28-06-2003 03:55									#1
	Science, Military and Diplomacy Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

There was talk on the PEACE diplomacy thread about a possible military tech, and then military unit build up. Corellion and my idea was to research Doc Flex ASAP, and then Nonlinear Math. Then build 1 or 2 impact foils to explore, threaten and maybe ever take a PEACE base or two, should it come to that.

We have a massive advantage in the early game, as we start with Applied Physics. This means if we research those two techs, we will be against a PEACE that has synthmetal tech, but probably still uses scouts to guard, and hasn't even got laser weapons against us. We are at peace with them, so could catch them by surprise. I would not normally advocate this, but our relations have deteriated, and I think we need a small build up like this just to push them a little. It isn't much out, as they are techs we would want soon anyway. Also, if we take a couple of bases, they will pay for themselves easily. This may sound strange, but when playtesting the CyCon, I found out when I started near a faction and went straight to war, I ended up being in the lead powerwise, when usually I am just behind for most of it until my terraforming and tech advantage comes in. IMHO using our early military advantage both to grow and techsteal is our only hope of winning, since the PUT will out builder us, and the Pirates our military if we let them get too many techs. Also this way gives us probe foils, and maybe an infiltator, which would help an awful lot.

In short, this will be lots of fun to play, in character with the Borg style of our faction (assimilation ) and gives us a realistic chance of winning. It is high risk however, so I do not advocate total war yet. But do you think we should research Doc Flex and Non Math ASAP, and build a probe foil and an impact foil or two? Just to be safe, and to threaten PEACE and any other faction. A consession of some Ec or a tech when we threaten, or a base if they disagree, could be great for us

	28-06-2003 04:00									#2
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BTW: PEACE relations thread where this was discussed here.

I voted yes. I think we need enough military to threaten and to help us grow and tech steal. It would be fun, and it would give us a chance against the PUT. If we take a few bases, we can outtech the PUT. Otherwise, they will win IMHO.

	28-06-2003 04:13									#3
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Not to spoil the fun, but wouldn't it be smart to know first where the enemy is before planning any military confrontation? I mean, it lasted 15 years before we made contact. Theoretically they could be up to 60 squares away from us. Until we have a clue of their position, I suggest we continue a peaceful build-up, meaning aiming for an SP, SocPsych and crawlers.

	28-06-2003 04:30									#4
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Maniac: I am not talking about confrontation. I am talking about being ready for the eventuality. They cannot be too far away, they would not have gone in a straight line to us, as they went a bit around the coast. However we need to be ready if they decide to attack, by probes as seems likely now, and I think having those techs is useful for lots, we can then have the ability to threaten and attack anyone. This Planet is not so big.

	28-06-2003 11:05									#5
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Once again, I find myself agreeing with Drogue. PEACE's obvious advantage of beginning with sea units and having only sea bases is a great one, and they will exploit it by striking us from the sea ASAP. I would not be surprised if they're already preparing an attack, and the diplomacy was just to distract us.

Even if we end up at peace, we need this protection, should they ever decide to turn on us.

If we get the Pact of Siblingship signed, the we can hold off on Nonlinear Mathematics for a while, but let's still get it soon. If they do sign the pact, then we have some leverage in getting Doc: Flex from them.

Last edited by Corellion on 28-06-2003 at 11:47

	28-06-2003 17:29									#6
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So what do you guys propose as our next three research goals?

	28-06-2003 21:10									#7
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If we get a Pact, I think we sould get Nonlinear Math and Doc Flex soon, but not worry too much about urgency. If we don't, then I suggest we get them ASAP. Next 3 techs, if the deal does through, Ind Base, Ind Econ and Ind Auto; if the deal does not go through, Doc Mob, Doc Flex and Non Math. That would be my idea. However I think the deal is much to our gain, and so I hope not to have to use this. I think we should file this as our all-purpose, multi-event, cure-all contingency plan... "Plan B"

	29-06-2003 03:42									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue if the deal does not go through, Doc Mob, Doc Flex and Non Math

You got Doc Mobility from the Pirates in exchange for Info Nets

G.

