03-06-2003 05:35									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Yes... so much better. 30 years of Long (if wasn't assasinated sooner) with a welfare state that Sweden hasn't seen yet, destroying our economy and letting the USSR win the Cold War. Perfect .

Ye of little faith! He did wonders for Louisiana. He probably could have moved the Soviets away from authoritarianism and stopped the cold war from happening. (OK, that might be going a bit far, but who knows...)

quote: Then again, Congress probably wouldn't have put up with it and would let him get anyting done.. unless Huey decided a coup and dictatorship would be nice... which is not too far off from what he did in Louisiana when he was governor.

Long did call up the militia to take control of New Orleans. Of course, the reason he did so is that his political opponents were not going to allow blacks to go to the polls. Putting down a bunch of crackers so that black people can exercise their right to vote sounds like the opposite of dictatorship.

The reason Huey gets a bad rap is because the same crackers who fly the Confederate Battle Cross in the name of their "Southern Heritage" won't forgive him for protecting the black franchise.

Huey Long is my Southern Heritage!

	03-06-2003 05:46									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Fez Also Templar, "Ike" Eisenhower was far more popular than any other politican during the 50s.. so it is unlikely your prediction would of happened if Long wasn't assassinated.

Ike would have been way later than Long.

Evil Empire

Oh, you mean the one that occupied the land and proceeded to slaughter its original inhabitants with WMDs like small pox? The one that not only accounted for a large share of the slave trade and had slavery longer than any country save Brazil (and maybe Cuba). Oh wait! I forgot! The US are the good guys. You know, if the sh1t the US pulled in the 18th and 19th century would have been crimes against humanity the 20th century.

Keep talking Fez - Argentina is known for the biggest magic trick in the 1980s - they made thousands upon thousands of people disappear.

Another rogue right-wing regime brought to you by the US.

	03-06-2003 05:50									#33
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quote: Long did call up the militia to take control of New Orleans.

He did more than that. He basically ran Louisiana like a Czar, building a political dynasty based on graft and corruption. He gained control of different boards and commissions by basically forcing those people out (bribing them in some cases) and putting his own folks in. He also forced state employees to distrubute his own newspaper.

Hell, even some Communists refered to him as a fascist, doing what Hitler was doing in Germany .

	03-06-2003 06:06									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: Long did call up the militia to take control of New Orleans. He did more than that. He basically ran Louisiana like a Czar, building a political dynasty based on graft and corruption. He gained control of different boards and commissions by basically forcing those people out (bribing them in some cases) and putting his own folks in. He also forced state employees to distrubute his own newspaper.

The entrenched power structure in Louisiana wasn't going to let him change the state. Sure he had bust some heads, but those heads were wearing hoods if you get my drift. The reason the Longs built a political dynasty is because they tangibly improved the lives of the average people and adavanced equality and affirmative action.

Graft? No worse than anyone else in LA. But sure, that's a big negative mark on his report card as far as I'm concerned. Just look at Edwin Edwards and what he did to LA! (Don't drop that soap, Ed.)

But remember, its the good ol' boy network in LA that beats the anti-Long drum the loudest. Go talk to union workers (something that Long strengthened during his tenure), and ask them what they think.

quote: Hell, even some Communists refered to him as a fascist, doing what Hitler was doing in Germany .

All communists ever do is ***** and moan.

	03-06-2003 06:11									#35
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quote: The entrenched power structure in Louisiana wasn't going to let him change the state.

He sure made himself the entrenched power structure. Everything and everyone was connected to Good Ole' Huey. He had every position under his control and when he left, he handpicked his successor.

He'd have been a horrible President who would have made the court-packing scheme look tame by comparison.

	03-06-2003 06:25									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui He'd have been a horrible President who would have made the court-packing scheme look tame by comparison.

You mean to say that you wouldn't want to have Tammany Hall on a national scale?

Costello wasn't just a power-broker in New York City. He was friendly with Huey Long, described by Carl Sifakis as the "best political friend the mob ever had."
http://organizedcrime.about.com/lib...ocpoliticsa.htm

	03-06-2003 06:42									#37
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quote: Had Senator Long not been assassinated, he likely would have been president and the country would have been much better off.

Good God.

	03-06-2003 06:43									#38
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Roosevelt saved the US from Communism. Had he not at least given the impression that the government was doing all it could to put people to work, the Communist Party would have swelled and seized power. After all, a million people joined (and left) the Party during the 1930s. It's not fantasy to say that it might have happened.

