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Spiffor is offline Spiffor
Emperor
CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:29
Lightbulb  Old Post 18-06-2003 19:27
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Berlusconi will finally make it Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

From BBC :

quote:
Berlusconi on brink of immunity
The Italian parliament is set to give final approval to a law which would make make Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi immune from prosecution as long as he holds the job.

The decision, expected in the lower house of parliament, would almost certainly kill off a current corruption trial in Milan, at which Mr Berlusconi gave evidence on Tuesday.

The immunity law has already been approved by the upper house of parliament, the Senate, and is not expected to face any hurdles in the lower house, where Mr Burlusconi holds a comfortable majority.

The law bans any court proceedings against the holders of Italy's five most senior posts as long as they remain in office.

"It is not intended to suspend the trials once and for all, but to enable the top state officials to mount a better, calmer and thorough defence"
Francesco Nitto Palma
Forza Italia magistrate


It has been rushed through parliament in a move which critics say is designed solely to save Mr Berlusconi from facing a verdict in the trial.

The timing could have been particularly embarrassing, as Mr Berlusconi is about to lead Italy into its six-month presidency of the European Union.

If the bill is passed as expected, the Milan corruption trial will have to be halted until Mr Berlusconi has left office.

By then, too much time will have elapsed for a resumption to be legally possible. His current term of office runs out in 2006, but he may seek re-election.

In the Milan case, Mr Berlusconi is accused of trying to bribe judges to stop a business rival taking over state-owned food group SME in the 1980s.

Mr Berlusconi told the court yesterday that the charges against him were "fantasy".

A decision in parliament is expected later on Wednesday.

Italy's opposition parties are furious at the immunity plan, describing it as unconstitutional.

But supporters of the law say it makes Italian law similar to that in many other countries, and merely restores rights which were removed in the "Clean Hands" anti-corruption drive a decade ago.

"It is not intended to suspend the trials once and for all, but to enable the top state officials to mount a better, calmer and thorough defence" if they do go to court, said Francesco Nitto Palma, a magistrate and supporter of Mr Berlusconi's Forza Italia party.

Court challenge?

The opposition might take its case to Italy's Constitutional Court, but any ruling would take months to make.

Under the law, magistrates can investigate allegations against the five top figures, but cannot bring them to trial.

As well as the prime minister, the law also covers the president, the speakers in both houses of parliament and the president of Italy's constitutional court.

Mr Berlusconi is Italy's richest man, heading a multi-billion euro empire that encompasses broadcasting, banking, publishing and the AC Milan football club.

He says the corruption case in Milan is part of a left-wing campaign.

He likened the proceedings against him to a murder trial with missing key components.

"There is no body here, there is no murder weapon, there is no motive," he said.
Story from BBC NEWS:


I love it when politicians modify the law so that they are above the law. This law really fits my opinion of Berlusconi

BeBro is offline BeBro
King
of the Krauts
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 18-06-2003 19:30 Visit BeBro's homepage!
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Well, he told not only the charges against him were "fantasy", he also said it was an evil conspiracy against him.

So it must be true

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:29
  Old Post 18-06-2003 19:31 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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Hopefully the courts will strike it down.

Spiffor is offline Spiffor
Emperor
CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:29
  Old Post 18-06-2003 19:41
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Well, in France, it is actually the constitutional judges who pushed FOR Chirac to be protected from trials. I'm sure they can do this kind of things in Italy too

(My all-time favorite [The Economist[/i]'s cover was the one featuring Chirac and the "Liberty - Equality - Impunity" motto. I hope they'll find a witty cover for Berlusconi too )

Spiffor is offline Spiffor
Emperor
CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 18:48
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What ? Nobody wants to laugh / yell at Berlusconi for that ? Is this thing too typical Italian for you people to even bother ?

This guy has just changed the law for his individual profit (i.e get away with his corruption) and you don't care one bit ?

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
Emperor
Zhonghuà Rénmín Gònghéguó
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 19:12
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but isn't that undemocratic?


where are the EU armies marching into rome?

Sloth is offline Sloth
Warlord

Jul 1999
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 20:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Spiffor
Nobody wants to laugh


unfortunately it's no laughing matter

Wernazuma III is offline Wernazuma III
Emperor
Decolonize!
Aug 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:28 Visit Wernazuma III's homepage!
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The extraordinary shamelessness of Berlusconi is how open he hijacks politics for his private interests and still he'll proabably win the next elections although he polarizes so much.
It really enrages me how furious all Europe acted when Austria got Haider's party into the government. I hate our current government, but it shows the double standards with which Europe operates. At least our government has not attacked the legal state or democracy yet, Berlusconi does both of it and Europe keeps silent.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:32 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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haider was a racist fascist berlusconi is a fully corrupted clown. maybe that explains it.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
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Oct 2000
time: 07:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:34 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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on that matter the EU should have started proceedings against the amazing concentration of media power berlusconi holds.

it would be prefectly legal too.

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
Emperor
Zhonghuà Rénmín Gònghéguó
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:34
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Wernazuma, please... maybe you should just stop voting for Jörgiboy and join the democratic millions, then you might understand why nazis get boycotted and corrupt conservatives don't.