	29-06-2003 04:35									#9
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Googlie: We haven't RPed it yet, as we do not wish to tell the other factions that we have met PEACE yet. Also I think we will not need the military option, as we have a majority to trade regardless, and we have concessions anyway Therefore we will probably stay researching Biogen for the moment, to get the HGP, and will then discuss with them once a pact is signed as for next techs. We can offer them App Phys for Dox Flex, which they might like. And they will not give us Doc Flex without a Pact. They voted not to trade it to anyone without one, and so they wouldn't even consider it. I can understand that. We will get 2 techs instead of 1 anyway, as we will be trading a lot now IMHO, since Flubber and I were talking of specialising so that we get the core techs ASAP (like Ind Auto and Gene Splic), if we get a Pact. Therefore, since we have a Pact, my vote changes to a non-military option. We do not need Non Math immediatly being at peace, and so we should wait a little before we get it. We should make a beeline for Ind Auto and Gene Splic first IMHO.

	29-06-2003 04:36									#10
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And yes, we have Doc Mob (do you want me to remove what I wrote considering you have too ?)

	29-06-2003 04:45									#11
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Naw - your logic is good.

I removed mine 'cos I realized that I had "played ahead" in the 2117 turn - I always thought that when one elected to change research in-stream, that if you elected to again change it (same turn) to the original tech that it restored the 1/2 lab points deducted. That's been my experience in gaming and in scenario testing.

But when I did the turn again to look at the sliders' effect, (that was an afterthought to the first switch) upon changing back I wasn't given the option to return from Flex to Biogen.

Having then realized that this constituted 'playing ahead", I deleted the post (or at least edited it to inoccuousness)

Presumably only you read it, given the time it was up.

G.

	29-06-2003 04:54									#12
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Drogue since Flubber and I were talking of specialising so that we get the core techs ASAP (like Ind Auto and Gene Splic), if we get a Pact. We should make a beeline for Ind Auto and Gene Splice first IMHO.

Yes - they'll be hot for Ind Auto 'cos it's a prereq for Doc Initiative, which triggers their free faction bonus of a naval yard in every base (plus is the key to the MCC, which they'll want in order to get the +2 movement and also to deny another faction the free naval yards in every base - unless you jointly agree that the CyCon goes for it, to assure joint sea dominance)

G.

	29-06-2003 05:17									#13
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And we'll be hot because it gives crawlers With those puppies, let's see the PUT outtech us then! As Slowwhand once said, "Their ass is grass"

Flubber says they are more concerned with the Drones, as buster is a bigwig when it comes to PBEMs. Archaic may be good, but I have seen busters record, he is exceptional, although they said they were trying out playstyles. Together with PEACE, we may stand a chance, but we need to defeat both of these menaces. The Hive, though it is a great faction to play, should not prove too much of a menace IMHO, they feel behind early on, and their players are good, but I do not know of a seasoned PBEMer in their team.

	29-06-2003 07:02									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue The Hive, though it is a great faction to play, should not prove too much of a menace IMHO, they feel behind early on, and their players are good, but I do not know of a seasoned PBEMer in their team.

The only one I know is Jamski, formerly War of Art, formely JAMiAM, formerly ...... (he keeps forgetting his password when he cleans his harddrives)

He's one of the 2 ACOL players in all six games in the Forum Wars series (with Fistandantilus as the other) - they have been doing remarkably well in those contests

G.

	29-06-2003 07:09									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue as buster is a bigwig when it comes to PBEMs.

Yeah - he has taken me down in a couple, and while I'm not in the Misotu/big_Canuck/MoSe category, I'm no newbie either

But he was my pactmate in Faction Strife (as the Hive) but has succumbed to a joint Tau Ceti/big_Canuck attack leaving me on my own (I'm the Believers). Time is running out on me, but I do have a fleet of some 30 X-Chaos SAM Choppers that seem to be keeping the other 2 at bay for the present (they are the PKs and Morgan respectively) I need to go on the attack to utilize my fanatics bonus (but prolly on Buster's bases that the Axis have captured)

Anyway, I think Flubber's assessment is correct. Plus he has Shadowlord3, Mark13 and Mongoose (among others) to assist him, all seasoned veterans in PBEM play.

G.

	29-06-2003 07:20									#16
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Alright! Co-operative research all the way!

	29-06-2003 20:48									#17
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Jamksi is JAMiAM!?! Wow, I never knew this before...

	29-06-2003 22:35									#18
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http://apolyton.net/forums/member.p...nfo&userid=2246

This is JAMiAM's profile. He has a different timezone than Jamski. So I assume they are different persons.