14-06-2003 02:49									#1
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I don;t know if that's the best title, but it's sorta Churchill and it's *emotionally* in line with where I want to go...

Fine, Beta wants to play his puppy games.

Fine, Togas likes to pour gasoline on fires.

Fine, the other teams are rightly threatened.

Uh, er... whatEVER!!!!

I wanna have some fun here, and maybe beat Beta, and whoever, at this new game called Civ3 PTW MP Diplomacy.

Some quick thoughts:

ROLEPLAY: Let's not try to herd the cats... let's have one official voice, and make clear that anything else is individual statement (with the usual disclaimers)... and then let the psychos out of the hospital!!!

Me - The psycho warmonger formerly know as Theseus. I'll disclaimer it, but I'm dying to go crazy.... Thulsa Doom, rivers of blood, Stalin / Lenin, Hussein, etc.

Sir Ralph - Nobody else could *possibly* play the role of righteousness and moral indignation. Think Prussian.

Arrian - Cold logic. Spock as a general. Or maybe Rumsfeld.

We need a Churchill!!

RHETORIC: Enough of this flowery diplo crap. We need the rhetoric of warfare. Let's liberally copy the great wartime speechmakers of history, especially the ones that just COMPLETELY go over the top... Caesar, Shakespeare, Lenin, Churchill, Castro and Guevara, HappySunshine.

(ROTFLMAO )

DIPLO AND DISCLAIMERS: All over the place, and perhaps special PMs to each team head (including Vox), letting them know that we are doing this. "Out" this whole ploy of Beta's, and thus start to defuse it. Maybe also, only the FAM does formal responses in other teams' threads, and the GS psycho's start our own trash talking threads (starting with Beta and Vox) . Follow much of the sympathizer's advice about checking in with the other teams more before major diplo things happen, not after. Let Ming know what we are doing, and make sure that whatever we do we keep it clean and in the context of game roleplay, not personal.

Our sympathizer is right... let's take our time, and diplomatically break things... slowly... carefully.


Those are just some quick notes... I gotta run, back in a few hours.

	14-06-2003 03:09									#2
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BREAK THE SYSTEM!
TEAR IT DOWN!!

Yes, I like it! It's unexpected, it'll drive them crazy, and best of all, it'll be FUN!!

	14-06-2003 03:41									#3
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If we can't cope with the current system, we can just break it. A new system may arise, one that we will adjust to better than the other teams, perhaps even dominate.
And I want us to hold LOADS of chats!

	14-06-2003 04:00									#4
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Chats are a good idea, methinks.

We can't undo the damage Beta has done to us in the past.

But we CAN learn from what he did to us.

-Arrian

	14-06-2003 04:16									#5
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OK, here's a first go... I figure start formally, and then I'll slowly begin to foam at the mouth. When we get going, I could see us even (fake)debating in public, about this being unauthorized, fracturing the team, yadayadayada.

But again, I don;t want to start posting until we have a multi-pronged and thought-out plan.
_____________________________

TO THE PTW DG TEAMS

As co-General of the Armies of Gathering Storm and Master of the Spartan Academy, I hereby announce the formation of the StormHawk Party.

Our founding principles are:

Duty
Honor
Country

Put simply, it is our duty to restore Gathering Storm's besmirched honor, and bring peace to ALL of Stormland.

We will not stand for dissembly, in public or in private. The dastardly Vox have used their political and diplomatic wiles once too often, and in the process have insulted the honor of all the civilizations in our world.

We will not stand for it.

In the history of nations, others have attempted to sway men's minds with promises, to play upon their fears, to offer seemingly cunning ways of gaining advantage.

Often, these rogues are brought out onto a public stage, for the world to unite in their censure and restraint. The StormHawk Party had hoped that the nations here would do so, and in fact further punish the offenders with a banishment to poor lands.

The diplomatic corps of Gathering Storm essayed a peaceful solution, reached out a helping hand to these Voxian fiends, just to be done with them as an immediate concern, and to let our economists re-direct this oh so Golden Age into more productive avenues. And what became of that helping hand? Slapped down and spit upon by virtue of Voxian intrigues and dissembly.