If the world collapses into another great depression, there are only two ways out: world war or socialism. Take your pick. Just remember, this time, the sides are backed by nuclear weapons.

	03-06-2003 06:50									#39
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quote: Originally posted by The Templar Ike would have been way later than Long.

Well he would of been after Roosevelt, and after Roosevelt there was Truman.

quote: Oh, you mean the one that occupied the land and proceeded to slaughter its original inhabitants with WMDs like small pox? The one that not only accounted for a large share of the slave trade and had slavery longer than any country save Brazil (and maybe Cuba). Oh wait! I forgot! The US are the good guys. You know, if the sh1t the US pulled in the 18th and 19th century would have been crimes against humanity the 20th century.

I am not talking about what the US pulled in the 18th or 19th century. You are defaming the US for no reason. Well communists are usually like that. Spitting at the US and making fun of it. The US are the good guys. In fact it ended the slave trade before some European countries did.

quote: Keep talking Fez - Argentina is known for the biggest magic trick in the 1980s - they made thousands upon thousands of people disappear.

Little known to you that I am not even from Argentina, you bald headed assertion man.

quote: Another rogue right-wing regime brought to you by the US.

I am from Spain.. not American.

	03-06-2003 06:51									#40
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Roosevelt saved the US from Communism. Had he not at least given the impression that the government was doing all it could to put people to work, the Communist Party would have swelled and seized power. After all, a million people joined (and left) the Party during the 1930s. It's not fantasy to say that it might have happened. If the world collapses into another great depression, there are only two ways out: world war or socialism. Take your pick. Just remember, this time, the sides are backed by nuclear weapons.

World war.

And thank goodness the US did not get the communist party or everybody in the west would of been really screwed.

	03-06-2003 07:07									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Then again, Congress probably wouldn't have put up with it and would let him get anyting done.. unless Huey decided a coup and dictatorship would be nice... which is not too far off from what he did in Louisiana when he was governor.

	03-06-2003 11:34									#42
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quote: Yeah, too bad. He would have been great

You must be joking. Huey Long was the Rush Limbaugh of 1930s American politics.

In other words, he was a populist blow-hard who would have failed in any real leadership position other than the corrupt parishes of backwards Louisiana.

	03-06-2003 11:59									#43
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quote: Originally posted by mindseye quote: Yeah, too bad. He would have been great You must be joking. Huey Long was the Rush Limbaugh of 1930s American politics. In other words, he was a populist blow-hard who would have failed in any real leadership position other than the corrupt parishes of backwards Louisiana.

Rush Limbaugh is just an entertainer.

	03-06-2003 19:16									#44
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quote: Rush Limbaugh is just an entertainer.

Duh, exactly my point.

	03-06-2003 19:32									#45
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quote: Originally posted by mindseye quote: Rush Limbaugh is just an entertainer. Duh, exactly my point.

Did Long do a radio show?

	03-06-2003 19:45									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Fez That is just great... there was a senator like this? Some socialist in the US that would of never got elected anyways to the office of presidency anyways.

quote: Originally posted by Fez Also Templar, "Ike" Eisenhower was far more popular than any other politican during the 50s.. so it is unlikely your prediction would of happened if Long wasn't assassinated.

I love how Fez becomes an instant expert on Huey Long.

	03-06-2003 20:27									#47
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No expert. But Ike was by far the most popular politican of the 50s... and that I know.

	03-06-2003 23:18									#48
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Ike was no politician, but he was easily more popular than Long.

There is no way in hell Long would get elected. As a candidate you can't all up the militia to force minorities to vote for you.

	03-06-2003 23:20									#49
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My mistake, he was a General who was elected... not a career politican, just one that entered the elections.

And because of his successes in war, he was far too popular. Some say Ike could of ran for a third time and won. But the constitution didn't allow it.

	04-06-2003 00:04									#50
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Fez:

Can you name any of Eisenhower's foreign policy contributions?

	04-06-2003 00:06									#51
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quote: Originally posted by obiwan18 Fez: Can you name any of Eisenhower's foreign policy contributions?

Correct me if I am wrong on this one, but wasn't he the one who ended the Korean war?

Why you don't like Ike? Like most of the apolytoners in here?