Not that Berlusconi wouldn't support fascism... he just hasn't been as open about it as Jörgi...

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
Emperor
Zhonghuà Rénmín Gònghéguó
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:35
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paiktis -

Wernazuma III is offline Wernazuma III
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Aug 2000
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  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:44 Visit Wernazuma III's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Ecthelion
Wernazuma, please... maybe you should just stop voting for Jörgiboy and join the democratic millions, then you might understand why nazis get boycotted and corrupt conservatives don't.
Not that Berlusconi wouldn't support fascism... he just hasn't been as open about it as Jörgi...


What? I'm voting for the green party, so stop trolling. Haider's fascist opinions are not any worse compared to what Bossi and Fini have said in the past. That's not making a point for Haider, it's making a point against the Italian government.
Berlusconi is just corrupted right, but Jörg was never our Chancelor, Schüssel is. And he is, well, not worse than Berlusconi, so much for sure.
It's dead obvious that the sanctions against Austria were done because it was a small country, while nobody wants to mess with Italy. I can't see anything which has been done in Austria in the past few years which was close to being so scandalous and ruining the legal state as Berlusconi is diong right now.

Wernazuma III is offline Wernazuma III
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Aug 2000
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  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:46 Visit Wernazuma III's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by paiktis22
on that matter the EU should have started proceedings against the amazing concentration of media power berlusconi holds.

it would be prefectly legal too.


That would be something, but nobody does it. That's what I'm talking about.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 21:55 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Well to be 100% correct you'd have to ask roland or somebody familiar with EU law to know for sure if the cummunity competition rules can "attack" the media ownership nexus berlusconi has created.

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
Emperor
Zhonghuà Rénmín Gònghéguó
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 22:36
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Wernazuma. There are democratic ways to influence politics. Use them, instead of complaining.

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
Emperor
Zhonghuà Rénmín Gònghéguó
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 22:37
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I'm probably becoming a green voter, too, with the democratic socialists declining

Kassiopeia is offline Kassiopeia
Emperor
Jyväskylä, Finland
Jul 2001
time: 07:29
  Old Post 19-06-2003 23:24 Visit Kassiopeia's homepage!
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So basically Berlusconi admits he was guilty? I mean why else would he be so desperate for a protection of charges?

Wernazuma III is offline Wernazuma III
Emperor
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Aug 2000
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  Old Post 20-06-2003 02:46 Visit Wernazuma III's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Ecthelion
Wernazuma. There are democratic ways to influence politics. Use them, instead of complaining.


And what exactly tells you that I don't use "democratic ways to influence politics"?

kassiopeia: Berlusconi does not admit anything. He's a victim of a "jurisdiction gone wild", just like he had to streamline the RAI because there was this huge conspiracy against him by that left media

Kassiopeia is offline Kassiopeia
Emperor
Jyväskylä, Finland
Jul 2001
time: 07:29
  Old Post 20-06-2003 03:33 Visit Kassiopeia's homepage!
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quote:
kassiopeia: Berlusconi does not admit anything. He's a victim of a "jurisdiction gone wild", just like he had to streamline the RAI because there was this huge conspiracy against him by that left media


He might not be openly admitting anything, but not allowing the court system complete its due process stinks like dodging guilt to me.

Boris Godunov is offline Boris Godunov
King
Portland, OR
Aug 2001
time: 00:29
  Old Post 20-06-2003 04:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Ecthelion
Wernazuma. There are democratic ways to influence politics. Use them, instead of complaining.


Complaining is one of the most important aspects of democractically influencing politics.

As for why the EU doesn't crack down on Berlusconi for his shameless corruption, the answer is obvious: They don't want to set a precedent whereby their own corruption will be a target.

Ecthy is offline Ecthy
Emperor
Zhonghuà Rénmín Gònghéguó
Mar 2000
time: 06:29
  Old Post 20-06-2003 04:21
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Complaining is never a way to change thing. He could found and/or enter several Vereine and Verbände and thus affect the way things work

[/making fun of central European democratic ideals]

VetLegion is offline VetLegion
Prince

Sep 1999
time: 06:29
  Old Post 20-06-2003 04:35
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I agree with Wernezuma here. I think the way EU reacted to Haider was a shame (and the protestors against him in Wienna streets I hold even more pathetic..)

If you want to see what Berlusconi is all about, read Alan Ford. That is all I have to say on the matter.

Proteus_MST is offline Proteus_MST
Prince

Dec 2001
time: 06:29
  Old Post 20-06-2003 05:16
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But Berlusconi is using the democratic System to gain Immunity from justice, so what can you do?

There is one thing which wonders me more than Silvio Berlusconi abusing the System for his own Proft.
It is, that the Italians voted for Berlusconis Forza Italia. They should have known what they had to expect if Berlusconi is voted President (at least outside of Italy most people spspected what would come after Berlusconi would be elected and most people outside of Italy were very surprised, that he was really elected (after he lost his first election, where he was candidate)).

But maybe it only proves one thing which also Josef Goebbels knew:
The Importance to have full Control of the Public Media.

VetLegion is offline VetLegion
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Sep 1999
time: 06:29
  Old Post 20-06-2003 05:34
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They'll take care of Berlusconi.

Have faith

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