Neither of these solutions has happened, and now, given the repeated insults to Stormian honor, nor will they.

Again, we will not stand for it.

Let the words pour venomously from Voxian mouths, but also let all of the civilized nations of the world shake hands and embrace as brothers.

For the StormHawk Party is, as of now, and forevermore, committed to a regime change and the freeing of the peoples of Northern Stormland... and then Vox will be no more.

	14-06-2003 04:34									#6
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As MoDA, is it my job as a leader of the StormDove party to be as conciliatory as possible? Peace at all costs, compensate Vox for unjust their treatment?

Or should I isolate myself from these “antics “ All the while I will coordinate the real diplomatic front with a team of 5 ambassadors and an assistant FAM?

Mss

	14-06-2003 04:50									#7
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IF we do this right, and have fun with it, we can drive everybody CRAZY!!!

Your call, MSS, if you want to focus on the real diplo stuff... 1) yeah, it's a lot of time, and 2) you could certainly have a StormDove proxy or two.

	14-06-2003 07:01									#8
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Man, I hope the team wants to do what I'm suggesting, and let's me loose. Beta's avatar... a friggin' baboon... so much potential.

	14-06-2003 07:08									#9
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Well, that's a PTW Demogame II thing, but use it if you think you can get mileage out of it.

-Arrian

	14-06-2003 07:09									#10
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Upon posting that last thought, this is what I got from the Apolyton quote machine:

quote: I have discovered the art of deceiving diplomats. I tell them the truth and they never believe me. -- Camillo Di Cavour

-Arrian

	14-06-2003 18:11									#11
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GoW's talk of being mercenaries is interesting.....

What are the chances that we could pay them to publically criticise Vox and the way that vox has behaved. Then perhaps something about us being honourable and how we have every right to kick vox of Estonia.

	14-06-2003 18:33									#12
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That wouldn't be a mercenary, that would be a whore. No mercenary can sink so low. Oh well, maybe GoW can.

	14-06-2003 18:40									#13
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If GOW was 'honest'(big if) in the chat, their remarks aren't going to make alot of a difference anymore anyway.
They look to become the next one to be picked on, so...

	14-06-2003 19:03									#14
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That would be asking someone else to lie for us, which is against our code of honor I believe.

	14-06-2003 20:17									#15
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quote: That would be asking someone else to lie for us, which is against our code of honor I believe.

I would consider it borderline though, if not, we wouldn't ever be able to hire GOW if we wanted to (or neede to). Hmm, not sure on this one.

	14-06-2003 21:55									#16
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Given the further nonsense from Beta this morning, I would like to go ahead with the StormHawk post, subject to any edits or suggestions (perhaps address GoW / Lego in some way?.

Other things that need to happen:

* The FAM or the ambassadors need to contact each of the other teams, to let them know we have decided to spice up the game. This should be done with some humility about past diplo, and also be used to further our relations. I would suggest that zeit's idea about everyone getting Engineering cheaply from ND be pursued as well.

* One of the mods on the team should contact Mark and / or Ming, with two objectives. 1) We are spicing up the game, and want to make sure they know that this is all in fun, and we are committed to keeping it that way, nothing personal. 2) We can maybe use this as a PR opportunity: Get an article on the front page of 'poly about the "fractures" in GS, and the StormHawks' commitment to the destruction of Vox.

* It'd probably be good if some others are named as members of the StormHawk Party, we take on some titles, and post publicly accordingly (including SR's wonderful Frater Ralph bit... maybe SR puts that in his sig? ).

* I liked MSS' idea of a StormDove Party a lot!! I do think MSS has got his handful, so it would be good if we had some volunteers for this effort.

Beta continues to taunt us... let's f*ck him and everyone else up!!

	14-06-2003 22:09									#17
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All great ideas!

I think that NYE should contact Ming (Markos is too busy with other projects, I gather), though if he doesn't mind I can do it myself.
I'm tired right now, but later I can start working on a draft for a message to send to the other teams regarding the "fractures" within GS.

	14-06-2003 22:11									#18
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I would like to kick things off by sending (from me) the following two PMs:

1) To UnO:

Hey UnO,

I wanted to give you a confidential heads up... things are gonna get a bit more spicy / fun in the PTW DG, and you may want to put your writer's hat on.

