29-06-2003 02:54									#31
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I don't know -- they handled the speedy infiltration of Baghdad pretty handily.

	29-06-2003 05:25									#32
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once they were deployed, yes... but how many months does it take to get an armored division over seas?

They are working on lighter 'tanks' that can be airlifted, so an armored brigade can be anywhere in the wrold rdy to fight in somethn like 72 hours. I have my doubts on the effectiveness of 'lighter' armor tho.

	29-06-2003 13:01									#33
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I can't think of any tank guys who were killed- even in the cases above.

Except the guys who drove the tank into the river. They don't make good submarines.

Although maybe they could have underwater capability in the next generation of tanks

	29-06-2003 13:51									#34
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A tank that could run underwater for even 10-20 minutes could kick ass.

The ability to ford most rivers anywhere would be one helluva tactical advantage.

	29-06-2003 14:10									#35
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maybe the stryker could do it. It would be instantly destroyed on the other bank, though.

	29-06-2003 15:32									#36
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I'm not doing it.

	29-06-2003 15:44									#37
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Oh God no, someone, don't let this nightmare happen again

	29-06-2003 15:46									#38
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T-34 was posible snorkelize and do a little underwater operation with it.

	29-06-2003 16:44									#39
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quote: Originally posted by raghar T-34 was posible snorkelize and do a little underwater operation with it.

AFAIK the Russian MBTs in the 80s had also the ability to ford Rivers with Help of a Snorkel.
(of course it first had to be erected, before trying to move underwater)

	29-06-2003 17:04									#40
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Aparently the same applies to the Leopard 2:

quote: The Leopard 2 is able to ford water obstacles 1.20 m deep (wading) without any preparation, and to ford at a depth of 2.25 m (deep wading) with special preparation. About 15 minutes preparation is required to get the tank ready for crossing water obstacles at a depth of 4 ma (underwater driving), including the fitting of a special three-piece snorkel to the commander's cupola.

http://www.geocities.com/SiliconVal...s/3457/leo2.htm

	30-06-2003 00:55									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Cruddy An M1 confirmed kill by RPG. Couldn't be bothered to click start, could you? Well, there's this... For those who think that's a fluke, there's this...

hi ,

aint an rpg , ......

its from a milan , .....

have a nice day

	30-06-2003 00:58									#42
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could be, Panag, could be. a Mk 3, perhaps?

	30-06-2003 01:03									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel could be, Panag, could be. a Mk 3, perhaps?

hi ,

nope first batch , delivered ages ago , ......

there is a full set of pics taken from a camera conserning this particular incident that shows the milan fireing station , about two sec's later the milan gunner and his buddy are splattered to pieces a .50 , ......

have a nice day

	30-06-2003 01:05									#44
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That's just great, but I'll pass.

	30-06-2003 01:53									#45
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Could be a Kornet, fi the Iraqis had any...


But a RPG wouldn't do that to a Abrams.

	30-06-2003 02:15									#46
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One thing going for the RPG version is, that it seems, one the 1st pic, as HEAT external damage, while advanced missiles, AFAIK are mostly kinetic penetrator- armed.

	30-06-2003 02:16									#47
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what's a milan?

	30-06-2003 02:17									#48
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A French Made anti-tank missile. The Iraqis bought some in the 80's.

	30-06-2003 02:25									#49
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OKay, thanks GePap. Looks pretty mean.

http://military.future.easyspace.com/milan/

	30-06-2003 02:27									#50
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You sure it's french? Most European armies have it, and I thought it was a co-operation or something.

	30-06-2003 02:29									#51
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The page I read said it was Franco-German manufactured and that the British use them in their Army.

	30-06-2003 02:31									#52
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Not only the british, but the Spanish, the Italians, and most of europe, too. AFAIK, it's Europe's Primier ATGM.

	30-06-2003 03:46									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Proteus_MST AFAIK the Russian MBTs in the 80s had also the ability to ford Rivers with Help of a Snorkel. (of course it first had to be erected, before trying to move underwater)

Unfortunately for the crews this ability was as theoretic as the "DD" tanks ability to effectively deploy was at Normandy.

The Soviets did train for using this river crossing capability, but in order to cut down on training casualties they constructed a roadway on the bottom of a river (at their tank training area), used a special tank that was permanently assigned to this sort of duty rather than their issue vehicles, and used a special snorkel that allowed the crew to be recovered in case the tank broke down on the journey. You can bet that all of these modifications were made after casualties occurred. This seemed to be the scariest part of training for a majority of tankers.

	30-06-2003 03:55									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident I can't think of any tank guys who were killed- even in the cases above. Except the guys who drove the tank into the river. They don't make good submarines. Although maybe they could have underwater capability in the next generation of tanks

wait, what happened? someone drove an Abe into a river?

	30-06-2003 04:28									#55
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I think the driver was shot or something. The tank fell off a bridge into the water. The other 2 people died from drowning.

	30-06-2003 04:32									#56
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thats terrible... what a suck ass way to die... drowning in a DU coffin... You know if they have recovered the bodies? im sure they have, but just wondering

	30-06-2003 04:57									#57
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quote: Originally posted by panag hi , aint an rpg , it's from a milan

Ah, that explains it. Moral is, I shouldn't go quoting websites.

Mind you, Zylka's partly to blame - too lazy to click for himself.

	01-07-2003 23:29									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel One thing going for the RPG version is, that it seems, one the 1st pic, as HEAT external damage, while advanced missiles, AFAIK are mostly kinetic penetrator- armed.

hi ,

well the shooter was not aiming good or was not trained , .....

and btw , on the complete set of pics you can see that the entire engine block is damaged , .....

one of the wheels on the other side is blown clear and two more are bend away , .....

have a nice day

	01-07-2003 23:30									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker The page I read said it was Franco-German manufactured and that the British use them in their Army.

hi ,

so does Israel , Belgium , Luxembourg , half a dozen south american nations etc , .....

have a nice day

	01-07-2003 23:42									#60
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I don't think that we have Milans, panag.