	04-06-2003 00:33									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Fez I am not talking about what the US pulled in the 18th or 19th century. You are defaming the US for no reason. Well communists are usually like that. Spitting at the US and making fun of it. The US are the good guys. In fact it ended the slave trade before some European countries did.

Technically correct. The US ended the importation of slavery early on - but retained the institution long after almost every other nation abandoned it. And I can't be "defaming" the US because everything I said was true. Ask a Native American (if you can find one) if the US are the good guys.

quote: Little known to you that I am not even from Argentina, you bald headed assertion man. I am from Spain.. not American.

Your location says Argentina. Of course, every upper middle class conservative from Argentina (and South America in general) says they're really Spanish. But fine, Franco then you silly character from a 70s show.

	04-06-2003 00:35									#53
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I like Ike. I think he'd make a great communist.

	04-06-2003 00:38									#54
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you are incorrect if you think modern day native americans foster some deep resentment towards the U.S.

The past is the past, let it be. I don't harbour any resentment towards the germans, and that is much more recent history. And don't give me they were only following orders bullshit. They still killed millions of people in the concentration camps.

And really Ike didn't really do all that much while in office. But you can say he didn't screw things up either .

	04-06-2003 00:38									#55
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quote: Originally posted by The Templar Technically correct. The US ended the importation of slavery early on - but retained the institution long after almost every other nation abandoned it. And I can't be "defaming" the US because everything I said was true. Ask a Native American (if you can find one) if the US are the good guys.

Well I could go into the Spanish inquistion.. and talk about the evils of that. Or I could talk about different countries.. take Turkey.. about its slaugther of Armenians. But those eras are long gone. You now want to blame these past injustices on the current government and the country? Then do you spit at Germany today for having Adolf Hitler sixty years ago?

quote: Your location says Argentina. Of course, every upper middle class conservative from Argentina (and South America in general) says they're really Spanish. But fine, Franco then you silly character from a 70s show.

No, actually my location will soon be saying "Los Angeles, California". Will that mean I am American? No it does not. Nor does putting Argentina mean I am from here. But your own arrogance doesn't let you see that. I haven't been in Argentina for more than three years. Before that I lived in Ecuador. So stop acting like a fool and accept how things really are.

	04-06-2003 00:40									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel I like Ike. I think he'd make a great communist.

You wish. On your side they lack leaders. By the way Ike wasn't particularily fond of communism.

	04-06-2003 00:43									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui He sure made himself the entrenched power structure. Everything and everyone was connected to Good Ole' Huey. He had every position under his control and when he left, he handpicked his successor. He'd have been a horrible President who would have made the court-packing scheme look tame by comparison.

The Long machine entrenched itself by delivering to the people of Louisiana. They got the roads paved, the bridges built, affordable electricity got to the poor rural areas. Unions had a friend in the government. Long's predescessors entrenched themselves by playing identity politics, supporting the clan, and backing the wealthy sugar and port interests at the expense of everyone else. Huey earned his support.

Yes, the contracts for the bridges and roads went to cronies. But at least Long was getting those things built. Nor was his corruption any greater than anyone else at the time (and certainly no worse than the Bush administration). Yes his corruption should be condemned.

As for DinoDoc and "court packing", I would remind him that the threat of court packing was the only thing that forced the courts to quit stonewalling modernization of the bureacracy. And like Chegitz said - if the courts hadn't let FDRs programs through, communism would have won out here.

	04-06-2003 00:45									#58
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quote: And like Chegitz said - if the courts hadn't let FDRs programs through, communism would have won out here.

Then everybody would of been really screwed...

	04-06-2003 00:50									#59
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quote: Originally posted by The Templar Technically correct. The US ended the importation of slavery early on -

I won't even grant that much. The last slave ship to enter the US did so in the 1850s (IIRC). Despite the fact that the slave trade was illegal, in continued illicitly for almost forty years after, and probably would have continued if not for the Civil War and subsequent naval blockade of the South.

	04-06-2003 00:57									#60
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quote: The Long machine entrenched itself by delivering to the people of Louisiana.

Come on, you don't really believe this, do you? Huey entrenched himself by corruption. You may not think it was that much different that others, but Huey wasn't an idiot. He controlled more planning boards than other governor and basically controlled everything in the state. He put his cronies in everywhere and had a finger in every pie and made Tammany Hall look tame by comparision. Btw, every political machine gets where it is by 'helping out the people'. Yet it ain't like Tammany Hall gets a good reputation for finding jobs for immigrants or anything.