Theseus

2) To GodKing:

Hey GodKing:

I wanted to give you a confidential heads up... things are gonna get a bit more spicy / fun in the PTW DG, and you may want to put file a report from the game with DanQ.

Theseus

	14-06-2003 22:31									#19
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1. Aren't we taking a big risk with this?

2. Is the timing right?

[/caution]

	14-06-2003 22:34									#20
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I will then post this on Beta's thread:

Enough.

I, joined by xx, xx, and xx, will no longer tolerate Vox, nor the back-room politicking that has been going on.

We have a simple, straightforward solution, and have thus formed the StormHawk Party.

Please see the announcement thread.
________

Ambassadors should, of course, continue the back-room politicking, within the limits of GS honor.

xx's I'd like to see, if it's ok with you guys, are Frater Ralph , Arrian, and DeepO.

	14-06-2003 22:50									#21
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I assume our simple solution is the total destruction of Vox? If so, I'm with you.

I've said as much already.

-Arrian

	14-06-2003 22:55									#22
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Frater Ralphus is at your service.

	14-06-2003 23:17									#23
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alva, while I share the concern that we go slowly, we just keep getting these PERFECT openings on the public thread.

Anyway, I'd rather do SOMETHING like this, rather than the ongoing debate in Vox' thread, which is getting more and more hawkish on our part anyway...

I figure the StormHawk initiative can't be too damaging, as it acts as a foil for the rest of the team, and can even provide plausible deniability for the supposed doves and, importantly, for our FAM and the ambassadors.

And again, I'm trying to have some fun!!

- Theseus, the soon to be rabidly-foaming-at-the-mouth-warmonger

	14-06-2003 23:23									#24
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Frater Ralphus rocks.

We should heed him more. He speaks with the wisdom of the gods.

-Arrian

	14-06-2003 23:25									#25
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Oh, another idea:

After the post in Vox' thread, one of our 'doves' should post something like, "Oh no, now you've gone and done. You got the wrong GSers very very mad. Buh-bye!!"

	14-06-2003 23:31									#26
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I've made a special avatar for this purpose. How's that?

	15-06-2003 00:47									#27
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Oh, I just saw the second image... that's great!!!

	15-06-2003 01:07									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber All great ideas! I think that NYE should contact Ming (Markos is too busy with other projects, I gather), though if he doesn't mind I can do it myself. I'm tired right now, but later I can start working on a draft for a message to send to the other teams regarding the "fractures" within GS.

Shiber, I'm going to wait until we have drafts reads for all the other teams.

Also, I'm going to draft a disclaimer as the second post in the StormHawk thread.

	15-06-2003 04:28									#29
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I'm gonna hurry things up a bit, as it feels like the Bay of Pigs out there. Time to re-direct the path of the discussion.

Uh, let's see, draft disclaimer:

DISCLAIMER

We of the StormHawk Party have been dismayed, as have many others, by the recent tenor and turn of events.

We do not personally condemn ANYONE or any team... we'd like to get the game re-focused on the game, and we believe that 1) a direct action by GS, 2) a little roleplay, and 3) a totally new element in the diplo discussions, namely StormHawk, should help everyone to move on, and get back to playing and having some fun.

That said, given our, uh, 'radical right' stance, we understand and are concerned that further public and private communications might continue to be tense. We are committed to maintaining the positive atmosphere of Apolyton in general, and ask that everyone involved stay equally committed (i.e., nothing personal... it's a game, let's have fun with it).

Lastly, we'd like to remind everyone that one of the reasons for the high degree of participation in the PTW DG was to prepare us for the ISDG. Again, let's get back to that on behalf of 'poly (sorry ND ), but we also believe that the introduction of political parties in a demo MP concept is a worthy experiment. Apolyton Spirit!!

So... we are the StormHawk Party, a new element to GS. Have at us!!

___________________

How's that?

	15-06-2003 04:37									#30
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It's fine.

In the chatroom are peace terms discussed. Time to spice things up a bit. Nevertheless will I take a nap first, it's past 1:30am here.