police forces in the US are looking real bad...

would vigilantes do any worse?


thanks

	29-05-2003 06:58									#2
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citizens arrest, ever hear of it?

	29-05-2003 07:06									#3
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Space:

Un-armed citizens arresting violent criminals... nah...

	29-05-2003 07:10									#4
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so arm yourselves, OR you could take care of the petty thugs and drug dealers so the police would have no excuse to not arrest the violent ones. Unless you believe drug dealing is okay, in which case you're screwing yourself.

	29-05-2003 07:12									#5
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How hard is it to get a concealed weapons permit in Phily? Shouldn't be to hard for someone with a clean record.

	29-05-2003 07:15									#6
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Neighborhood watch is a good idea only when the police is incompetent and cannot protect the population satisfactorily (like it seems to be in your neighborhood).

When the police is competent, neighborhood watch most often means expeditionary judgements and 'justice', and often follow a few predjudices or the few directives of a charismatic leader by doing their job. This means a bad procedure, and this means the ignorance of the suspect's rights.

In Germany, there have been occurences of neighborhood watches in calm villages (where they were hardly useful), where the elderly living there called the cops anytime thay saw a stranger who 'looked suspicious' (i.e any stranger ). It made the village extremely unfriendly and was a waste of cop's time, as well as a problem for the trangers venturing there.

	29-05-2003 07:16									#7
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Oerdin:

i believe concealed weapons are illegal in philly. i may be wrong though.

	29-05-2003 07:19									#8
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Concealed weapons are illegal in most cities, unless you have a permit. You can generally inquire at your local police station or sheriff's department.

	29-05-2003 08:16									#9
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Vigilante Justice is pretty effective, but it gets out of control. It could get the cops to do a better job though. I think we should just pay cops more and hire more of them.

	29-05-2003 08:29									#10
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Most big cities start their cops off in the high 40s to low 50s and have them top out around 65-70. If you ask me that is pretty good pay for someone who just has a college diploma.

	29-05-2003 08:30									#11
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Vigilante Justice is useful in GTA, but that's about it.

	29-05-2003 08:31									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Most big cities start their cops off in the high 40s to low 50s and have them top out around 65-70. If you ask me that is pretty good pay for someone who just has a college diploma.

The pay should be whatever will bring in the good cops. Look at L.A.. I think they get decent pay, but they have a severe shortage.

	29-05-2003 08:37									#13
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D'oh. There's neighborhoods in LA where you don't want to go in anything less than a Bradley Fighting Vehicle.

The problem is if you want cops with brains - most people with brains wouldn't want to be an LA cop, unless they have some other motivation.

	29-05-2003 08:41									#14
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well looks like my boy and his idea of the Brown Panthers might be the only alternative to the police...

maybe in a couple years, i'll get me a gun and we can chase out the criminals.

	29-05-2003 08:44									#15
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat D'oh. There's neighborhoods in LA where you don't want to go in anything less than a Bradley Fighting Vehicle.

Now you're talkin'. We need about 500.

	29-05-2003 08:53									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer well looks like my boy and his idea of the Brown Panthers might be the only alternative to the police... maybe in a couple years, i'll get me a gun and we can chase out the criminals.

	29-05-2003 09:00									#17
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The problem is not with the police but with existing policies. For example, once you make drugs legal, most of these violent crimes would just vanish.

	29-05-2003 09:10									#18
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As I write this, a whole bunch of cops are staking out a local flat.

It seems they got a tip off about a drugs enforcer who had a gun... and when they went to arrest him, he pulled it out. So now there's like 200 cops, half of them tooled up, "segregating" one guy with a handgun.

Community policing in the UK is a political slogan. All too often the community cops get pulled off their beats to take up the slack elsewhere - especially in these times of "terrorist" alerts.

Personally, I'd like to see a 2 tier police force similar to France or the US - the local cops who know the area and the national cops who get assigned as trouble arises.

Shame it won't happen, but there you go.

	29-05-2003 09:28									#19
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quote: i'll get me a gun

	29-05-2003 09:33									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Cruddy It seems they got a tip off about a drugs enforcer who had a gun... and when they went to arrest him, he pulled it out. So now there's like 200 cops, half of them tooled up, "segregating" one guy with a handgun.

You guys don't have anything like SWAT teams? Maybe the SAS is needed

	29-05-2003 09:46									#21
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat D'oh. There's neighborhoods in LA where you don't want to go in anything less than a Bradley Fighting Vehicle.

martial law rocks

	29-05-2003 11:03									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger You guys don't have anything like SWAT teams? Maybe the SAS is needed

The official title for these police units is Tactical Support Groups. Essentially, they are ordinary police vehicles with a couple of MP-5 semis in the boot ("trunk" in US speak).

These cars are out on patrol every day. When there's a gun incident (mercifully, not every day in the UK) they concentrate on that one spot. Hence the reference to "half being tooled up to deal with 1 gun man".

The SAS are operationally limited in terms of law enforcement. The Home Office (boss of all police forces) has to hand operational control over to them. VERY rare - usually a case of political involvement. From what little evidence is out there, I understand that the operational troop is out on "exercise" every day of the year - just in case they're needed in a hurry. Very similar to the TSG behaviour.